High Register fallacies

[Conn Collector]

Some High Register fallacies about how to get beyond your present High Note limit:

"Play louder"
Wrong

"Use more air"
Wrong

"Use more mouthpiece pressure"
Wrong

"Just practice more"
Wrong

If you play louder and with more air, you will just blow the embouchure aperture open and cause the embouchure to collapse.
Playing in the upper register requires less air than playing in the lower register.
Play very softly with little air to gently go beyong your present limit.
Later you can gradually increase the loudness of those tiny high notes as your embouchure strengthens.
Play octaves in which your present limit is in the middle of the octave, so that your embouchure will be encouraged to recognize the track to follow in going beying that present limit.

Using more mouthpiece pressure will distort your embouchure and prevent proper embouchure formation.

You can practice till your butt falls off and it will not increase your range even one note if you are using a bad embouchure.
And if you have been using a bad embouchure for many years,
then a good embouchure will feel very wrong until you get used to it.
What embouchure is correct?
The one you were born with, which varies from individual to indiviual.
See the Reinhardt forum for details in identifying your particular embouchure type.

I am so weak that I can barely hold up my cornet.
My lung capacity is extremely low due to bad heart and calcification-fused ribcage.
Yet with weak muscles and little air,
I play 3-octave scales very softly from Low C to Double C every day.
So more air and louder and more mouthpiece pressure and thousands of hours of practice are not the answer to increasing your range.

Many professional players have been quoted as saying the same thing that I am saying,
but so many people will not listen.
_________________
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Maynard playing "Ole"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUinAhSpCdU

Morris playing "Conn 9a - Double C"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-nqb-BOftg&feature=youtu.be

“Jesus gives eternal life”

[gstump]

Good stuff, thanks. And............Holy crap, it has been a while since I heard Ole. What control in all dynamic and octave ranges!!!!!!
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Schilke B5
Couesnon Flug (1967)
Funk Brothers Horn Section/Caruso Student

[rufflicks]

You are so correct but will you be heard.

Best,

Jon
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http://www.youtube.com/user/Rufftips

Remember this is supposed to be fun.

[Conn Collector]

If a no-talent senior-citizen amateur like myself can learn to play Double C's, then anybody can.

But there are also a million things more important in life than playing trumpet,
so keep everything in perspective.

.

.
_________________
.
Maynard playing "Ole"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUinAhSpCdU

Morris playing "Conn 9a - Double C"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-nqb-BOftg&feature=youtu.be

“Jesus gives eternal life”

[returningplayer]

A great big YES to everything in this thread thus far!!!

[x9ret]

I agree.
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[razeontherock]

[Joshua Jern]

I completely agree! And you're right- this information has always been out there, but is not often listened to. There are no secrets to it. You just have to actually do what the people who know what they're talking about say to do.
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[pahe01]

That is true!
Playing softly and use the air....

[kenhafer]

Very true. It's about a combination of mouthpiece, leadpipe, and well-developed skills and control of the instrument.

[John Mohan]

[mahorst]

Thanks - continue to remind myself of this all the time. Always a process of continual learning, correction and adjustment.
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Yamaha YTR 6445H C
Carol Brass CPC7775F-YLS Piccolo
Carol Brass CFL-6200-GSS-Bb-SL Flugelhorn

[tptguy]

Good stuff by OP to get players to open their minds - and ears. By now, nearly all players realize that moderate to high lip pressure - the octave key - is only a crutch for an under developed, poorly guided embouchure. Unfortunately, fewer players realize that blowing hard is merely the flip slide of the same coin! Efficient pitch change is executed by correct development of tongue, lips, and face alone. Even average musical ears, with just a pinch of critical listening, will readily hear the glaring differences between a properly guided embouchure and an overblown one.

In performance, of course, do whatever you must. But every overblown upper register effect has detrimental effects beyond its lack of musicality. As OP pointed out, every time you overblow you drive drive your lips forward into the cup. Hence, the more quickly they bottom out. Every time you splat out an overblown high note you germinate an increasingly handicapped embouchure. This is why so many trumpeters get worse with increased practice .

In addition to the obvious increase in volume, I suggest watching for any of 3 additional signs to readily identify overblowing. Any of these three will prohibit advanced development:

1. The body girds itself to blow hard as it prepares to raise pitch
2. The sound spreads, the timbre dulls, and pitch center falters as the pitch rises. Most important!
3. And invariably, there is an inability to play extra shallow mouthpieces. The harder you blow the lips forward the sooner they bottom out (End of endurance = bottoming out; they are the same thing). Note - this is only about what you can practice on, not what you choose to perform on.

My entirely personal suggestion (after 3+ decades of 'advanced' instruction from well intentioned yet misguided chop docs): be wary of teachers who use 'blow harder' as part of their instruction. It may provide a small, short term spike in rough pitch. But in-tune, focused, and musical upper range will always be compromised. Don't just believe me. Use your ears, without preconception or prejudice, to throw out everyone that plays with varied timbres per register, an unfocused core, and slippery pitch. And if I can be so bold, be toughest on the pros. Nothing in the union manual says ears come first.

[bach_again]

[dixieplayer]

What tptguy said.
Been there
Done all of that
Working very hard not to do it anymore
_________________
Anything is easy when you know how
John

[etc-etc]

Great words of wisdom from tptguy!

I did not get the last two sentences though. "And if I can be so bold, be toughest on the pros. Nothing in the union manual says ears come first."

Do you mean that pros do not necessarily have the best ears?

[tptguy]

Oops! Meant to say, "Nothing in the union manual says ears [can't] come first."

Thanks for the catch.

[rebus9]

All good information. Still struggling on my own range building. Had a couple times now where I can lip-slur 3, 4, even 5 notes past my "normal" upper limit, with almost no extra effort. The notes just... came out like magic.

But... after extremely careful attention to "how" I was doing it, I can't seem to repeat those successes. On those rare charmed days, I focus intently (not obsessively, but scientifically and thoughtfully) on:

* embouchure setup (mouthpice set any higher or lower than usual)
* how I warmed up
* how much lip is in the cup
* breathing style
* source of air (low in the belly, higher in chest, etc)
* depth of breath
* how open and relaxed the throat
* how much airflow
* volume (loudness)
* horn angle
* how firm/relaxed the corners and center
* how much mouthpiece pressure
* tongue position
* last time I played (how many hours or days of rest)
* what I played or practiced during the past 1, 2, and 3 days
* whether I shaved that day, and if not, how much stubble

And you know what? I can't find anything I'm doing differently from my regular setup. One day the upper register comes out like a dream, and the next 59 days it doesn't come out at all.

But the one thing I DID notice....

On those rare charmed days, my chops feel like fresh sponge cake, almost like 2 springs. Squeeze gently and the upper register soars. But usually they feel more like uncooked steak. Fresh and pliable but more "dense meaty", not spongy or springy at all. When I mimic the exact same gentle squeeze as on the charmed days, the buzz just collapses.

I'm am so utterly frustrated.....

_

[x9ret]

The hardest thing is re-programming yourself to accept the truths in the opening post. Getting out of bad habits is difficult, really difficult, especially if you've been doing it wrong for years.

It's not just changing approach for the notes at the upper limit of your range but also for the notes leading up to them.
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[TMPT]

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