King Liberty Model Trumpet in B??

tjdarst3 · New Member Joined: 14 Sep 2012 Posts: 2 Location: Houston

Hey all,

First time poster, and I have pouring over the following conundrum for a few day:

I was in a shop and came upon a horn that appealed to me.

Forgive me, but I cannot really figure out the photo posting feature (hope it works), but it appears to be the Liberty Model Bb Trumpet No. 1050,

I found a post on this forum about what appeared to be a trumpet in the key of B, and this one is landing on , tuner locked in at about 247Hz.

I notice there were HN White King trumpets in C with a manual rotor to tune the horn to Bb or A, and this one looks like it might be missing that apparatus.

serial number 36671 and on the bell it states "King Liberty Model, Made by The H.N. White Co. Cleve'd"

Just trying to see if I am indeed missing the rotor tuner, or if this is a bonafide trumpet in B (I doubt it)

I also humbly submit that I am not expert.

I'd appreciate any info you could give!

Thanks![img][/img]

nieuwguyski · Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:25 pm Post subject:

It's probably a "high pitch" horn. The catalog pages at:

http://www.hnwhite.com/Trumpet%20Page.htm

strongly suggest that King was making high-pitch instruments as late as the first Liberty models, as the catalog page ( http://www.hnwhite.com/King/Trumpet%20and%20Cornet%20page/1920%20King%20Catalog%20Page%204%20Liberty%20Trumpet.jpg ) notes that the 19.5" length is for the low-pitch model.
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J. Notso Nieuwguyski

tjdarst3 · New Member Joined: 14 Sep 2012 Posts: 2 Location: Houston

Thanks for the quick reply!

Forgive a euphoniumist (READ: caveman) turned trumpeter, but what is the point of the "high pitch" vs. "low pitch"? Does it just mean one's in B and the other Bb?

This new guy thanks you.

razeontherock · Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:21 pm Post subject:

jon_norstog · Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:28 pm Post subject:

The Liberty is a good horn. You need to pull out the slide. Most of the Kings I have had or played needed anywhere from 1/2" TO 3/4" of joint showing.

jn
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nieuwguyski · Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:47 pm Post subject:

The short version is that there were two different pitch standards in wide use 100 years ago -- "low pitch" (A 440) and "high pitch" (I've read A 452, but apparently Conn used A 457 for their high-pitch models). After WWI, a clause in the Treaty of Versailles declared A 440 to be the international standard, though high-pitch instruments continued to be made, in declining numbers, well into the '30s.

This is one of the major gotchas of buying vintage brasses. But since your King is designed as a Bb/A instrument, even if it's in high pitch you have plenty of slide length to get down to low-pitch Bb.
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J. Notso Nieuwguyski

Crazy Finn · Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:41 pm Post subject:

Check this somewhat recent thread about the King Liberty.

http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117134
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veery715 · Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 6:09 am Post subject:

You photo looks like it is all there. Maybe have someone else play it and see what they say. It is OK to extend the first section of the tuning slide to get the Bb. Usually there is a HP or LP engraved on the 2nd valve left side.
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veery715

Music is what feelings sound like.

razeontherock · Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:51 am Post subject:

stevericks · Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 3:37 pm Post subject:

Look carefully on the second and third slide, as well as the tuning slide. you will likely find a mark on each where you can lower the pitch of the instrument by 1/2 step. The horn was likely built as a Bb with potential for changing to A by pulling out the slides to the mark. I have a 1938 and 1950 Liberty 2B) and both have the marks.

The older is very heavy metal. Perfect for my style of playing, heavier, darker. The newer is a super good lead horn. problem is I bought the 1950, which is in better shape, thinking it was going to be like the 1938 and it isn't. Oh well.

at any rate enjoy the horn.
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Steve
Olds, Kanstul, Bach