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Leadpipe corrosion?



 
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Yuri!
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Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 12
Location: St.Petersburg

PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 12:11 am    Post subject: Leadpipe corrosion? Reply with quote

I bought used King Silver Flair 2055t (silver plated) with excellent condition (as described on ebay). When received, I found that leadpipe has more than 10 points with bloated sillver plate. From the inside, leadpipe looks clean as I can see.

Is this seriously problem and should I return the trumpet(lost ~$70 of shipping cost)? Or it is a just cosmetic defects аnd I should not worry? And how to fix this problem?

Photos:
http://imgur.com/StTUHxm
http://imgur.com/iXsm9Q9
http://imgur.com/igjQuUj
http://imgur.com/18QrJeN
http://imgur.com/VhslIAd

Thank you
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James Becker
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Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 2827
Location: Littleton, MA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't say with certainty when King changed from 70/30 (copper/zinc) yellow brass to 85/15 gold brass, but the current replacement leapipe for your 2055T is now made of gold brass. "Red rot" or de-zincification is the very reason a great majority of manufactures moved away from yellow brass leadpipes. As long ago as 35 years Yamaha made the change across their entire range of brass winds, with exception of some pro model trumpets. At about the same time Getzen changed many of their leadpipes from brass to nickel, while their 700S has a thin wall 80/20 leadpipe.

So you might be asking why Yamaha didn't make the change on some professional model trumpets? The answer is simple, response and sound quality. The natural tendency of gold brass vs yellow brass is it adds some resistance and looses some higher harmonics. This is less of an issue with light weight trumpets, however heavy wall (Bach standard weight equivalent) play better with yellow brass leadpipes.

So you have to decide if you're willing to give up a little bit of the playing qualities of yellow brass (more immediate response and zing to the sound) in exchange for greater corrosion resistance.

The good news is we have a few of the old stock yellow brass tubes on hand. If you like we could reconstruct your leadpipe, silver plate and install it for you. Or we could do the same with the more corrosion resistant gold brass tube. Since the King 2055 has lighter tubing you may not notice as much difference between the two alloys. The choice is entirely up to you.

I hope this is helpful
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James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com

Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US
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Yuri!
Regular Member


Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 12
Location: St.Petersburg

PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So this is red rot and need to change the leadpipe? How much is it cost?
I'm not in US, so it would be cheaper to return trumpet and buy without this defect.

Thank you
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Manuel de los Campos
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Joined: 29 Jul 2004
Posts: 649
Location: Amsterdam, the Netherlands

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yuri! wrote:
So this is red rot and need to change the leadpipe?


It is red rot but you don't have to replace the lead pipe untill holes appear. Even then you can consider to patch the holes, which is way cheaper than replace the pipe
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Robert P
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Joined: 28 Feb 2013
Posts: 2578

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Odd though that with that much blistering of the silver that you can't see anything inside the pipe. When I got my Getzen with similar blistering on the pipe the cratering inside was very obvious. That's part of why I insisted on a partial refund - a tech had repaired a dent in the pipe visible in the Ebay auction which the guy had touted as a selling point but was ridiculously pointless when I saw how bad the red rot was.

Further it was impossible that the tech hadn't seen the red rot internal pitting which the seller claimed he knew nothing about. I told him if he genuinely didn't know he should get his money back from the tech.

I assume you've cleaned out the pipe?
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Yuri!
Regular Member


Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 12
Location: St.Petersburg

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, I did not clean the trumpet, I think it was cleaned before selling. I just bought it and found such a defect.

Now I looked carefully - yes, from the inside there are defects too.
I think the best solution is to return it.

Thank you
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Harrys
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Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 24

PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just sent my trumpet to Kanstul for mouthpipe replacement. The quote is $100 for the pipe and $30 labor, but that is for the raw brass, not lacquered or silvered.
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Benge.nut
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Joined: 18 Mar 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harrys wrote:
I just sent my trumpet to Kanstul for mouthpipe replacement. The quote is $100 for the pipe and $30 labor, but that is for the raw brass, not lacquered or silvered.


Curious, how much for for silver plating? Did you get a quote?
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Harrys
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Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 24

PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Benge.nut wrote:
Harrys wrote:
I just sent my trumpet to Kanstul for mouthpipe replacement. The quote is $100 for the pipe and $30 labor, but that is for the raw brass, not lacquered or silvered.


Curious, how much for for silver plating? Did you get a quote?


Since mine is lacquered, I didn't ask. They wanted to strip and relacquer the horn, not piecemeal. Sorry.
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