Best mouthpiece for beginners?

TKSop · Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 5:04 am Post subject:

I'd go 6c over 7c almost any time - still very much middle of the road but a much less extreme rim IMHO.

TrpPro · Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 1:53 pm Post subject:

10.5C

Winghorn · Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 5:55 pm Post subject:

A Jet-Tone MF for a beginner? You are joking, right?

A Bach 7C is a fine beginner mouthpiece and helps a student develope good habits from the start. I imagine more trumpeters started on this mouthpiece than all the others combined. There are no shortcuts to learning the trumpet, in spite of what some posters might say. And a beginner is in no position to select a mouthpiece on his own, by feel or otherwise. Trumpet playing is going to feel weird for many months until a beginner developes a proper embouchure and learns how to breathe correctly. The size of a beginner's lips have nothing to do with selecting a mouthpiece. Clifford Brown played on a 17C. These are only my opinions, but history speaks for itself regarding the 7C and successfully learning to play the trumpet.

Regards

Steve Allison

coxmusic1 · Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 7:56 pm Post subject:

My son tried a 7C and struggled for the first year. The 5C was a slight improvement. He then tried a Pickett 3C and his sound/range improved immediately. My other son likes the 7C and is doing well. Mouthpieces are like shoes - one size does NOT fit all.
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duane v · Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:24 pm Post subject:

I played a the same Bach 7C from 2nd grade up till today..... It wasnt until the 7th grade the JET-TONE Severinsen model became my main pipe. If it wasn't given to me, the 7C would probably be my main MP
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Martinharris · Veteran Member Joined: 10 Dec 2015 Posts: 236

I think a Bobby shew 1.5 would be a great beginner mouthpiece because they will never ever struggle with overblowing, inefficiency or high register.

roynj · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Oct 2002 Posts: 2065

I bought an eastman trumpet for a beginner a few years ago. It was a very nice and cheap trumpet, but the generic unmarket "beginner" mp was absolutely huge (comparable to a Bach 1 in terms of rim and cup volume). This was NOT a beginner mp. I still have that mp as a back up for my Monette B2. I can't imagine any beginner who might be able to use this "beginner" mp.

drboogenbroom · Heavyweight Member Joined: 16 Apr 2004 Posts: 697

Mason3724 · Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 2:54 pm Post subject:

Pickett Brass recently rolled out with a "Young Artist" line in the common diameters (3, 5, 7) which they say are optimized for efficiency and development. Most people find a mouthpiece uncomfortable because of the rim shape and the bite in combination with the diameter. I'm imagining a Pickett 7C would be much more comfortable than the Bach.

jadickson · Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 5:43 pm Post subject:

10 1/2C would probably be an easier piece to start on for some, but not kids with big chops.

Yamaha has much better rims. But not every music store is a Yamaha dealer.
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Bryant Jordan · Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 9:28 pm Post subject:

For a beginner, a Monette Prana B1-1 sounds about right.

No, definitely not. 7c, 5c, 3c seems to be what most start on. I started on a 3c, moved around quite a bit, and now am back around that size, and (possibly) soon to go a little bigger. It definitely can depend on the player though.

Best,
Bryant J.

Winghorn · Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 11:20 pm Post subject:

I agree that a Bach 5C would be good for beginners, and maybe take them through the rest of their playing careers. Doc Severinsen plays the equivalent of a 5C, and Lew Soloff and Gerard Schwarz, among many others, played them as well. So much for "inefficient" Bach mouthpieces, whatever that silliness means.

I don't quite understand the criticism of the Bach 7C rim. Bud Herseth played a 7C until he hurt his chops and had to bigger. I personally played a Bach 7C successfully through high school, although I am certainly no Herseth. I can see why a "pressure" player might find the rim uncomfortable, though.

jadickson · Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2016 4:10 am Post subject:

Winghorn · Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2016 10:47 am Post subject:

I guess I missed the wonderful post by Zaferis.

He sums up the beginner mouthpiece situation perfectly. The shoe size analogy doesn't work. A beginner does not know how a mouthpiece is supposed to feel. I imagine any mouthpiece is going to feel weird for many months. Why not get used to a mouthpiece that promotes clean attacks and using less pressure? The beginner can buy a goofy cushion rim, pea-shooter high-note mouthpiece after he learns to play.

Steve

bach_again · Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2016 1:25 pm Post subject:

Better than the mouthpiece, how about proper instruction? There's so many hacks out there doing more harm than good.

A 7c is fine. Inconsistent, granted, but fine. I could play on one, complain a bit, but make the gig work. It's not sharp either. That's all from bad technique. From pressure, no sense of balance between air, pressure, compression and sensible volume. I have a permanent scar on my lip from a 7c where as a kid with useless instruction, I just kept pressing harder because it seemed to give me higher notes, well damn it was the mouthpieces fault.

Years later I've overcome a lot and figured a few things out, and I tried a 7c and it was fine. Not ideal, but fine. I had a 7c mt vernon which was deeper with a flatter rim, but I don't recall my version being much bigger in the diameter.

Anyway, it doesn't amount to a hill of beans if the tuition is rubbish. I think within reason we all could play most things, just choose to play what makes life easier for the job at hand, something the beginner doesn't have - the job. In my opinion the Yamaha 11b4/11 or a Bach 7/6/5/3c are totally fine. I occasionally move students to different pieces depending on their teeth and how they perform on the other pieces. More often than not there's negligible difference... They themselves don't have a preference.

Anyway, everyone is gonna have their answer... Good luck!

Mike
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trumanjazzguy · Posted: Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:45 pm Post subject:

I should have mentioned this in addition to my original post. I have a brand new beginner playing a MINTY FRESH King Tempo cornet from the Mid 70's. The mouthpiece in the case was a Bach 6... No letter. I've always thought the no letter Bach's were strictly classical and "tone" oriented pieces. When she is able to center notes, which she is still new at, her tone is amazing, but I do feel that the rather large 6 cup volume may be difficult for her small thin lips to handle. Am I thinking about this too hard?

So far it seems the mouthpiece doesn't matter for her experience level. We're mostly working on tounguing, keeping the piece in the same spot on her lips, and centering notes as well as the air finesse required to hold notes and move from one note to the next. Her eyes get so wide when she really finds the center and her sound locks in pretty and round!
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Crazy Finn · Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:22 am Post subject:

Louise Finch · Posted: Sat Sep 10, 2016 4:52 am Post subject:

jadickson · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 12:19 pm Post subject:

Has anyone tried a Bach 6B for beginners?

colab · Regular Member Joined: 12 Feb 2016 Posts: 15

My post isn't to offer advice, but as a beginner with the same question. My used trumpet came with a Bach 7C, but the shank was dented and the plating rough, so I bought a new one.

I bought a Schilke 13D4. The way I understand it, the Schilke 13 is a little larger in the inner rim diameter than the Bach 7C. I believe the larger diameter requires a little more wind power to play with endurance, but that I can build that without using a smaller mouthpiece as a crutch.

As a beginner, I'm not trying to play really high notes. I can play comfortably up to G, and I'm fine with that. There is way more to work on than squeeky notes. Again, I don't think a smaller cup is going to develop my playing better. The 13D4's D-cup offers a little extra volume compared to the Bach 7C, and the cup is slightly deeper. Again, this may sacrifice some ease of access to the higher register, but should offer a slightly darker, fuller tone, and combined with the larger inner rim diameter, more volume of sound.

The throat and backbore appear close to the same. Although Schilke considers their "4" rim to be a slightly sharper than standard, I think the 7C's rim is at least as sharp. Overall, the 13D4 seems only slightly different than the 7C, so none of the differences result in what I consider to be extremes.

I have only tried these two mouthpieces, so I can hardly be certain that I have the best one. But I am reasonably certain the one I have is good enough.

If I were to consider another piece, I am inclined to go even farther away from small rims and shallow cups. I am considering acquiring a Schilke 17D4d. This is again larger in rim, with the D cup that is slightly deeper while not being totally V-shaped, and a larger "d" backbore.

My focus is on developing wind power, and I feel a stuffed up horn is the worst situation. I have a lot of determination to develop big wind, but another beginner might be frustrated by a mouthpiece that demands a lot of wind when they'd rather be focusing on high notes or some other aspect of playing.

I understand the Cornet mouthpieces typically have deep cups and large backbores. On a trumpet they would be very free blowing. I think the 17D4d comes closer to mouthpiece with Cornet characteristics, but I'm concerned if I go too big, deep, and open that I will lose brightness and the tone will be dull.