What's up with high horn and low horn?

[Brass_Of_All_Trades]

I've been reading some stuff about french horn recently and noticed the topic of high horn and low horn was a recurring theme. Apparently, horn players specialize in either high horn (odd numbered parts) or low horn (even numbered parts).

Anyone know what's the deal with that? Why don't they just master the full range of the instrument like trumpet and low brass players do?

[Nonsense Eliminator]

First, the horn is a tremendously inefficient piece of equipment. On one hand it plays to the top of the treble clef (concert pitch) on tubing as long as an F tuba; on the other it plays well below the bass clef on a mouthpiece rim scarcely bigger than a trumpet's. And most of the time they play in a part of the harmonic series where the notes are awfully close together. So we should cut them some slack.

Second, the range of the horn is, depending on how you want to define things, about an octave wider than the range of the trumpet. So splitting that range up isn't entirely unreasonable. Unlike trumpet players, it's pretty standard for horn players to have a break or shift in their register somewhere, and where that break is seems to influence which register works the best.

Third, for a long time horn parts were very consistently written with the assumption that the player would specialize exclusively in one register or the other, so players had little incentive to worry about deficiencies outside their traditional roles. It's also worth noting that this division of labour began at a time when the horn was even more unwieldy than it is now -- today virtually all horn players use double horns if not descant or triple horns, as compared to the valveless horns (in a variety of keys all the way down to B-flat basso) that were in use when the idea of specialization arose.

Finally, the fact is that trumpet and trombone players do tend to specialize in certain registers to some extent, and modern horn players are much less likely to be one-trick ponies than the textbooks would have you believe. As well, when you play in a certain register week after week, your playing tends to adapt -- and why wouldn't you let it if that's all you do?

Yes, first trumpet players have to be able to play low F#. But most of them are happier not to have to, say, play that note pianissimo after a hundred bars of rest. Likewise, it isn't hard to find bass trombonists who struggle with the upper register. It was once the case that low horn players could often not be trusted to even play high C, and there was a very famous first horn player who didn't play the last note in the solo from Till Eulenspiegel. But that really isn't how things work today. While most horn players are stronger in either the upper or lower register, good ones are at least competent throughout the whole compass of the instrument.
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Richard Sandals
NBO

[Don Herman rev2]

+1000.

And, what do you define as the full range of trumpet, and what percentage of players have mastered it? Relative to French horn, that's about pedal C to double C...

I have immense respect for French horn players.
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"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley

[Brass_Of_All_Trades]

[James B. Quick]

[Nonsense Eliminator]

Another factor that occurs to me is that the extreme lower register of the horn is a LOT more difficult than playing a low F# on the trumpet. Within a couple of years pretty much every trumpet player can at list produce that note, but the lower end of the horn extends at least an octave (notated) below that. Even generating those notes is not a trivial feat, and truly mastering he extreme low register requires a great deal of effort. So there's actually a positive skill to master in being a low horn player -- it's not just matter of not playing high notes.
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Richard Sandals
NBO

[Crazy Finn]

[Brass_Of_All_Trades]

I understand how incredibly wide the horn's range is but from a more lucrative point of view doesn't specialization limit a musicians ability to get gigs and make a living?

Ideally, when a trumpet player finishes music school they should have the skills to play any part from 1st to 4th and even the occasional 5th and 6th parts. By specializing in high horn and low horn doesn't that basically cut their number of employment opportunities in half?

[Nonsense Eliminator]

[palomorado]

Hey guys...French Horn player here!!!

Everything that was said above is true but there are a few other things in the whole 1/3 2/4 high-low thing.

First of all French Horn players of both High & low parts are expected to have the full 4+ Octaves of the horn mastered. I've never been in a section when someone couldn't play from the Pedal C below the Bass clef to the High C two ledger lines above treble. We all can do it and it's a bitch learning it!

Now where the whole High/Low thing really comes into play is this:

Before the advent of valves horns played "natural" and substituted different crooks for different keys. This made it particularly difficult to play melodies due to the fact that you just don't have all of the notes available.
So to combat this they simply split the lines between two players.

So the top line would be played by the two players playing different horns in different keys. For instance in the key of C Minor the 1st (high) player would be playing a "Horn in C" and the 2nd (low) player would be playing a "Horn in Eb". This would give the "top line" all of the notes needed to play melodies and parts in that key. So it's kind of a misnomer because many times the low (2nd) player is actually HIGHER than the 1st player simply because they are playing a horn that ACTUALLY HAS THOSE PITCHES.

And of course they would then do the same thing for the 2nd melodic line with the 3/4 players. This part is usually lower than the 1/2.

So this set-up has been adopted from before the valve system.

We horn players always think of the chairs in pairs 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, etc...because you are working with the other player on one part split between two people.

Does that help?

[razeontherock]

I'll never forget the audition of the 1st chair fr horn player one year at regionals. (H.S.) When she found out what scale she had to play she asked "4 octaves or 5?" The judge said 5. She nailed it. In tune, under control, in time, and in one breath no less ...

[Don Herman rev2]

palomorado: Thank you for chiming in! Very clear and very helpful.
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"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley

[Craig Swartz]

If the OP is referring to the way the parts are arranged, it should be pointed out that R. Strauss and Mahler (among others) did almost the same when writing for 4 (or more) trumpets.

[tommy t.]

[jungledoc]

I happened to watch part of this just this morning. It's a sort of nerdy discussion between 3 low-horn specialists.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDB_rLD1I9E#t=3838

This is a program that's done as a live stream with audiance members asking questions by twitter, but preserved as a YouTube video. She has one or 2 guests, either live with her in the studio, or joining by video link. She sometimes features players of other brass instruments. Tine Helseth was a recent guest.
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Andy

I'll admit it. It's a TR300, but it wants to be a Strad when it grows up.

[palomorado]

Sarah Willis is an absolute monster player!!!

She is the 2nd horn for Berlin and that horn section is amazing. She's been doing the horn show for a while now and doesn't just keep it to low horn playing. Very good stuff for all brass players!

[Brass_Of_All_Trades]

[Nonsense Eliminator]