Lead mouthpiece downsides ?

[lain.fishu]

Other than tone in the lower range, are there any downsides I should know about using a lead mouthpiece for pep/ marching band? I normally use a Bach 3c, and will be using a Yamaha 13a4a for a brighter sound and a little push in the upper range.
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Elijah
Yamaha 4335GSII
MP:Vincent Bach 3c
Yamaha 13a4a
Conn 6A Cornet
MP: Mt Vernon 7c

[Goby]

The internal volume of the cup will change more as your lips swell from intense playing. In a 3C mouthpiece, this change is a small fraction of the total cup volume, but with a shallow lead mouthpiece, your lips may swell to the point of touching the bottom of the mouthpiece cup and not being able to produce any sound.


Your articulation and accuracy may also suffer, as the higher compression from the mouthpiece can change the amount of effort required to play certain notes and make the shelves where notes sit more fragile.


Lastly, your range will *probably* not improve much compared to your regular mouthpiece. Playing into the upper register is all about technique and form, and the limiting factor for most players is their ability to create the right type of air compression through the embouchure rather than mouthpiece or trumpet bore size.


That being said, every professional lead trumpet player uses a shallow mouthpiece, so learning how to handle a shallow mouthpiece is a valuable skill. Make sure to lean into the bright sound of a shallow mouthpiece, and try to let the equipment do the work for you.

[Trumpjerele]

Hello, my usual mouthpiece is the Yamaha 11b4. I also have the 11c4-7c and since recently the 11a4.

Between the 11b4 and the 11a4 there are only subtle differences. I think the 11a4 is not a shallow enough mouthpiece to be considered a lead mouthpiece. Yamaha Booby Shew Lead, Allen Vizzutti or Eric Mishasiro would be authentic lead mouthpieces.

There is a slightly different timbre on the Yamaha 11a4, but little else. The low notes are still there, curiously they disappear with the yamaha 11c4, something about that mouthpiece just doesn't work for me.

So if you come from a Bach 3C it seems to me a good decision to move to a Yamaha 13a4, to look for that slightly brighter sound, when you adapt and feel that you still want more, if that day comes, you can look for more shallow pieces.
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Notice!!! Amateur musician without formal studies

Trumpet: Yamaha 8310Z
Mouthpiece: the great Yamaha11b4

Sax tenor: Yamaha YTS 23
Mouthpiece: Otto link tone edge

[ldwoods]

I find the intonation gets wonky when I have tried any of the "a" backbores. That would be my only word of caution, spend some time with a tuner to get used to the intonation differences between the 3C and a 13A4a.
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Larry Woods
LDWoods

[gord-o]

Another downside with a lead piece is the intonation. Notes that already tend to be sharp (top line F, A above that) will probably be sharper than with the 3c. You may have to pull your tuning slide out further than with the 3c. Practice with the lead piece holding out long notes for as long as comfortable while using a tuner. I'm not talking about just playing high notes here, I mean play the long tones with a tuner on low notes also. Find the pitch center of each note. This approach helped me to adjust to a lead piece and to re-acclimate if I haven't played the lead piece in a while.
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Richard Hastings
Brass and Stringed Instrument Repair,
Popplers Music

[zaferis]

+All the things that are mentioned - thinner tone, pitch issues, physical issues with a shallow cup, then add (in marching band) the temptation of over-blow or "fill up the space" which will accentuate all of theses things.
A bigger tone, that has more colors/overtones, easier to tune IMO is preferred for marching band. Bach 3C, or Yamaha 14B4 are solid choices.
Remember a Bach 3C is one of the more shallow "C" cups in the lineup... a good all-around sound.

I am not a fan of the xxa4 or xxa4a mouthpieces - these pieces have a very specific use, I feel overused by the masses. Really a piece for the extreme high end - and there aren't that many of us that live there. Far more applicable is a xXB4 Yamaha. Yamaha rims are differently shaped between the cup depths - i.e a 14B4 rim is different than a 14C4 rim.
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Freelance Performer/Educator
Adjunct Professor
Bach Trumpet Endorsing Artist
Retired Air Force Bandsman

[Richard III]

Marching band or any band that plays either outside or in very large venues requires a setup that can get you a loud sound. Restrictive mouthpieces just don't work. Drum and bugle corps use open mouthpieces to allow for a lot more air and sound. If I were you, that's the direction I would go.
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Richard

King 1130 Flugabone
King 12C mouthpiece

[kehaulani]

zaferis has spent a career playing in marching and ceremonial units (as well as balancing that out with "indoor" ensembles of various sorts). I would listen to him.
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"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

[Shaft]

Some “Potential” downsides can be avoided.

- Too sharp up high can sometimes mean too much mpc pressure and/or improper use of embouchure and overuse of facial muscles.

Tone & or low notes - go down incrementally in size as you get used to them then stop downsizing when you get to a point where its bad. Low notes are not speaking, articulation will never happen etc.

Smaller can be 2 sizes inner diameter & cup depth.
Don’t just focus on shallow.

Cup shape - convex or concave may be a better alternative than typical cup so that can be a potential downside to avoid.

Overblowing is by far the top downside in “technique” (for me) to avoid. How little work can you do and get a full tone…?

Sticking out…. (In a good way) sax players use a metal mpc to increase volume sometimes. A lead piece can amplify volumes that you may not be used to. You may stick out. However, if you are consistent it may be appropriate and people can come up to your level. (If this causes inhibition or fear that could be a downside but a lead piece can let you hang out in the wind)

Good luck and have fun.