New trumpet Maker, Jérôme Wiss

stumac · Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 7:48 pm Post subject:

For those interested look at US Patent 4,515,061 the late Ernest Ferron of Rouen describes a tuning slide bow as Mr Wiss is surely aware of.

In the mid 1980s Ferron supervised the manufacture of a batch of 10 C trumpets at Selmer based on the C700 platform with his modifications, I believe they turned out too costly to manufacture so they were not further developed.

I have one of these and except for the low C# it is the most in tune of any instrument I have played. I applaud Mr Wiss for his efforts.

Regards, Stuart.

marnix · Veteran Member Joined: 16 Feb 2014 Posts: 212

Jerome,

If you can tell me where you are located, I would be very willing to visit your shop, and play your trumpets.
I do not understand physics and so, but I am a professional player, who makes a good living of it. I think a play test will be very interesting, also for the Americans here, who are as interested as I am...

I'm from Holland, and it so happens that I own a real nice French car ( a Citroen, the BEST!!!), so for me it's also a very good reason to drive some miles with it.

And if you know a good camping in the neighbourhood, I can take my wife and little girl on a short vacation?

How about that?

You can mail me if think this is a good plan. costermarnix @ gmail.com
_________________
Olds Recording '66
Stomvi Mahler Titan.
XO brass C trumpet
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Back to good old GR 66L

Sustained note · Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 1:18 am Post subject:

Contact details including address:

http://jeromewiss.com/en/contact/
_________________
Michael Greenberg

Giv'at Shmuel
Israel

Trumpet: Schilke B1 (2005)
Mouthpiece: Schilke Soloiste MG1
(Marc Geujon) gold plated
----------------

Keep a sense of humor.

chuck in ny · Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:03 am Post subject:

bit of an over focus here on the tuning aspect as it's an issue that gets resolved by the player one way or the other. physics is fine in its place. sound, feel, and response are where the rubber meets the road.

James Becker · Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:50 am Post subject:

Indeed Chuck. I've asked several world class brass players in what order is most important, feel, sound or pitch. No doubt an instrument must produce the right sound with an acceptable scale, however if it doesn't feel right then the rest pales in comparison.

My 2 cents
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ruotjoh · Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 9:04 am Post subject:

lipshurt · Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:26 am Post subject:

wow, i just this whole thing.....and once again i'm disappointed in quite a few folks on here that think they know more than they actually do, and then they challenge someone who just knows so much more...it embarrassing to watch (read).

THANK YOU to Mr. Wiss for doing what you are doing, continuing the work of dr. Cardwell, E.L. Kent and others. Very exciting.

I have Made many lead pipes, mouthpieces, backbones and even a whole valve assembly form scratch using many of the ideas form Cardwell, Kent etc. And i have a question for you:

I understand how the bore and conical sections affect the nodal points and that adjustments can raise or lower certain notes on the instrument. My question is how much these nodal points are moved when the main tuning slide is moved in or out. If you move the main slide 3cm (one inch or so) because of temperature or to accommodate a certain extra deep or extra shallow mouthpiece....does that make all of the bore adjustments slightly in the wrong locations? It is fairly common to move the slide quite a bit for time to time.

Than you for considering the question.
Keep going with your efforts

Doug Meeuwsen
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Mouthpiece Maker
vintage Trumpet design enthusiast
www.meeuwsenmouthpieces.com
www.youtube.com/lipshurt

marnix · Veteran Member Joined: 16 Feb 2014 Posts: 212

Sustained note · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 7:21 am Post subject:

The new Jerome Wiss trumpet with the "normal" bell. I think it's a beauty:

http://jeromewiss.com/fr/fabrication/trompette-sib-modele-916/
_________________
Michael Greenberg

Giv'at Shmuel
Israel

Trumpet: Schilke B1 (2005)
Mouthpiece: Schilke Soloiste MG1
(Marc Geujon) gold plated
----------------

Keep a sense of humor.

cheiden · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 8:42 am Post subject:

Here a link for the page in English.
http://jeromewiss.com/en/fabrication-en/bb-trumpet-mod-916/

Looks cool. Thanks for sharing.
_________________
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Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart

dstdenis · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 10:57 am Post subject:

I think it looks great. I can't imagine how Mr Wiss came up with the idea for that new valve system. I'm very interested to read reports from folks who play-test it for sound and playability.
_________________
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Cornet Getzen Custom 3850S
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Dale Proctor · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 11:14 am Post subject:

Looks like Conn may have tried something similar over 100 years ago, but without seeing the valves themselves, it's hard to tell.

http://cderksen.home.xs4all.nl/ConnPerfConnqueror1907image.html
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etc-etc · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 6177

Dale,

I believe in that Conn valve ports are still standard - just the connections between are unusual.

trompette229 · Veteran Member Joined: 21 Mar 2016 Posts: 203

It's great to see someone stepping outside the box, best to you. I may have missed this in the many posts but the one area that seems like a challenge is the lack of 1st and 3rd slide adjustments and/or another way to adjust pitch overall while playing. No matter how well in tune the instrument is, we always have to adjust as we play in the orchestra... playing in different keys (just intonation).

For example: an "E" on a C major triad needs to be 14 cents low while an "E" in a C# minor triad needs to be 16 cents high. Thats a 30 cent pitch differential. Without some way to adjust pitch there would be a lot of pitch bending which is never good for sound quality. While modern trumpets don't completely solve these problems, there is at least help with the slides. Has this already been addressed? If so my apologies.

LittleRusty · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 3:13 pm Post subject:

Rod Haney · Heavyweight Member Joined: 22 Aug 2015 Posts: 937

scottfsmith · Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:28 pm Post subject:

The perturbation of the bore in spots to improve intonation has been practiced for hundreds of years in wind instrument design; the old makers didn't understand why but they knew it worked and improved designs by a evolutionary process of trial and error experimentation. In the 1970's scientists started to figure out the basis of these old practices. Here is one such article from Nature:

http://la.trompette.free.fr/Smith/Nature/intonation.htm

This article shows how one of the trumpet partials can be corrected by putting a constriction in the proper spot. It is a very difficult problem to solve all intonation problems (plus keep the pitch stable while you are getting it more in tune), but in a computer simulation you can try hundreds of thousands of options.

Rod Haney · Heavyweight Member Joined: 22 Aug 2015 Posts: 937

QUOTE
I agree with you, that is a big factor why large suppliers rarely make radical changes but what I meant is that manufacturers do make prototypes and try new innovations even though they wouldn't reach in the production line (I know, maybe Bach wasn't the best example).

The reason why non of the masters have come with a design that plays perfectly in tune is simpe: Harmonic series of a trumpet forces some notes to be sharp or flat. These tendencies are dictated by the laws of physics and not the horn itself. I don't understand how it would be possible to build something that changes the fact that trumpet plays naturally out of tune.[/quote

Don't you mean "that trumpet players play naturally out of tune" ? Ha
I always thought if you blew the horn correctly and had a good ear you stayed in tune with all but horrible horns ( insert hated brand here ). But I'm rather simplistic. And try to use the same approach in life because I play trumpet and don't need more complications.
Rod

homebilly · Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2016 10:25 pm Post subject:

well folks I played both horns, actually the first person to play the standard bell version, yesterday and all I can say is BRAVO to Jérôme.

I loved the radical flared bell version!!!
I took some pictures that I'll post when I get a chance.

my thoughts on the radical bell original version:

• the build quality is superbe and the look is crazy cool.
• different feel in your hands but very balanced and easy to hold.
• easy to confuse as a C trumpet
• it takes a while to get used to its way of playing as it is very, very open which I absolutely dug.
• it has an adjustable gap receiver that allows for some added resistance.
• it sounds very diffused and fluffy but that can be altered by the gap thingy
• it vibrates in your hand just like my broken braced Ambassadors do
• it has no spit valves but those can be added if needed. I like it as is.
• it has no triggers but those too could be added I suppose if one insisted
• valve block and valves are excellent. some of the best that I have played.
• the bell had a small rise built into it. it didnt bother me but a Lee Morgan style valve presser might have trouble getting the valves all of the way down but then again a Lee style presser might want just that!

the intonation is very close to as advertised.as with any new instrument i would need a few days or weeks of playing it to really know if it plays 100% in tune. also I change horns alot and play a very, very deep V piece, which is very slippery, so my base reference isn't so solid these days.

but the horn DOES play nicely in tune with itself. 100% in tune? you'll have to make an effort to come and play test it yourself I suppose to decide.
I loved it!

I think that we as trumpeters also have to try and think outside of the box and give new ideas a chance instead of shutting them down without a chance to be tested.

insomma:

I am deeply impressed with Jérôme's work and thick skin. this thread has been incredibly tough on him yet he remains 100% class! this dude is doing it and not just talking about it. whether it pleases everyone or not is impossible to say but this cat has big huevos for putting it out there and trying something different from the mainstream.

the sheer amount of man hours to make a horn 100% from scratch is just daunting! .

I will do what I can to spread the word...............
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waiting for Fed-Ex to deliver a $50 trumpet to my door. shipping was prepaid by seller of course!
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trumpet56 · Heavyweight Member Joined: 16 Jun 2010 Posts: 623

Having just read this thread there is one poster who reminds me of our dear friend the Captain.