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Ranking the best "student trumpets"...again.


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KingSilverSonic
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I concur that the King 600-601 models are really good, both as horns and for the value. I have bought and sold 3-4 of these horns after sending them through the shop. The Getzen 390 (300 series) is about the best you can get as a student horn, IMO. The following horns are not exactly "student horns" by definition, but would offer great value to students. These are the Jupiter trumpets and the Getzen Proteus. Both are very good players and both are found at very good prices.
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John Mock
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy Finn wrote:

I don't know when Kanstul stopped making horns for the Besson brand. That's not knowledge I'm privy to.


Crazy Finn--

If you followed and read the link in my last post, the Besson Loyalist website clearly states Kanstul stopped building the Besson 609 and related trumpets in 1998...that their contract was not renewed.

Respectfully submitted--

John
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AverageJoe
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another vote for the Yamaha 2335. The Jupiter 600L is also a fine horn, but I like the sound of the Yamaha better (warmer, broader).

I don't have any experience with the Kanstuls or Getzens (sadly, there aren't any dealers around here), nor have I tried the Jupiter 600MRL (rose brass bell/leadpipe).
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BobD
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I currently play a Kanstul made Besson 609. It's a great playing horn to get me on track for my 3rd comeback.

In a previous comeback I was trying to choose between a Getzen 700 and a Kanstul 700. I got this reply from Jason Harelson:

Quote:
I have owned and played many many many horns. I have owned and sold more than a dozen Kanstul 700's and I have had the chance to compare them to hundreds of other horns in that price range (and any price range). In my professional opinion, they are THE BEST HORN FOR THE MONEY. Period. I'm not a Kanstul dealer and these horns do not compete with my market. I have had several students play the Getzen 700 with great results, but the Kanstul is a much better horn. I'll tell you why... the Kanstul is built with a more open bell taper and leadpipe, which give you a bigger, but not huge, sound and range of color. The Getzen is a good horn, but sounds quite compact in comparison and a little bit brittle. Now Getzen DOES offer great horns that compare with the Kanstul 700, but their own Capri/700 models do not compare.

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crzytptman
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will concur with Harelson's statement. At the last NAMM show, I was hanging at the Kanstul space. Some fine trumpeters were working their way down the line, when I mentioned my favorite - that lacquered one down at the end. Every one of those players were very pleased with the response and sound of that horn. Yes, it was a KTR-700. All of Kanstul's trumpets are good, but there's something about that 700.
In my opinion:
Kanstul 700
Besson (Kanstul) 609 if you can find one
Getzen 300

Getzen does a pretty good job with the 300. When I have students that have a choice of renting Yamaha, Bach 300, or Getzen 300 I always insist on the Getzen. The others aren't in the same league. None of them are in the same league as Kanstul.

The Blessings I played at NAMM show were good too - American made. Of course, the tried and true Ambassador (pre 1970). Those old King's (601, 602) are really good too - .462 bore.
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Nos Mo King
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just came across an "Accent" trumpet TR 781. Nice horn, well built, good beginner - intermediate horn, IMO. First one I have seen and played, so am not sure about consistency, but this one is VG. My hunch is this horn line will be well built as a rule.

I like the Jupiter and Yamaha beginner models, too.


All the best,


rc
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qcm
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One other thing about Kanstuls - all of their trumpets, including the student horns, have one-piece bells.

To my knowledge, they are the only manufacturer that does that.

-Dave
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joe1joey
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Capt.Kirk wrote:
The Reynolds medalist has the same tubing and geometry from bell to leadpipe to slides and minor braces on the tuning slides as the Olds Ambassador. The Reynolds though has the high end bell to leadpipe bracing, nickel accents and water keys as the high end models from Olds. SO they have the blessing style water key saddles and the wing strut bracing seen on all the Pro-models from Olds.

So given the choice I would say that the Reynolds is a tad better both in cosmetics and playing then the Ambassador due in part to the bracing and nickel. People laughed at me when I said my first Reynolds Medalist sounded just like a Mendez model trumpet until a few people played it and then they agreed.

I have two of them one wears am Accusonic leadpipe one wears a OEM leadpipe. I have played around with them a lot and have tried now 25, 25-0,7,43 and Acccusonic leadpipe. I am getting ready to try one of my Calichio pipe on one as well. Why because I love experimenting.

If someone is after an Olds Recording sound on the cheap a Reynolds Medalist is the easiest way to go about it. Why??? You do not need to modify the bracing at all like you do on the Fullerton Ambassadors all you need to do is change the leadpipe.

The valve assembly is totaly different on the Renolds. The pistons are .001 smaller then the Olds valves and they use the Contempra Brass Valve guides and spring system not the Olds guide and spring system.

I like mine best with Bach 43 and 7 leadpipes in regular leadpipes but the 25-0 works decent too for those that like more secure feeling and resistance up front. The Accusonic is fantastic but pricey!! I think the 43 is best for those that want a brighter horn that can still do dark but the 7 pipe is better for those that want to add some darkness to the horn with out adding more brightness as well.

Kanstul can make main tuning slides in .462,.464, .468 and .470 I have been playing around with this some. I like the .470 it defines the slots better I think, open up the blow a lot and makes for a more solid core. I do not list bore changes as such on horns I am building if I think a .464 slide works best that is what goes on that horn.... I think people would do better asking how a horn blows then asking for bore sizes because the two do not always match!


Having played a large number of Ambassadors from the early LA to early Fullerton years, and a lesser, but substantial number of Medalists from their their 'made by Blessing' years prior to purchase by Olds in '64 (.470 bores)and post Olds, (.460)bores, I prefer the early Ambassadors above all. Granted they were smaller bore than the Blessings/also nice horns/ but they had the 'old style' guides, built as a piece and the best of them play with a resonance I didnt find in the TU-58's. It stands to reason I would have liked some of the frills offered ...such as the trigger on the later models of the Medalists, and the nickle silver tuning slides, but not a deal breaker for me. I collect both Reynolds and Olds horns and will say that the early Professional Reynolds trumpets and cornets hold their own against any Olds horn with the Contempora model, my favorite of the post war.
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zackh411
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found a Jupiter 600L used on Craigslist for about $50. It played reasonably well, actually; plus it gave me a good excuse to rip a few double C's in a Target parking lot lol...
I tell all my private students to go for used horns at first, and only bother buying new when they are ready for a pro horn, and even then, check used first. I found one of my students a really nice Back Stradivarius for $500; $100 worth of simple repairs and a cleanup and he had himself a pro horn for less than those student models cost brand new on wwbw.
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connicalman
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aye: jupiter 60x-series
nay: yamaha 233x-series

The build of the Jup is better. The Yam, not so much. At the intro level, from direct experience with several of both, that's my opinion. The J's parts don't break as often, the machining is cleaner, and the finish is better, too. I'm neither paid by J or hating on Y.

Then I hand my nephew, or any of 3 of my friends kids my $131.86 on-line auction Conn 77B from 1963. Game over. Just so they get another good lesson in quality I loan them a Coprion Director, and suggest that they look into the previously lauded American present-day builders.

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