Bach 197 NY 7

DLA · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 2:41 pm Post subject: Bach 197 NY 7

As you can see from my horn listing below, I play an Edwards Gen II as my main Bb trumpet (about 15 years now). I've thought of going to a lighter horn with quicker response. I'm 56 years of age and I'd prefer playing shows, quintets, orchestras/bands, jazz etc. on a lighter horn to ease my efforts while remaining musically satisfied.

This week a Bach 197 New York & was given to me by a friend to test drive. I've only played it for about 3 hours so far but I'm very impressed. The intonation seems excellent and the horn is full of life and energy. Going from my heavy/dark Gen II to this perky/bright lightweight Bach is quite a transformation. I'd really appreciate feedback from others that played or are currently playing the Bach 197 NY7 trumpet.
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Bach NY7 (180S77) Bb
Bach Strad C
Schilke E3L Eb/D
Yamaha Custom Pic
Holton Flugel F-100
Xeno 8620 Yamaha Eb Sop. Cornet

RandyTX · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 2:44 pm Post subject:

There are several threads on this horn already, with a lot of commentary and play reviews. Any good search engine (i.e. not the one built into this site) can find them.

LittleRusty · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:58 pm Post subject:

richardwy · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:22 pm Post subject:

Will look forward to this thread. I recollect some of the past threads. My take reading them was the owners liked their NY7 very much.
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1972 Selmer Radial

C.E.Divine · Veteran Member Joined: 30 Jan 2013 Posts: 285

For future reference, the NY197 was a limited run. Due to demand for production to continue, Bach made the exact same horn as a regular production model, the LT180S77. You will have an easier time finding one of these rather than the limited run of 197's. Exact same horn minus the gold plate. And they are FANTASTIC. If you want to try another lighter horn, check out the Maricahi. Both are extremely lively, but at the same time totally different animals. You owe it to yourself to try both before buying one. They are definitely the two best regular production horns Bach makes in my opinion. I had both and then sold the LT180S77 due to not being able to afford to keep two horns. I would have kept both if I could.
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Corey Divine

Bach LR19043B B-flat
Blackburn converted Bach C
Kanstul CC920 Piccolo
Blessing XL Flugelhorn
J.W. York and Sons Perfec-Tone B-flat/A Cornet

razeontherock · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 8:41 pm Post subject:

So which one is solid silver? And which parts are solid silver? Or did you mean the finish is all silver, with no gold?

I agree that all the NY 7's I've played have been wonderful. I got to try a batch of about 4, and just this week I was at the same store and saw they have at least one of them still there. There was no way to pick the "worst" of the 4, which is a highly unusual thing for me to say. (Of any horn, not just Bach)

C.E.Divine · Veteran Member Joined: 30 Jan 2013 Posts: 285

I was accidentally ambiguous...the 197 has gold plated trim and slides, while the NY7 (LT180S77) is straight silver plate. NOT solid silver, sorry if I sounded like I meant that the horn has solid sterling silver.
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Corey Divine

Bach LR19043B B-flat
Blackburn converted Bach C
Kanstul CC920 Piccolo
Blessing XL Flugelhorn
J.W. York and Sons Perfec-Tone B-flat/A Cornet

shofarguy · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 9:38 pm Post subject:

The 180S/77 is easily my favorite Bach. It is one of just three horns I'd consider if not for the one I play.
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Brian A. Douglas

Flip Oakes Wild Thing Bb Trumpet in copper
Flip Oakes Wild Thing Flugelhorn in copper

There is one reason that I practice: to be ready at the downbeat when the final trumpet sounds.

delano · Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 9:42 pm Post subject:

As far as I know the limited edition NY7 has a 0.459 bore, the later LT18077 NY 7 a 0.462 bore. So calling them exactly the same but for the trim is a little bit rough.

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:26 am Post subject:

My 2007 or 2008 (i do not remember exactly) NY 197 7/7 was a 462 bore.

In this early topic on the 7/7 it was confirmed.

http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=82116&highlight=bach+197
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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass

delano · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 2:54 am Post subject:

From the Bach-loyalist, the lim edition, I marked the bore:

197(circa 2008) Conn-Selmer has introduced a special edition Vincent Bach trumpet that skillfully combines historically significant qualities with modern day performance features. The Bach Stradivarius New York #7 Trumpet is available in limited quantities and features a Vincent Bach #7 bell, made popular during the early 1930′s.The Bach #7 bell, developed by Vincent Bach during the 1920′s, first appeared in 1929. This bell is constructed in one piece from lightweight yellow brass, with the current version featuring a classic French-bead flat rim. The instrument also features a 0.459″ bore, #7 lead pipe, vintage ’30′s style mouthpiece receiver, first and third finger rings, single brace tuning slides, third valve stop assemble, and semi-precious finger buttons. The instrument is finished in bright silver plate with gold plate slides and trim. The outfit includes a specially marked double case and includes a Certificate of Authenticity.

And the later not limited edition:

http://www.bachbrass.com/instruments/product.php?model=LT180S77&category=Trumpets

Did I do something wrong?

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:57 am Post subject:

It seems that there was a confusion on the bore at the beginning, but several owners of the early model had confirmed the 462 bore (mine was the early model with gold trims : 462 bore)

Is the info on the Bach Loyalist true ?
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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:59 am Post subject:

Perhaps some owner(s) of early one(s) can say us what is the bore of their horn ?
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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass

interfx · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 4:20 am Post subject:

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 4:51 am Post subject:

Look at the response of tsakow in this thread in 2006 :

http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43734&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=bach+197+462&start=20

So it seems that this bore determination problem concern the early ones.
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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass

nicklambo700 · Regular Member Joined: 17 Dec 2013 Posts: 93

There's one for sale in the market place claiming to have a 0.459" bore. However the owner decided to silver plate all of the gold slides and trim. And also changed the finger buttons :/
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Yamaha YTR-83 (prototype 62/77)
Warburton 3M/5

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 9:08 am Post subject:

It's a shame there is no pic of the other side of the valve block of the one in the market place, on an other add for a 197 (newer model) a L is clearly stamped on the block as it was on mine (2008 i think).

Were they 2 models ? ML and L or they switch definitely from ML to L a some point (before 2008) ?
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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 9:37 am Post subject:

2005 : 462 : http://www.centexbrass.com/listings/Bach197-0413.php
2007 : 462 : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Make-Offer-USED-Bach-Stradivarius-NY7-Trumpet-Model-197-/261456903951
2008 : 462 : http://www.trompetenforum.de/TF/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=12856

It would be cool to find pics of a ML one, i'm unable to find one on the Web.

What is the first year of fabrication of the 197 ?
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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass

googanelli · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 12:10 pm Post subject:

I bought one of these horns when they first came out. I LOVED how it played and sounded but the large bore was a bit too much for me. I'd like to find a medium large version of this horn.

JOe
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I play the same chords over and over.....from a train.

fredo · Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 12:16 pm Post subject:

The same for me : too open as a Calicchio 3/9 or a 993 ... but beautiful sound and open and "in place" upper register, i would like to try a ML one ...

The 3/7 has solved all my problems ! light, big and fat sound, the resistance i like with a tighter venturi and a big bell (and a 25 throat and medium bb...)

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Frederic FELTZ
Yamaha XENO 2 8335 S
Lotus 3L brass