Your level of consistency is a function of your life as a human animal. When you're more consistent with when you arise, when you hit the sack, what you eat for brkfst, your attitude from day to day, what/when you exercise... you get it-- then you can think about becoming more consistent in your musical life. Until then, forget it.
When we sound like crap, we feel like crap, and the latter precedes the former.
ed
I understand how having a consistent routine/warm up could help me but I fail to see what my sleeping, eating and exercise habits have to do with anything.
This is why you are inconsistent. When we are young, we believe we can do whatever we like without adverse effects and without harming anyone but ourselves at worst. That is not ever, and has never been true.
Brian
Could you please explain? I understand what all that stuff has to do with my health which is why I try to sleep enough, eat well, and exercise, but I don't see how that transfers to my trumpet playing. Can you clarify?
Everything in our environment affects our bodies and mind, our moods, too. When a person is young, those differences seem to have little effect on the day-to-day living. But is that true?
Look at top level athletes. They hold to a strict regimen of eating, drinking, exercise and training. Why? So that they can perform at their best (or as close to it as possible) each and every competition.
I am affected by humidity big time. If it has been especially dry - I do live in a desert these days, after all - it causes mouth-breathing while sleeping, because of aggravated sinus swelling. My lip tissues can end up swollen in the night from my body trying to retain moisture while my body's water content is just a few points low. Maybe I forgot to drink water before bed?
It can take an hour of playing before my lips become responsive. By then, they are fatigued. Trying to maintain a consistent lifestyle helps maintain consistent performance results.
Joined: 11 Feb 2011 Posts: 392 Location: Lincolnshire England
Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:07 pm Post subject:
TCEmusic wrote:
FrankM wrote:
This thread is a great testimony to the value and quality of TH.
TCM, you are not listening. Despite older wiser members repeatedly aiming you in the right direction.
I know trumpet players like to think arrogance is a basic qualification for the job, but it is only justified when you're on top of the job.
Be thankful so many members are happy to keep responding. And for goodness sake stop rejecting their advice.
Oh! and go to www.urbanagnas.com to see how Urban starts his day. If its good enough for him then it's good enough for the rest of us.
Sorry chaps but unlike the rest of you I've lost patience with TCM.
I am listening and I plan to follow peoples advice about a thorough daily warm up, however, I can't blindly follow someones advice without being given a reason.
To the people who have given me advice and a reason to back it up- thanks, I fully intend to give it a fair shot, but to tell me to do something with zero explanation as to why simply because you say so is ridiculous.
Secondly, I haven't rejected anyone's advice so far I have only asked for clarification and a reason to follow it.
OK TCE - so you are annoyed with me. I can understand that. Just don't let it stand in your way of learning a valuable lesson from Urban. That WOULD be ridiculous.
Joined: 30 Jun 2011 Posts: 33 Location: WHO CARES?
Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:48 am Post subject:
TCË Just take it easy...is just music......we are trying to help. Good look _________________ Time for practice!
Sonare TR9-Bys Trumpet
V.Bach Mercedes Trumpet
Getzen Flugelhorn
Bach 1.5 open
Bob Reeves 41S
Joined: 13 Nov 2001 Posts: 5639 Location: Chicago, Illinois
Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:44 pm Post subject:
This answer comes from a 50 year old who made a living playing full time for the majority of his life (and started out as a young, inconsistent player just like the OP):
To get consistency in your playing simply requires consistently practicing correctly for a long enough period of time (years). Sorry - no top hats, no rabbits, no magic wands. It's all a matter of knowing what to practice, how to practice and when to practice, and then spending the time applying that knowledge through routine, daily practice long enough for nature to take its course.
Sincerely,
John Mohan
Studying With Claude Gordon and What It Did For Me _________________ Trumpet Player, Clinician & Teacher
14 Year Claude Gordon Student
1st Trpt for "Cats", "Phantom of the Opera",
"West Side Story", "Evita", "Grease",
Disney's "Hunchback of Notre Dame", etc.
Burbank Benge 6x
Copy of a Mt Vernon 3C
To get consistency in your playing simply requires consistently practicing correctly for a long enough period of time (years). Sorry - no top hats, no rabbits, no magic wands. It's all a matter of knowing what to practice, how to practice and when to practice, and then spending the time applying that knowledge through routine, daily practice long enough for nature to take its course.
Or, as a wise person once said, playing trumpet is simple but not easy. _________________ Steve Thiel
Matthew 25:31-46
Joined: 13 Nov 2001 Posts: 5639 Location: Chicago, Illinois
Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:40 pm Post subject:
swthiel wrote:
John Mohan wrote:
To get consistency in your playing simply requires consistently practicing correctly for a long enough period of time (years). Sorry - no top hats, no rabbits, no magic wands. It's all a matter of knowing what to practice, how to practice and when to practice, and then spending the time applying that knowledge through routine, daily practice long enough for nature to take its course.
Or, as a wise person once said, playing trumpet is simple but not easy.
I did have second thoughts about the use and placement of the word "simply" in my post. I left it there because it is simple - but you're right - that doesn't make it easy! I think that's because patience is a hard commodity to have and hold onto. As my teacher Claude Gordon wrote:
Quote:
Impatience is the enemy of the ambitious player. The reason is because you are developing and coordinating muscular action and cannot rush ahead any faster than nature will allow. In trying to proceed too rapidly, the student often times tears down faster than he builds up.
I think that in addition to the "tears down faster than he builds up" problem, an even more prevalent problem, especially in this day and age, is that the student tries an approach for a matter of months, or maybe even just weeks (days?), and then gives up on it, moving on to the next idea before the first one has had a chance to help him develop and accomplish anything.
Sincerely,
John Mohan _________________ Trumpet Player, Clinician & Teacher
14 Year Claude Gordon Student
1st Trpt for "Cats", "Phantom of the Opera",
"West Side Story", "Evita", "Grease",
Disney's "Hunchback of Notre Dame", etc.
Burbank Benge 6x
Copy of a Mt Vernon 3C
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Posts: 539 Location: sunny Sydney, Australia
Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:49 pm Post subject:
To echo John, back in my college I asked my teacher at the time about gaining consistency. I was finding the same issues, good one day, cr@p the next, woeful if I had a lesson, then fantastic: essentially a roller-coaster ride, which was getting me down at times.
The teacher - Gordon Webb, who at my age had spent a decade as principal trumpet in London Symphony had this paraphrased comment on being consistent.
'It wasn't until my mid 30's I started to feel confident with my consistency. Until then, I had to do my preparation, deal with the uncertainty and just go for it.'
I agree with him. I am now more consistent (if playing more at a full time teacher standard) and suffer far less from those 'bad days'.
cheers
Andy _________________ so many horns, so few good notes
Joined: 01 Mar 2012 Posts: 35 Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:50 pm Post subject:
Here's a great consistency exercise I learned from a member of the Chicago Symphony. Pick something to play and just play it until you miss a note, or scratch, or chip the attack, you decide how picky you want to be. When you chip a note, you have to go back to the beginning and start over. Towards the end of the page, the stakes get higher and higher! Now the key is not to treat this as a punishment exercise, but more as a way to discover what it takes to play every note consistently. For me, I found it requires a certain level of just playing freely and confidently, or at least as if I was confident. If I'm too careful, that's when I chip a note. When you can make it to the end of the page most of the time you will have figured out a lot of things!
2. Take time to notice when you do something well. Make a detailed mental picture of everything about how it felt, how it sounded etc. Build a mental library of those things. Your body will remember how to recreate it. A good time to review those memories is when you are about to go to sleep and you're nice and relaxed. If something goes badly, just forget about it.
3. From another CSO member, you can play one note for a very long time. Heck I've done one note for a half hour or longer. Turn the lights out. After you get past your brain literally screaming at you to stop, you really start to notice some things about that note. You start getting really comfortable with that note. Play that note a lot for a week or so until it's the very best note on your horn. Next week, go a half step higher.
4. Phrase all your desires in positive form. "play that note" (with a good mental picture) works a whole lot better than "don't miss that note". Our brains are not good at processing negative info. We tend to interpret "don't miss" as "miss". Say "play it again" rather than "try it again". Expect success!!
Joined: 12 Jan 2005 Posts: 1535 Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:19 pm Post subject:
Trumpet_Lover wrote:
Quote:
TCË Just take it easy...is just music......we are trying to help. Good look
Trumpet_Lover, you may believe that all of us are "just trying to help" and I'm not denying that people mean well, but I think here, as in many TH threads, there are people who have an axe to grind and grind it they do. Some of this stuff is very personal to people and it evidently satisfies some personal need to trot out our stories and wag a finger at someone, especially when that person is a younger one.
While I appreciate that many young people are inconsistent about practice, personal habits, etc., I think a lot of what's being discussed here is an assumption, and you know what they say about assume.
I think it is fine to say something once or to ask a gentle, probing question, but to beat a dead horse and pile on and imply that this OP is not taking the best care of himself, not getting enough sleep, not practicing consistently enough, etc., etc., is just jumping to a conclusion.
Yes, there are a lot of young people who are not consistent or disciplined enough, but there are some who are quite consistent and work very hard. It seems to me the jury is still out on whether what the OP is discussing is due to consistency problems in personal habits, practice, or some other issue.
I don't know why people will talk down to someone on a forum, particularly a young person, and pull rank in a way they wouldn't be caught dead doing in person. In business, this kind of behavior would not lead to success could quite possibly get you fired. _________________ royjohn
Trumpets: 1928 Holton Llewellyn Model, 1957 Holton 51LB, 2010 Custom C by Bill Jones, 2011 Custom D/Eb by Bill Jones
Flugels: 1975 Olds Superstar, 1970's Elkhardt, 1970's Getzen 4 valve
Cornet: 1970's Yamaha YCR-233S . . . and others . . .
I am amazed that nobody has answered your question yet.
A routine of sorts with waking up, going to bed, working out... helps because on days when we are tired ALL of our muscles are sluggish. (YES even your embouchure muscles.) Being physically tired will affect your playing.
A longer consistent warm up helps because a warm up is how we get rid of the damage we did yesterday. If your warm up is too short or difficult then you never really get the stiffness out and the embouchure doesn't respond at 100%.
Playing as high as you can some days, while good for building range, also creates stiffness in the embouchure muscles and for most people this means they have a few bad days while recovering.
You can learn the knack of playing high at a young age but it takes years for the body to really adapt to it so that it can be done daily without causing problems.
You are on the right track. It takes time and longer and more gentle warm-ups to get through the bad days. (Meaning if things are going badly warm-up again and again. Relaxing the lips and face help to improve those days. _________________ Clint 'Pops' McLaughlin
New Arban Book http://www.NewArban.com
Video Courses, Ebooks, Skype Lessons http://BbTrumpet.com
Trumpet Ezine http://www.BbTrumpetNews.com
From one high school kid to another. (Well I just graduated!) But I had the same problem and still do a little. For me if you just play the same thing every day then you'll be good. Consistency comes with playing a consistent routine. Now I understand thats not possible every day with marching band and concert band, but whenever I have tough days in band I come home and do some clarke studies, softly, and once Im tired Im done. I might do a little later, but if not I do a warm down always. Low soft stuff and pedal tones. You have a better range than me but one day I was playing awesome and did lots of high stuff, above high c, and couldnt play good for a week. So when you warm up and do excercises you can play these, but don't over do it. Right now you dont need it, so if its gonna hurt you why do it? This might not help at all, maybe it will. But you're still in high school, if you can figure out what is causing this now all will be good. And also as Pops said, sleep does help dont call him crazy, it gives your muscles time to recover.
Joined: 28 May 2010 Posts: 134 Location: Denton, TX
Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 10:40 am Post subject:
Consistency comes from consistent daily practice that includes a healthy dose of fundamental work.
Just remember, as you gain consistency, your highs will come down and your lows will come up until your ability meets in the middle somewhere. Then, and only then, will you really start to mature and develop and get better.
Joined: 05 Jun 2004 Posts: 7487 Location: The land of GR and Getzen
Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:37 am Post subject:
Many great answers already. I will say that in my own playing, there were mechanical things I did on good playing days that I didn't know about, that I didn't do on bad playing days. Note that this is all completely independent of chop issues such as strain from playing too high or too long or too loud, or chops just being stiff and unresponsive. Having said that, it's also true that good mechanics tend to break down under fatigue.
BUILD UP, DON'T TEAR DOWN
It's ok to take a light playing day, esp when things are going poorly, even as often as every other day. Look at the Boptism publishing website, which is only different from what everybody else has said about stressing fundamentals in the sense that you can do different routines every day - and this has definitely helped me! It develops a more rounded approach to playing, so that you're pushing your limits in every playing area, daily. You probably only need to touch on high notes occasionally, just to make sure they're still working.
Joined: 30 Jun 2011 Posts: 33 Location: WHO CARES?
Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 8:40 pm Post subject:
``I am amazed that nobody has answered your question yet. ´´
Well...sorry but there are a very good suggestions on this.....patience and quality of practice not quantity.....I put some Ideas from Allen Vizzutti 1st book, I think that this is very fine work by the master.....is not my suggestion but Allen, is this not enough? _________________ Time for practice!
Sonare TR9-Bys Trumpet
V.Bach Mercedes Trumpet
Getzen Flugelhorn
Bach 1.5 open
Bob Reeves 41S
Joined: 26 Jan 2012 Posts: 402 Location: Point O' Woods / Old Lyme, Connecticut
Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:56 am Post subject:
One of The Most Exciting Truths About Playing the Trumpet
" When you say, "Good morning, trumpeter." You don't have to analyze your tongue movement, your lip formation, or anything else. You just say it. You are able to do this because throughout your lifetime you have formed the syllables that make up these words so many hundreds and thousands of times that saying the sentence is automatic. When you have practiced all the notes (tongue levels), etc. on your trumpet as many times as you have practiced the syllables that make up the words "Good morning...," you will miss about as often as you would "miss" in greeting your neighbor. To me, that's exciting!"
B.B. Knvitt
" Claude Gordon went 15 years without missing a days practice."
Jeff Purtle
Joined: 03 Oct 2011 Posts: 10 Location: Kansas City, MO
Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:23 am Post subject:
I think this is all awesome advice. I'm struggling with the same thing. I've decided that I just won't let myself accept anything but the best. If I'm doing a flow study and I chip a note, I'll play that study multiple times until I've done it correctly and consistently
``I am amazed that nobody has answered your question yet. ´´
Well...sorry but there are a very good suggestions on this.....patience and quality of practice not quantity.....I put some Ideas from Allen Vizzutti 1st book, I think that this is very fine work by the master.....is not my suggestion but Allen, is this not enough?
NOBODY including YOU attempted to answer the 3 times he asked WHY a physical routine was important, WHY health mattered and WHY playing high could cause problems.
(Those were what I answered but then you READ the post. Right?)
As soon as he started asking WHY; that told us he didn't know who he was talking to and he didn't understand the value of the advice.
Him actually asking more than once told us that it was doubtful he would try the advice. He even wrote that himself.
Part of teaching is being able to tell them the value of ideas. You often have to convince people to try ideas. A lot of people will NOT try something until they are told WHY they should do it
Name dropping is usually not effective. They very often don't know the famous player or teacher that is being mentioned.
He kept asking why should he do this or try this and people kept ignoring that. I was amazed at that. It is fairly common at his age to question things. _________________ Clint 'Pops' McLaughlin
New Arban Book http://www.NewArban.com
Video Courses, Ebooks, Skype Lessons http://BbTrumpet.com
Trumpet Ezine http://www.BbTrumpetNews.com
Joined: 20 May 2002 Posts: 4072 Location: Atlanta, GA
Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 8:51 am Post subject:
enricodemilito wrote:
In my experience as a STUDENT, I notice a HUGE improvement in my playing by starting to write down a DIARY.
I use this tool daily and I write down the evening before what I want to accomplish in the next day (most probably would be what I will focus on) and during the day I will actually write down everything I'm doing with the trumpet.
I take a small part in the end of the page (if you find a software as "Opus Domini" for Mac it will be easier) for write COMMENTS on my playing and useful thought that I will use during the day or in the next day.
In this way pretty soon you will have a complete view of what you did and you didn't do in the last week, what you did in the last month and what you need to work on the next month.
For me it works, it takes a bit of time during the practice section and a bit of organization, but I think it's a really useful tool.
I hope it can help you too!
This is EXTREMELY useful. It keeps you honest. Write out what you want to accomplish, devise a plan of attack, then go after it. If success is elusive, re-evaluate and devise a new plan of attack. Physical care is important, period...it needs no explanation or defense, really.
However, some of the best, most consistent musicians through history (SOME...not ALL) seem to defy all logic in this area...they are at the top of the game in spite of driving their bodies into the ground. I say this NOT to discount the importance of physical health, but to suggest that there might be something that trumps it.
This thing is the MIND. Earlier, Derek Reaban linked to a thread concerning a Hal Galper masterclass. Here is the youtube for that video.
Having a good routine that covers all the fundamentals is like a car...it is capable of taking you wherever you want to go, but it needs something. FUEL.
How you think about your music...how engaged you are at every second while you play...having some sort of musical statement or goal at all times (even in boring, routine scale exercises)... this is the FUEL for the car.
To quote my good friend, Tom Gibson, music is a metaphor for something else. Check this out - http://tbonegib.podbean.com/. Read Episodes 172, 173, and 174.
Now, I am a freelance player. Myself or any of the folks I play with on a regular basis might be on a tour bus with a band Thurs-Sunday, playing 3 1-hr shows a night, at different clubs in different cities in the same night at times, ending at 3-4am every night. The next week, there might weddings, 3rd part in an orchestra, brass band gigs, church gigs, recording sessions, brass quintet gigs...you name it. We have to be on our toes all the time. This type of "regimen" might go on for months on end. What is it that keeps us consistent (read: game-fully employed) when physical and mental demands change so drastically all the time?
Hmmmm....
Think about it...
Paul _________________ "Every time I hear you play, you sound better than the next..."
Joined: 26 Jan 2012 Posts: 402 Location: Point O' Woods / Old Lyme, Connecticut
Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:03 pm Post subject:
" The deepest level of knowing your instrument is reached when you can mentally "hear" a piece of music, and instantly play it on your horn, at any tempo, in any key, and in any range, without having had to think about it. It is at this point, that the horn has become an extension of the player, and the trumpeter is in effect, singing through the trumpet."
As explained by W.Knevitt
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