Alto / Tenor Horn ?

ireburg · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 8:44 am Post subject: Alto / Tenor Horn ?

I have recently acquired a Tenor or Alto Horn?? with the following inscription on the bell;

"The Triumphonic"
Class 'A'
# 28537
made by
Salvationist Publishing
& Supplies Ltd,
London
The inscription also includes the Salvation Army Coat of Arms with the moto 'Blood and Fire'.
Could someyone identify this instrument for me and recommend ( and supply) a suitable mouthpiece?
Is this a B flat or an E flat instrument?
I am told that a mouthpiece for this instrument will require a 'European Shank' versus a USA shank ??
If a photo will help you I will provide one.

Regards

Allan Burgesse
_________________
King 'Master' Long Cornet
Eb Tenor Horn
Holton Bb Euphonium

dershem · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 10:03 am Post subject:

Alto Horns (Peck Horns) are usually in Eb. Finding one is not easy, finding a use for one is harder, and finding a decent mouthpiece for one is a real bear. They're all but impossible to play in tune.

I have a Bach 3 for mine, and while it will fit into the receiver on my trumpets, the sound that way is ... not good. Alas, few companies make mouthpieces for them, and few of those are very good - finding one that fits you is difficult, as the variety is very limited.

See if yours looks like any of these:

_________________
BKA! Mic Gillette was my mentor and friend.
Marcinkiewicz Mic G. trumpet, Custom Marcinkiewicz mpc. (Among others)
Marcinkiewicz Rembrandt flugel, Benge 8Z cornet, King 2B, Bach 36, Benge 190, Getzen 3062... many more. All Marc. mouthpieces.

sparxIV · Veteran Member Joined: 28 Nov 2006 Posts: 257

dershem..........I don't understand your post:

- Finding one is not hard at all .......... I can supply you with one this week ( pay in advance)

- I know lots of people who play them in tune

- any BBB will use three alto/tenor horns in Eb

-decent mps. ... Bach, Willson, Wick, Yamaha

Cheers,
sparx
www.sparxmusic.com
_________________
sparx

BenH · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 10:51 am Post subject:

I play Eb Tenor Horn (alto horn, for Americans)

Finding one is not difficult at all. Yamaha make them, and they are easily available. I say this because mine is a Yamaha. Other makes are available.

Finding a usage for one is less easy than trumpet, but not impossible. British Brass Bands contain Solo, 1st, and 2nd horn, if memory serves. Certain concert bands will have an Eb horn part.

Intonation... Well, that I kinda agree on. It's trickier than a trumpet, and you don't have the option of throwing out the slides. It can be lipped in though.

MPC wise, Wick are generally thought of to be quite good. I play a Yamaha piece.

More info here

Enjoy it - I play mainly trumpet now because I want to play jazz, but when played well the Tenor Horn is a beautiful instrument.

If it's Bb, it's probably a Baritone. Same usage applies, I believe. Probably mpc wise as well. Hope that helps!
_________________
Schilke B1
Couesnon flugelhorn

lmf · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 11:47 am Post subject:

Hi,

It is probably Eb as all the alto horns/tenor horns I remember from Salvation Army banding were Eb instruments and played music written for Eb. They were an integral part of the brass band and added much.

Best wishes,

Lloyd

Flattergrub · Heavyweight Member Joined: 01 Sep 2008 Posts: 762

You can also sometimes get "F" slides for them and play French horn parts in wind bands, small ensembles, etc. - There is a whole new market for ya Ted. Introducing the new "Sparx" tenor horn mpcs - You saw it right here on TH first

B_Starry · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 11:57 am Post subject:

I've played Eb alto horn many times in small ensembles when the trombone is missing. It is easy to cover that part, even without transposition skills: just play the trombone part (bass clef) as if it was written in treble clef, with an appropriate adjustment in the key signature, of course ... it works like a charm! (Handy for playing in church groups, that way.)

Example: you have a piece written in F major, with the trombone part showing a written F (4th line in bass clef). The Eb alto plays as if it was written in D major, with the 4th line seen as a D in treble clef. [D on Eb horn equals F concert.]

They show up frequently on eBay. I've used both Bach and Wick mouthpieces with no problems. Intonation typically is an issue, though.
- Brian
_________________
do justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with God

bmjcook · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:09 pm Post subject:

Gidday Allan
The instrument in question was made by the Salvation Army quite a while ago, back when they were making instruments for their bands. The tenor horn is an easy instrument to play in tune, just as easy to play in tune as a cornet which I play. The tenor horn is an Eb instrument. They are mostly used in brass bands and you will usually see three or four of them in a typical brass band. When played well they make a glorious sound, especially when they are "harmonizing" in a slow melody. They are easily obtainable from most of the well known suppliers of brass instruments in Australia, England and Europe as well as Japan.
Cookie

Thuringowa Salvation Army Band
Townsville Qld Australia

dershem · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:19 pm Post subject: Re: nice

Riojazz · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:37 pm Post subject:

Years ago, I had an alto horn from Conn. I considered it an F horn, but with additional slides for Eb. I guess it's all in whichever way you want to look at it, but the horn's intonation was much better in F.

A Bach mouthpiece worked fine. The horn was basically a baritone horn up a fifth. It was nice for jazz.

Allan, to find out what key it's in, find the C in a C major scale on the horn, and then go to a piano and see what concert pitch you are playing.
_________________
Matt Finley https://mattfinley.bandcamp.com/releases
Kanstul 1525 flugel with French taper, Shires Bb Destino Med & C trumpets, Schilke XA1 cornet, Schagerl rotary, Schilke P5-4 picc, Yamaha soprano sax, Powell flute. Sanborn GR66MS & Touvron-D.

lmf · Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:50 pm Post subject:

Tenor/Alto Horn Facts

http://www.public.asu.edu/~jqerics/alto-tenor-FAQ.html

http://www.brasscrest.com/instru/instru003.html

The Salvation Army Brass Instrument History:

http://www.heilsarmeemuseum-basel.ch/E/brassinstruments.php

Hope these bits of information help.

Best wishes,

Lloyd

Flattergrub · Heavyweight Member Joined: 01 Sep 2008 Posts: 762

dershem · Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 5:15 pm Post subject:

ireburg · Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 8:34 pm Post subject: Alto /Tenor Horn ID'd

Many thanks to all who replied to my query regarding my new horn. All your comments and advice have been helpful to me.
I purchased a Bach #7 mpc and find that it works OK for me.
The member's description of reading the bass clef as a treble clef is something worthwhile remembering.
Regards

Allan Burgesse
_________________
King 'Master' Long Cornet
Eb Tenor Horn
Holton Bb Euphonium

Treblehorn · Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:19 pm Post subject:

Missed this thread when it came around. ADD is....Oh look, a chicken.....

Seriously, I've got a 40's bell forward York that's just a hoot to play, Bach #3 mouthpiece ( finally). 30 minutes filling these suckers up, and you want to overpower those meager large-bore trumpets!

The alto's / tenor horns show up quite a bit on ebay, but experience say's the valves will leak like cheesecloth, giving them a very airy, lack of control feel and sound.

I re-did a 40's bell forward Martin for my brother a few years ago, and he ended up in a BBB in the DC area with it. He just recently bought a new Besson bell-up, and it's a fantastic instrument.

Maybe he'll give me his Getzen Severinsen now that he's hooked on Alto. Somehow I doubt it.
_________________
Alan

Whole buncha brass. Big, small, short, long, coiled and straight. Someday I'll be able to play them.

WxJeff · Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 2:38 pm Post subject:

Picked up one with the F slide a couple weeks ago from one of our TH brethren and I'm having a blast with it. Took it to church orchestra rehearsal Weds night, pulled a couple Fr horn parts and ...oooohhhh.... fit in quite nicely, thank you. It's a nice alternative on more lyrical pieces in the church repertoire.

My biggest challenge was finding a case: warning -- heretical confession follows. My wife advised that our local Target store had a large stock of oversized gym bags and rolling suitcases, so I took the horn into the store and found one that fit pretty well. Gotta get some of that eggshell foam stuff to fill the bag out a bit and provide some padding. Wouldn't advise this approach for a kid or in an environment where dings are possible, but for basic transportation it works fine.

Oh, and here's a tenor horn discussion board: Click click

Enjoy!