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Leather Specialities valve guard question



 
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jazzfunk
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden

PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:12 am    Post subject: Leather Specialities valve guard question Reply with quote

I'm about to order a valve guard for my Lawler flugelhorn.
Since there are no pictures of the flugelhorn guards on the site http://www.lscoguard.com/ and it is very hard to get an answer by email from them.

Does anyone know what the difference is between the "Special" and the "Deluxe" models for flugel?
Is it the same difference as for the trumpet guards (i.e. a wrap around the 3rd valve slide for the Deluxe)
Deluxe lsco


Special lsco


Or is it more like the ones from Zachary Music:
http://www.zacharymusic.com/Zachary_Music/GuardZFH900.htm
where the Deluxe version covers most of the 3rd valve slide and 1st valve slide. And the Special version wraps around the lead pipe going in to 1st valve and the bell pipe going out of the 3rd valve?

If anyone has a picture of a flugelhorn with an lsco guard (either Special or Deluxe) I would be very thankful.

"Special"


"Deluxe"

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Brad361
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As you've seen, good luck getting a reply from Leather Specialties, I had the same experience.
If they have a return policy, you could probably order both, send one back, you would just be out the shipping cost.

Brad
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lakejw
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, from my experience with Leather Specialties, the flugelhorn Basic model just wraps around the valves, with cutouts for the valve slides (does not extend past the valve block). The Deluxe model looks like the 2nd flugel picture you posted, with extra material that covers all the valve slides AND extends over the leadpipe/bell ferrule. I prefer the basic, as the deluxe ended up seeming like too much fuss after a while, and never really fit properly in the first place.
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razeontherock
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They make a great product. Sorry to hear they don't have anyone addressing questions via email. Phone overseas may not be a viable solution, but how are they domestically of late?
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jazzfunk
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your response lakejw (et al)! Do you have any picture to share?

What about the "Special"? (the in-between model)
Looking at the Zachary guards I linked to I'd prefer the "Special" model as it covers the exposed parts of the lead pipe and the bell pipe but leaves the slides in the open. And, I want the moisture barrier of the Leather Specialities product and the model specific fit for my Lawler flugel.

lakejw wrote:
So, from my experience with Leather Specialties, the flugelhorn Basic model just wraps around the valves, with cutouts for the valve slides (does not extend past the valve block). The Deluxe model looks like the 2nd flugel picture you posted, with extra material that covers all the valve slides AND extends over the leadpipe/bell ferrule. I prefer the basic, as the deluxe ended up seeming like too much fuss after a while, and never really fit properly in the first place.

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Callet Jazz (.470" bore)
Lawler FL1 gold plated
Yamaha YTR-734 (.460" bore)
Jupiter slide trumpet

SC1 (when I'm working on MSC)
Asymmetric 342 Lead (when I fall back to old chops)
Bach 1C, Weril 46W, Asymmetric 545 Opera, Denis Wick 4 FL
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RandyTX
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought a few of these years ago. They're still in a dusty corner of the practice room somewhere if I go hunting. Used them only briefly.They're too thick, make the horn feel weird, and dead, in the hand. Had one for a bach trumpet and one to fit a Kanstul 1525 flugel. Neither felt 'right' after the honeymoon period.

To each his own.
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Benge.nut
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd only use one if I had a raw brass horn (which I doubt I'd ever own) so my hands don't turn Incredible Hulk green and to try and prevent my horn from rotting away.

Otherwise, if I just wipe down my horns after use, the silver plate and lacquer never seems to be bothered by whatever I am oozing out on to my horn.
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jazzfunk
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had valve covers on my trumpets for ages and I like the feel of it. Especially on long rehearsals or gigs.

If it's not too much of a bother I'd really appreciate a picture of the guard on the flugel if it's a Leather Specialties guard.

RandyTX wrote:
I bought a few of these years ago. They're still in a dusty corner of the practice room somewhere if I go hunting. Used them only briefly.They're too thick, make the horn feel weird, and dead, in the hand. Had one for a bach trumpet and one to fit a Kanstul 1525 flugel. Neither felt 'right' after the honeymoon period.

To each his own.

_________________
Callet Jazz (.470" bore)
Lawler FL1 gold plated
Yamaha YTR-734 (.460" bore)
Jupiter slide trumpet

SC1 (when I'm working on MSC)
Asymmetric 342 Lead (when I fall back to old chops)
Bach 1C, Weril 46W, Asymmetric 545 Opera, Denis Wick 4 FL
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RandyTX
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jazzfunk wrote:
I've had valve covers on my trumpets for ages and I like the feel of it. Especially on long rehearsals or gigs.

If it's not too much of a bother I'd really appreciate a picture of the guard on the flugel if it's a Leather Specialties guard.

It looks pretty much exactly like the flugel pic posted earlier. Of course, with the kanstul flugel, the wrap is such that you don't touch the cover in very many places anyway other than the back side of the valve block.
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jazzfunk
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First or second flugel picture? They are two different guard models (first is "Special" and second is "Deluxe")

RandyTX wrote:

It looks pretty much exactly like the flugel pic posted earlier.

_________________
Callet Jazz (.470" bore)
Lawler FL1 gold plated
Yamaha YTR-734 (.460" bore)
Jupiter slide trumpet

SC1 (when I'm working on MSC)
Asymmetric 342 Lead (when I fall back to old chops)
Bach 1C, Weril 46W, Asymmetric 545 Opera, Denis Wick 4 FL
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Brad361
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Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RandyTX wrote:
I bought a few of these years ago. They're still in a dusty corner of the practice room somewhere if I go hunting. Used them only briefly.They're too thick, make the horn feel weird, and dead, in the hand. Had one for a bach trumpet and one to fit a Kanstul 1525 flugel. Neither felt 'right' after the honeymoon period.

To each his own.


I agree...which of course does not mean the OP
would or should.

About six months ago, I decided to put a guard I had (it was a Leather Specialties) back on my Benge, for a gig. In my opinion, there was a very noticeable difference in how the horn played with it on, and not in a good way. It felt somewhat dead, less responsive and a bit stiff, I took it off, noticeable difference.

That was it for me with valve guards.

Brad
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"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval
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BoscoBabcock
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Joined: 07 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've used them on and off for years. They do deaden some horns, but if you're looking for a valve guard they're the best. [/quote]
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razeontherock
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Joined: 05 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2017 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also find some horns respond negatively, while others don't. Seems the lighter horns don't like it, but I'm not sure it's that simple
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jazzfunk
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Joined: 12 Sep 2004
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden

PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, it seems that Facebook Messenger is the best way to get answers from Leather Specialties. I even got a couple of pictures from them showing the Deluxe guard on a flugelhorn and it is more or less identical to the "Special" model from Zachary.





So I ordered a Deluxe guard in black for my Lawler FL1.
_________________
Callet Jazz (.470" bore)
Lawler FL1 gold plated
Yamaha YTR-734 (.460" bore)
Jupiter slide trumpet

SC1 (when I'm working on MSC)
Asymmetric 342 Lead (when I fall back to old chops)
Bach 1C, Weril 46W, Asymmetric 545 Opera, Denis Wick 4 FL
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
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