Trumpet Bore vs Mouthpiece Throat

[Satch87]

Can somebody please explain the relationship between these two. An XL bore horn is said to be free blowing and a large throat (small number) Mouthpiece is said to be free blowing. It seems a large amount of "lead" horns have larger bores but lead mouthpieces have smaller throats. Wouldn't these be contradicting each other?[/list]

[RussellDDixon]

You have to find the right combination mouthpiece and horn for YOU. There are lead players who play smaller bore horns and "tighter" mouthpieces with tight back bores and throats ranging from #28 to #30 (Brian MacDonald, Roger Ingram, Jon Faddis) There are also lead or high note players who play large bore horns and larger bore mouthpieces. (Lynn Nicholson, Arturo Sandoval and John Chuddoba).

You have to find the combination of horn and mouthpiece that gives YOU the resistance where YOU want to feel it.
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Schilke X3 Bb trumpet
Yamaha 631g Flugelhorn
Nicholson Monette Prana Resonance LT mouthpiece
Kanstul Claude Gordon Personal mouthpiece

[Satch87]

Thanks for the response. I understand the importance of playing the right setup for you and I'm certainly not asking which is better or what I should be playing on. I also understand that everybody has their own preference and when they find a setup that works perfectly they don't question it. I'm just curious on the physics behind it. If the mouthpiece throat is the main factor in airflow and resistance, what difference does the bore of the horn make?

[VetPsychWars]

It's all resonance. Airflow has nothing to do with it. The tapers are more important than the bore, though the bore can be important too.

As Mr Dixon said, it's you, the piece, the horn. Everything is interrelated.

Tom
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1950 Buescher Lightweight 400 Trumpet
1949 Buescher 400 Trumpet
1939 Buescher 400 Cornet
GR65M, GR65 Cor #1

[Concertjazz]

Don't know about the physics of the issue just my own experience.

Everything else being the same; tapers, back bores, cup size, kind of metal/material, a MP with, say a 26 throat, is going to allow for more volume of sound, make it easier to hit the center of high notes and allow for more precise articulation but reduce your endurance than a MP with the smaller throat.

The exact same MP with a 28 throat will; provide more resistance, cannot be played at the same volume levels as the 26 throat MP so don't even try, allows for far greater endurance, makes it easier to play in the high register LONGER (as in a 3 hour gig).

ANYONE can play in the high register with ANY mouthpiece for a demo or one select tune. The question is how long do you want to be able to stay up there, (like on every tune). That is kinda what "lead" mouth pieces are all about.

To answer your question about trumpet bores, my experience has been for me, I just cannot get enough air through a .450 bore. Feels like having a rag stuffed in the bell. But my .468 horn sounds great for about 20 minutes then I notice I am using a lot more pressure all of a sudden. So I stick to my .460 and tweak overall resistance with the MP.

Like I said, no physics just my own experiences.
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Schilke S33 HD

Bob Reeves 42S 962

[Benge.nut]

It funny how a few thousandths of an inch can make such difference.

The perceived difference vs actual "air through the horn" on a 28 hole vs a 25 for instance, may seem like a lot, but in reality i don't think we are talking about liters of air difference.

And most modern lead players I know gravitate to ML or smaller horns, and smaller, tighter, more efficient mouthpieces than compared to players back in say the 70s and 80s.

I think there was more of a machismo factor in decades passed with regard to playing huge horns for lead playing.

[Arjuna]

The resistance has to come from somewhere and it is a matter of where you like your resistance to be and each player is different. So big open horns tend to go with more resistance in the interface, the mouthpiece. Uan Rasey played a Bach 1 and a medium bore horn so that's the opposite. It's all about balance. You must have positive resistance and that is enough resistance to make things work to your greatest musical and artistic advantage. When you find your balance then you are not working too hard and you can make beautiful music.

Some guys liked the medium bore Martin Committee, but some like the XL bore the #3 bore that had that magical sound. The medium bore or #2 bore Martin Committee had the magic also just more focused and compact sounding. Both horns are a great example of step bores or conical designed trumpets that are very well balanced with the right resistance. Each horn you choose to balance out the resistance, response and sound that you like you do that with the mouthpiece. After all the mouthpiece is the interface and the most important ingredient in finding the right balance between player, mouthpiece and trumpet.