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Pencils and ChopSticks



 
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Jerry Freedman
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Joined: 29 Jan 2002
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Location: Burlington, Massachusetts

PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 3:44 am    Post subject: Pencils and ChopSticks Reply with quote

Reinhardt apparently approved of the pencil exercise. I have done it on and off for years. Now, since I have to take some time off playing due to surgery I have some questions:

1) Did Reinhardt have any restrictions about who should or should not do it ( upstreamers vs downstreamers)

2) Did he recommend it daily, few times a week etc

What about ChopSticks? I have nothing but good things to say about the pencil exercise and Chopsticks seem to be an extension ( different wweights, more elaborate movement etc)
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zachman727
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Joined: 08 May 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The pencil exercise is meant to be done daily, along with buzzing and the Jaw Retention Drill. These three, when done correctly, are beneficial for all types, but you have to be careful to buzz correctly.

I would recommend not using anything heavier than a pencil. I am not sure of the source for this, but there is a story of someone who built the exercise up to use drumsticks, and it completely killed his chops, so, unless the experts here say otherwise, I would stick to pencils.
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AJCarter
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zachman727 wrote:

I would recommend not using anything heavier than a pencil. I am not sure of the source for this, but there is a story of someone who built the exercise up to use drumsticks, and it completely killed his chops, so, unless the experts here say otherwise, I would stick to pencils.


Wouldn't the distribution of the weight be the problem in the drumstick story? it's much longer than a pencil and you're having to exert more force to keep the entire item out straight. I'm imagining it like this.. you can pick up a broom and hold it out with one hand... or you can try and pick up telephone pole and hold it with one hand. That was a very extreme simile to use, but it makes the point.

Jerry, do you have any of Reinhardt's pedagogical materials (books or a teacher who was a student of his) that give you instructions on how to do the exercises properly? perhaps the chopsticks if used carefully could be beneficial.
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jwilson46
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like to use the wooden chop stick because of the smooth tapered end. Or you can cut the larger square end off to simulate the thickness of a pencil. You can cut off the opposite end to equal the the length of the pencil you normally use. It depends on which end you place between the lips. Personally I don't cut it at all and put the tapered end between the lips.

A pencil the size you use for Putt Putt golf is in the back of my mind but I don't remember if Reinhardt recommended a specific size. Should the pencil be sharpened somewhat or not (I don't think so)? Do you put the leaded end or eraser end (if it has one) between the lips? Do you need a round pencil or the typical hexagonal pencil? I went with the chop stick because I like sushi and it gives me more reason to eat it....lol.

Does anyone have a reason why a chop stick shouldn't be used?

John
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Doug Elliott
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now that's funny...

John, I guess you don't know about the comercial product called Chop-sticks that is sold for doing that exercise.

I like your idea better.

I'll have my Trio of Daily Calisthenics with a side of Yellowtail and Unagi.


Last edited by Doug Elliott on Sun Jun 24, 2012 9:49 am; edited 1 time in total
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zachman727
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My only reason to stick with pencils was to avoid overworking the muscles. Chopsticks that are similar in size to a pencil should be fine. The Encyclopedia says unsharpened, and that either end can be used. Since you can use the round eraser or the hexagonal end, shape shouldn't matter. I don't know anything about pencil size, but I have been using just a standard #2 pencil. A golf pencil seems like a good "beginner" routine, since it is lighter and shorter, so that the unused muscles are not strained.

AJCarter, that is exactly what I was talking about. The drumstick is longer and heavier, requiring more force, and the muscles build to a point where an embouchure formation is impossible.
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Jerry Freedman
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The exercises done with chopsticks (in manual that comes with them) are more than just holding the chopstick with your chops for x amount of time. There is a lot more to be done ( raising and lowering, moving the chopstick in circles etc).
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razeontherock
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I've never seen the chopsticks nor their instructions, I do have a Warburton PETE. Those have been received well by the Rheinhardt guys, and someone else suggested if you found the right size button and threaded it, you could come up with the only resistance you can't get with a pencil
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jwilson46
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
John, I guess you don't know about the comercial product called Chop-sticks that is sold for doing that exercise.

I like your idea better.

I'll have my Trio of Daily Calisthenics with a side of Yellowtail and Unagi.


Yes!!! Yellowtail and Unagi are two of my favorites along with a German Riesling. I also have some saki brought back from Japan.

You're right. I wasn't aware of the product chop-sticks. I'm a little wary of these commercially produced products. The best lead player I ever had the privilege of playing under was showing me his Tone Intensifer before a gig. He played a powerful high C without it and then with it. I couldn't tell the difference. He sounded great years before it and afterwards.

Reinhard talked about the various "gimmicky" aids that appeared throughout the years. I remember him chuckling and saying, like mouthpieces, there are players who buy all the latest things to "improve" their playing but he didn't seem impressed with most of them.

I'm not criticizing chop-sticks because I'm unaware of what the product is. I do question the various motions from its manual. It doesn't sound like Reinhardt.

John
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