3C vs 1 1/2 C

[DNMH]

I do pretty well with a Bach 3C. The 7C is too sharp for me and burns my lip. The 5C gives a leaden tonality. Please tell me what I might realize from a 1 1/2 C. Thanks

[etc-etc]

More depth in sound, but less higher harmonics. May be more tiring to play above the staff. In the end, it all depends on how much lip incursion into the cup do you allow.

[JLoyalist]

The 1-1/2C is a slightly larger mouthpiece. Bit of a deeper cup. Makes for a warmer sound.

I find the rim on the 3C to be more comfortable, but that's just me.

My advice? Keep the 3C you play on now, and get to work in the practice room.

Hope this helps

[McVouty]

I use both on a regular basis, the 1 1/2 C for orchestra (have a gig tonight on 1st trumpet playing film music) and 3C for big band. The 3C is marginally better for comfort and endurance and has a 'sparkly sound' when pushed, but the 1 1/2C has the right depth of tone to my ear for an orchestra especially when playing loudly and the slightly more rounded rim helps me with flexibility and cleanliness of attack. The downside is that my endurance isn't quite as good on the 1 1/2C - especially in a programme like we are playing tonight with Superman, Raiders, Big country and a few other big brassy numbers. Luckily we have a 3 hour rehearsal before hand so I'll be almost warmed up by the time we start

Like all things in mouthpiece choice there is a compromise somewhere, but the fundamentals don't change whatever you play on I'm afraid

[stanton]

The 3C is a decent middle of the road mouthpiece. It is neither symphonic nor jazz. Medium depth, medium bite, medium rim diameter.

The 3C may be your rim, but not be the sound you're looking for. If you're playing mainly big band, jazz, musical theater I'd say just look to practice and play more efficiently. If you're looking for a bigger, warmer sound, then a deeper mouthpiece may be the solution.

I play a "hybrid" mouthpiece for the most part. I had a custom mouthpiece made from a Schilke Symphonic M3 rim on top of a MOUNT VERNON 1 1/2C underpart. I have a screw in backbore, and though currently use a 10 backbore (standard) I also have a #7 which is more open but takes more work.

I originally bought a M3 mouthpiece and liked it, but I wasn't getting the depth and warmth I wanted. I had previously played a MV 1 1/2C but the rim wasn't ideal for the chop issues I was dealing with. Blending them was the perfect answer.

I'm not sure where you are with your development, and assume you are a student. So, it's best to let a professional guide you as to what you should be working with.

Good luck!
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[oliver king]

You may want to take a look at Stork Custom/Vacchiano pieces.

[John Mohan]

I practiced through my major development years and then played professionally on a 1-1/2C for years. Even when I needed a shallower, brighter mouthpiece, I went to Joe Marcinkiewicz and had him make a custom, slightly shallower version of a 1-1/2C for me. Whenever my playing required hours a day (and that was most of the time from 1982 onward), I always dealt with lip discomfort issues. I always thought that was a result of all the playing. But finally, in 2002 I switched to mouthpieces with wider, more comfortable rims such as the Reeves 43C for commercial playing, a couple of screw-rim Bachs with Mt Vernon 1 rims (nice and wide) and various underparts for Orchestra, and even a Mt Vernon 3C (again, nice, comfortable rim) for general playing. I wish I had made the switch 20 years sooner!

The 1-1/2C has a fairly narrow rim with a sharper inner edge than the 3C with its wider rim and softer inner edge. I suggest you stay with your 3C. If you need a darker sound, buy a 3B. Its rim size and shape is virtually identical to the 3C so the feel will be very similar and you'll get a nice deep, warm sound from it. Likewise, if you want an even darker sound, get a straight Bach 3.

Best wishes,

John Mohan
Webcam lessons available - click on the e-mail button if interested
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[roynj]

[cheiden]

When I transitioned from a 3C to a 1.5C I loved the sound but had endurance issues that didn't seem to be getting better. Since my vintage 3C was on the small side I decided to have it's rim threaded on the preferred 1.5C underpart by Reeves. It's been my go-to piece for many years since.

Since it was mentioned in a previous post, I'm just now experimenting with a Schilke M3 and though it feels smaller it's very playable to my 3C acclimated lips (Oddly, It doesn't seem to fit my Bach receiver very well so sleeves are probably in order). And by way of comparison The 3C plays very well but the sound isn't as full as I'd like. The 1.5 seems much bigger and fuller. The M3 seems like a much stronger tone and louder which I attribute to the symphonic backbore and bigger drill.
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Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart

[stanton]

[Gordontrek]

I never liked the 3C, thought the sound was too "basic." I also don't like the 7C. For some reason it just doesn't work with me. It sounds good but I find that it feels stuffy.
The 1.5C is a great mouthpiece, though it can be an endurance killer. I use it for orchestral and chamber playing. It sounds great, nice rich and warm. But that's only what I think of it. You might play on it and hate it.
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[jungledoc]

[BraeGrimes]

I think you should investigate the sizes between and beyond - no rhyme or reason as to how it affects your overall sound. Most underrated mouthpiece on the market is a Bach 2C. Give it a go.

BG

[jadickson]

Consider the Curry 1.5c. I find the Bach 1.5 exhausting to play, but the Curry fits very well.

[MacMichael]

A Curry 2 night be a good in-between option.

My Curry 2BC feels really good, a full sound, but no too big.

EDIT: Okay, that is a different cup compared to the regular C cup of course.

[JMWTpt]

The 2C is very different than the 3C and 1-1/2C mouthpieces in that it has a lower Alpha angle (steeper cup near the rim) and is nearly as deep as a 1C. To me, the 1-1/2C is an enlarged 3C, and not by much. I have played all three of these made by Bach and Curry, and I don't find any substantial advantage to the 3C nor do I like the sound of the Bach 3C (for me). The 2C seems to do well in churches and orchestra. BTW, the 2 is very different than the 2C. I prefer the Curry 2C version to the Bach. At present, I generally play a Curry 1-1/2C and a Curry 2C where the darker sound applies.

A little more than a year ago I posted the question "Why isn't the Bach 2C size more popular" and several posts were very informative. You may want to look there.

John

[zaferis]

I've had a similar experience.. love the 1 1/2 C for classical work - big sound and clear attacks though endurance is an issue, and it's real hard to make the sound sizzle in more commercial work. The 3C a comfortable rim and a more versatile sound (played a 3C setup for many years in USAF bands). I did at one point try a Bach 2C and found the rim too sharp (a different feel from the other 2).

I have moved to a Curry 3 series, I'm more happy with the overall sound and playability. For me, Curry 3's feel a bit bigger than a Bach 3 - I don't have the specs at hand, but I think it's not necessarily the size but the shape of the rim. Regardless, I'm very happy with my curry mouthpieces - easily the most consistent setup I've ever used-wish I had found them earlier.
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[kristiner]

Aside from the deeper cup, part of the reason I think the 1.5C offers more warmth and depth to the tone is that extra bite on the inside rim and the roll-off toward the outside that helps to encourage a little pucker in the chops. This is my experience, at least - feels like I can keep my aperture together with less effort on a good 1.5C, whereas the flatter rim of the 3C is more comfortable but (for some) it can tend to spread out the embouchure, eventually leading to an airy, thin sound with less accuracy. Every time I experiment with a 3C-type piece, after a few months I end up back on a 1.5C of some sort.

But as others have pointed out, the sharp bite on a typical modern Bach 1 1/2C is an endurance killer. Maybe find a vintage one (pre-80s), or look at the new Artisan version. I've been getting along very well with Curry's 1.5 series, based on the older Bach design that has a bit more of a cushion and just enough bite. A Curry 1.5C has a nice full, deep sound for most jazz or classical things, and the 1.5M will blow a lot like a typical 3C if you need more zip or brightness. Great combo.
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[DaveH]

I tried a 2C before - yes, it is, IMO, an unusual mouthpiece and nothing at all like a 3C or any of the #1 series mouthpieces - it is not something simply in between a 3C and a 1 1/2C.

As far as Bach mouthpieces go, the alpha angle is among the lowest of all Bach mouthpieces, making it very difficult or impossible for many, many players to play effectively. I could not use it.

[MacMichael]