Pedal C

chapahi · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 3:04 am Post subject: Pedal C

The pedal C is a slippery note for me. First it's a low Bb then I lip it up. I can lose it and have to find it again especially if I move on the other areas of practice.
Lately I've taken a new policy towards pedal C and below in that I seek to always have it there whatever I'm doing. I go back to check periodically to make sure that the embouchure I'm using can lock in on a good pedal C from anywhere. My idea is to strengthen it from that perpective. The last few years I've been honing my embouchure with the whisper G, somewhat like the Cat Anderson excersise.
A question for high note guys: Do you approach pedals this way? Is the pedal C always there from where-ever you're playing of doing? Are there some high notes guys who never do pedals?
Thanks in advance for any replies.
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Seymor B Fudd · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 3:50 am Post subject: Re: Pedal C

danny45635 · Heavyweight Member Joined: 01 Feb 2015 Posts: 508

I feel like I have more ease in the upper register when I don't play pedals. That's just me though.
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John Mohan · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:33 am Post subject:

The pedal notes, including Pedal C should be practiced correctly or left completely alone. Trying to force a Pedal C into tune is not practicing it correctly. Due to the physics involved, a Pedal C on a Bb trumpet or for that matter, a tenor trombone lies about a step to a step and a half flat. Let it be flat (pardon the pun!) with a nice full sound.

Note that a Pedal C will slot right in tune on a Flügelhorn, French Horn, Bass Trombone or Tuba. It has to do with the difference in the diameter of the beginning of the tubing compared to the diameter in the final area of the tubing (the bell flare area) of a brass instrument - the diameter in the area of the bell is not large enough on a Bb trumpet for the node to hit in the correct place.

Used correctly, pedal notes do wonderful things. Over time they correct embouchure deficiencies, they help one attain more command over the instrument, and when doing them as directed in Claude Gordon's Systematic Approach book, where one is instructed to hold the last pedal note of each arpeggio exercise as long as possible with an attempted crescendo as one runs out of air to really work the blowing muscles, they develop tremendous air power, and perhaps even more important, they help the student learn the knack of how to blow with full force (as the air runs out) all the while maintaining complete relaxation in the throat and back of the tongue area. This helps prevent the problem so many players have with choking off the sound by straining as they try to play the upper register.

Best wishes,

John Mohan
Skype Lessons Available - Click on the e-mail button below if interested
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solo soprano · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 1:26 pm Post subject:

John Mohan, on a B flat flugelhorn can you play the first Pedal register? I can play all the Pedal tones on trumpet down to triple Pedal C, no problem. But on flugel I've never been able to play the first Pedal register ie. the F below low C (Pedal F) down thru Pedal D flat before Pedal C. I can get them out, but I really have to lean into them to force them out. Why? Ideas anyone?
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danny45635 · Heavyweight Member Joined: 01 Feb 2015 Posts: 508

solo soprano · Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2016 5:50 pm Post subject:

Seymor B Fudd · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 12:20 am Post subject: Re: Pedal C

Jazztoys · New Member Joined: 05 Apr 2016 Posts: 6

kenhafer · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 12:13 pm Post subject:

John Mohan · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:07 pm Post subject:

John Mohan · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:09 pm Post subject:

solo soprano · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:58 pm Post subject:

Paladin53 · Regular Member Joined: 27 Sep 2015 Posts: 34

Good information. Thank you John Mohan for your thoughts and solo soprano for sharing that information from Bill Knevitt.

When I play down from pedal F toward pedal C, my fullest tone seems to drop to G, more than a step or step and a half below pedal C. I can bend it sharper, but it wants to pop out around G.
Does that seem normal?

solo soprano · Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:58 pm Post subject:

nieuwguyski · Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:39 am Post subject:

chapahi · Posted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 4:30 am Post subject:

jtrumpet13 · New Member Joined: 13 Apr 2016 Posts: 5

I've noticed that while practicing the pedal notes in the Stamp book, I have had success getting up into the " high register " consistently. If you do them correctly and try to get a consistent sound from low register to pedal register, you will find that the results are amazing.

MF Fan · Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 5:40 pm Post subject:

Interesting commentary about pedal C attributed to Arturo and Jim Manley:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct449XnJwzE
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x9ret · Posted: Wed May 04, 2016 2:25 am Post subject:

I haven't bothered with pedal notes for years now. I'm not entirely sure but perhaps they are not useful for anything much except developing a much thicker tone in your lower register. However when people want to play high then they have too many double chins or pockets of air in their chops instead of an efficient airstream bouncing off the tongue.
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