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tomtrum Veteran Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2012 Posts: 123 Location: Oak Ridge, NJ
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Posted: Mon May 08, 2017 4:39 pm Post subject: Embochure/lips rejunenator??? |
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What product is out there that can help get the circulation back into the lips during a intense, high range engagement, where you can wear out quickly - but not recover circulation quickly? Warburton was known to have a device
but I lost track of it, including any possible comments as to its effectiveness.
Maybe there is a magic potion I could drink? Vitamin C?
Any ideas?
tom kieren |
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Andy Del Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Posts: 2660 Location: sunny Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Mon May 08, 2017 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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Fluttering lips between playing will stimulate blood flow, if there is a circulation problem. More than likely, it is not that, but a playing issue which is causing one to have less endurance than they want. All the electrical devices, vibrating boxes etc, do just the same thing as you can do for free by taking a big breath and fluttering those lips.
Sooo, join the club... we all want more endurance in the high register!
cheers
Andy _________________ so many horns, so few good notes... |
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Locutus2k Heavyweight Member
Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 635 Location: Rome, Italy
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 1:28 am Post subject: |
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There's no magic potion other than practice, but i've found that assuming pure curcumina with piperine on a regular basis does help a little in the long term for swelling. And does wonders to your general health, too. _________________ ------------------------
Edwards X-13
Lawler TL5 Balanced 30th Anniversary (#2 of 5)
Lawler TL5 L bore
Bach NY Special edition 2008
Flugel Van Laar Oiram Ack
Mark Curry mouthpieces
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TKSop Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Feb 2014 Posts: 1719 Location: UK
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 1:38 am Post subject: |
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It's worth bearing in mind that using vibrating devices, flapping and even pedals (not a fan) to "rejuvenate" the chops doesn't really rejuvenate in the sense of returning to a state of rest - rather, it expels some of the sensations of tiredness in order to allow us to play past the point at which we should have stopped and won't gain anything from continuing to practice...
If there's a gig that needs surviving that's a whole different ballgame ofcourse. |
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Craig Swartz Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Jan 2005 Posts: 7769 Location: Des Moines, IA area
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 4:24 am Post subject: |
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Contact Pops about using a didgeridoo. (I use a golf club bag tube.) His Tension-less Playing e book is a great reference as well and worth the money if only to increase your pedagogical skills and knowledge as a teacher. |
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tomtrum Veteran Member
Joined: 02 Sep 2012 Posts: 123 Location: Oak Ridge, NJ
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 6:46 am Post subject: Rejuvenating chops.. |
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Thanks guys. I thought there might be some kind of "magic bullet" out there, but I don't hear of any. How about simply changing to a shallower MP as the night wears on?!
thk |
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TKSop Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Feb 2014 Posts: 1719 Location: UK
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 6:55 am Post subject: Re: Rejuvenating chops.. |
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tomtrum wrote: | Thanks guys. I thought there might be some kind of "magic bullet" out there, but I don't hear of any. How about simply changing to a shallower MP as the night wears on?!
thk |
Use what you have to to survive...
I wouldn't switch part-way through the night unless you're practicing with both pieces regularly, otherwise you could wind up with results that are more embarrassing than running out of power and losing a bit of range.
There's no magic bullet to replace practice, I'm afraid |
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jscahoy Veteran Member
Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Posts: 415
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 7:52 am Post subject: Re: Rejuvenating chops.. |
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tomtrum wrote: | How about simply changing to a shallower MP as the night wears on?! |
Everyone's different, but for me switching mouthpieces mid-gig due to fatigue never helps. I mean, if it did, I'd use the shallower piece full time. |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8910 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:26 am Post subject: |
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You can't fix overuse by doing even more. Pace your workout and rest more. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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Richard III Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2007 Posts: 2611 Location: Anacortes, WA
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Posted: Tue May 09, 2017 8:44 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | is Tension-less Playing e book is a great reference as well and worth the money if only to increase your pedagogical skills and knowledge as a teacher. |
I don't play high like you guys do but I have the book and it made a huge difference in playing as well as John Daniel's book. That lip flapping thing when you get tired just seems to be needed when using too much pressure. I haven't felt the need in a long time. My muscles get tired but just stretching open my mouth refreshes them and I'm ready to go again. But tired is tired. _________________ Richard
Conn 22B Trumpet
York Eminence Model 4028 Cornet
1903 Conn The Wonder Cornet |
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Monster Oil Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 Posts: 511 Location: New London, CT
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Posted: Sat May 13, 2017 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: Embochure/lips rejunenator??? |
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tomtrum wrote: | What product is out there that can help get the circulation back into the lips during a intense, high range engagement, where you can wear out quickly - but not recover circulation quickly? Warburton was known to have a device
but I lost track of it, including any possible comments as to its effectiveness.
Maybe there is a magic potion I could drink? Vitamin C?
Any ideas?
tom kieren |
It depends on how you wear out. Lately I've found that the majority of the time when I 'wear out' it's because of swelling. Popping a couple Advils an hour before a demanding gig has worked wonders. Beats the hell out of working on efficiency.... _________________ www.MonsterOil.net
www.Facebook.com/MonsterOilLLC
www.YouTube.com/BrassChats
www.BrassChats.com |
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Benge.nut Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Mar 2017 Posts: 695
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Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 4:22 am Post subject: Re: Embochure/lips rejunenator??? |
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tomtrum wrote: | What product is out there that can help get the circulation back into the lips during a intense, high range engagement, where you can wear out quickly - but not recover circulation quickly? Warburton was known to have a device
but I lost track of it, including any possible comments as to its effectiveness.
Maybe there is a magic potion I could drink? Vitamin C?
Any ideas?
tom kieren |
Popsicles....they're my go to!! Red ones are the best |
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MusicByThePound Regular Member
Joined: 11 Feb 2017 Posts: 24 Location: Upstate NY
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Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 4:45 am Post subject: |
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Try breathing exercises. Oxygen repairs and rejuvenates muscles so the idea is to get more of it into your bloodstream. You can do some easy ones during the gig for rejuvenation and more intense the next day for repair.
Years ago Mcgovnor showed me some that I think he got from Wind and Song - Arnold Jacobs. Might be worth searching to see if he posted on the subject. Used a 3 inch long plastic tube between the teeth and just inhale/exhale deeply. Sometimes do 3-5 quickly in a row (or as many as you can stand without getting dizzy or drooling) rest - repeat. Soon your lips will start to tingle a little - this is the increased oxygen in your blood repairing them.
He had me drill a hole through the tube and thread a shoelace to make a breathing tube necklace for easy access. Going to break mine out for my gig this afternoon - Thanks for making me think about it. |
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Benge.nut Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Mar 2017 Posts: 695
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Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 5:00 am Post subject: |
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MusicByThePound wrote: |
Years ago Mcgovnor showed me some that I think he got from Wind and Song - Arnold Jacobs. |
I sure miss Mike. I never knew he was sick. Not only was he a trumpet guru, with tons of knowledge he was ALWAYS willing to share, he was such a great player. Mike worked with all the greats.....lead trumpet, beautiful bebop player with great endless lines and ideas etc. just a monster trumpeter
But he was also such a kindred soul. Just a hell of a nice guy who always returned calls, texts and emails, and always had great advice and a snarky funny response and was always available for a chat. Trumpet stuff and personall stuff. I'm glad to have known and played with Mike over the years. |
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mm55 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 01 Jul 2013 Posts: 1410
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Posted: Sun May 14, 2017 5:03 am Post subject: |
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Tingling of the lips can be caused by hypocapnea and resipiratory alkalosis, both of which can be caused by hyperventilation. Lip tingling after hyperventilation does not necessarily indicate any effect of oxygen on the muscles. _________________ '75 Bach Strad 180ML/37
'79 King Silver Flair
'07 Flip Oakes Wild Thing
'42 Selmer US
'90 Yamaha YTR6450S(C)
'12 Eastman ETR-540S (D/Eb)
'10 Carol CPT-300LR pkt
'89 Yamaha YCR2330S crnt
'13 CarolBrass CFL-6200-GSS-BG flg
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