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cornet74
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 504
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 Posted: Fri May 15, 2015 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| delano wrote: | So, a lot of noise. First:
shofarguy:
I have owned three flugelhorn and each of them played more in tune than almost any Bb trumpet I've played
My conclusion (paraphrasing): I can't imagine a better argument for telling you that it's time for you to look for a better trumpet!
Cheiden obviously didn't read my posts, I said twice that if you have a job for a flugel then you have a good reason to purchase one. Nakariakov is another example of a born flugelplayer, I think he is even better on the (4-valve) flugel than on trumpet.
Chris Botti makes it problematic, two posters thinks he is too good to use as an example, one can't take me seriously because he is too lousy. My point of view is that CB is some kind of authority as an instrumentalist and for the subject of tastehe is a musician with the humility to present himself as a pop-musician without false pretentions.
For the record, I don't claim to know The Truth, I meant truth only in the meaning of to be honest on your instrument, not using your horn as a tool to lie. |
Whatever you may feel about CB, he is an excellent jazz trumpet player. I have a CD of him and Michael Brecker and it is great straight ahead playing. Like me, CB was also a student of Woody Shaw. I can tell you straight out that Woody had no time for people who couldn't play. He could have cared less who you had played with, but in his own words, "can you play?? !!"
How CB has led his career is his business. But he can certainly play. When he wants to. The same is true of Chuck M. But not to the extent of CB, at least to these ears.
Thank you.
_________________
Now:
Yamaha 203 Tenor Horn
Bach, Wick, Yamaha Mouthpieces
Wick Wooden Tenor Horn Straight Mute |
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delano
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Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 3118
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2015 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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So now you see how difficult it is to keep a straight line here.
In fact I like Chris Botti very much for his awsome playing, his dedication tot the trumpet and his personality. I also heard him live playing and though his sound is then a little more brassy than via de PA it's still a very good trumpet sound. His music may be a little bit too commercial for everybody's taste (and often mine) but I admire the guy for what he achieved.
So cornet74, what's the problem? |
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cornet74
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 504
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| Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 8:07 am Post subject: |
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| delano wrote: | So now you see how difficult it is to keep a straight line here.
In fact I like Chris Botti very much for his awsome playing, his dedication tot the trumpet and his personality. I also heard him live playing and though his sound is then a little more brassy than via de PA it's still a very good trumpet sound. His music may be a little bit too commercial for everybody's taste (and often mine) but I admire the guy for what he achieved.
So cornet74, what's the problem? |
My problem? I don't have one. But it appears, and as others on this thread have pointed out, that you are an embittered person. You set up tautological constructs where you can assign blame; all the while not taking responsibility for your statements. The fact that this thread has morphed from the OPs question to what is being discussed now more than buffers my point. I live in NYC. Players like you, acting as you do here, simply don't work. There are far to many good players who have, or feign, positive attributes. I'd re commend a good therepist where you can work out your issues and then come bCk to the fold in way where your personal power is intact and under control.
Thank you.
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Now:
Yamaha 203 Tenor Horn
Bach, Wick, Yamaha Mouthpieces
Wick Wooden Tenor Horn Straight Mute |
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delano
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 3118
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 9:16 am Post subject: |
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| Cool down baby, cool down. It's not the end of the world. Unfortunately you missed my point completely but may be it's because I am Dutch and sometimes my writing in English is a little bit short. |
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VetPsychWars
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 7196
Location: Greenfield WI
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| Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 11:27 am Post subject: |
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| cornet74 wrote: | | delano wrote: |
So cornet74, what's the problem? |
My problem? I don't have one. But it appears, and as others on this thread have pointed out, that you are an embittered person. |
Classic example of people from different regions talking around each other because the words mean different things from where they come... and not the same thing otherwise.
And, of course, the incredulity and feeling of "what the HECK!?" when the communication is not understoon.
Buy a flügel if you want and can afford it. The Buescher 280 is rare and terrific. The new Gezten 4895 flügle is as good. Perhaps a touch better.
Buy one of those if you want one.
Tom
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1950 Buescher Lightweight 400 Trumpet
1949 Buescher 400 Trumpet
1939 Buescher 400 Cornet
GR65M, GR65 Cor #1 |
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etc-etc
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 6187
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| Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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| danny45635 wrote: | | I tried a flugle at Dillon's that was amazing. I sounded actually good on it, compared to other flugles I have tried. I borrowed my band teachers Yamaha student flugle (which I didn't like at all) for a few concerts I had. It did have a different sound than my trumpet of course, but it was nothing like that flugle I tried at Dillon's (I can't remember the brand). I agree that the flugle horn is completely different. Because it emphasizes lower harmonics (or something like that) it plays pedals way easier and just sounds much more appropriate for some settings. Remember, Chris Botti is Chris Botti, he is godlike in skill compared to all of us and can make a very dark and mellow sound come out of his trumpet. Do what you think is the best thing to do. Hope this helps. |
From now on you will seek for the horn that bests the one unnamed found once at Dillon's. |
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cornet74
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 504
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| Posted: Sun May 17, 2015 6:43 am Post subject: |
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| VetPsychWars wrote: | | cornet74 wrote: | | delano wrote: |
So cornet74, what's the problem? |
My problem? I don't have one. But it appears, and as others on this thread have pointed out, that you are an embittered person. |
Classic example of people from different regions talking around each other because the words mean different things from where they come... and not the same thing otherwise.
And, of course, the incredulity and feeling of "what the HECK!?" when the communication is not understoon.
Buy a flügel if you want and can afford it. The Buescher 280 is rare and terrific. The new Gezten 4895 flügle is as good. Perhaps a touch better.
Buy one of those if you want one.
Tom |
I don't think so. I lived in Europe for ten years. English is not my native language. I borrowed the word "embittered" from another person who posted above. This thread has gone beyond its original subject matter.
I bare no malice to anyone here; rather, I'm glad that I can ask questions and for the most part receive edified and clear answers.
As for the new Getzen flug, it seems like a winner. These is a you tube of someone playing it. I have a late production Couesnon that many have stated were the "best" of those instruments to be made. I would love to play it against the new Getzen, but I'm afraid I would like the Getzen better. And I am not in a financial position to justify the purchase of a new flug.
I know a number of trumpet players who are afraid to try new equipment lest thy like the newer horns more than what they play but are not in a financial position to purchase anything new.
Thank you.
_________________
Now:
Yamaha 203 Tenor Horn
Bach, Wick, Yamaha Mouthpieces
Wick Wooden Tenor Horn Straight Mute |
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MacMichael
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Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 646
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| Posted: Sun May 17, 2015 7:26 am Post subject: |
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| cornet74 wrote: | | VetPsychWars wrote: | | cornet74 wrote: | | delano wrote: |
So cornet74, what's the problem? |
My problem? I don't have one. But it appears, and as others on this thread have pointed out, that you are an embittered person. |
Classic example of people from different regions talking around each other because the words mean different things from where they come... and not the same thing otherwise.
And, of course, the incredulity and feeling of "what the HECK!?" when the communication is not understoon.
Buy a flügel if you want and can afford it. The Buescher 280 is rare and terrific. The new Gezten 4895 flügle is as good. Perhaps a touch better.
Buy one of those if you want one.
Tom |
I don't think so. I lived in Europe for ten years. English is not my native language. I borrowed the word "embittered" from another person who posted above. This thread has gone beyond its original subject matter.
I bare no malice to anyone here; rather, I'm glad that I can ask questions and for the most part receive edified and clear answers. |
I can relate very well to what you write, and English is not my native language either. And yes, I employed the word "embittered" to express my dissatisfaction with the tone being used by one certain user here.
Politeness and fairness (or call it netiquette) should be natural when talking to people, and especially when writing in a public forum on the Net. But you are right again, some people tend to move communication towards an off-topic direction that includes harsh criticism or sarcasm - things you can do very well without.
But enough of that, back to topic:
I am really curious what the OP has decided on... to flugel or to be frugal... 
Last edited by MacMichael on Sun Feb 14, 2016 10:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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nieuwguyski
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Joined: 06 Feb 2002
Posts: 2349
Location: Santa Cruz County, CA
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| Posted: Sun May 17, 2015 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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| danny45635 wrote: | | I tried a flugle at Dillon's that was amazing. I sounded actually good on it, compared to other flugles I have tried. I borrowed my band teachers Yamaha student flugle (which I didn't like at all) for a few concerts I had. It did have a different sound than my trumpet of course, but it was nothing like that flugle I tried at Dillon's (I can't remember the brand). |
I play every week with a guy who plays the Yamaha "student" flugel he bought in high school -- over 30 years ago. The other flugelhorns in the section include an old Yamaha 631 (gold brass bell and no third-slide trigger), the lead player brings either a Calicchio Copper flugel or an old Olds Special flugel (that would be me), and the second player who has been auditioning flugels recently, comparing his classic Getzen Eterna three-valve flugel against a vintage Courtois and a brand-new Schilke.
The thing is that Yamaha "student" flugel sounds great, and he plays it in tune.
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cheiden
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Joined: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 8914
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 8:46 am Post subject: |
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I agree that the Yamaha student flugel plays surprisingly well. I think it's a bit more like playing a trumpet which makes for an even easier transition. If there's a downside it's that the tone, while fine, does not seem as full as the pro models.
And consistent with the previous post, I think that trumpets often worry (sometimes too much) about consistency in a section. While for flugels I like that most everyone who plays them brings something different to the party.
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"I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
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feedback@stomvi-usa
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Joined: 24 Jan 2012
Posts: 433
Location: Newhall California
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arttrumpet
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Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 125
Location: Tarzana,CA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:52 am Post subject: |
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https://youtu.be/r4ZrZqk-RH0
Flugelhorn: is not just a "larger" trumpet, it's a different animal, and should be treated and approached completely different.
Best wishes to all!!!
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"Please support each other, don't say nasty things about other players. Don't forget that GOD is looking at us all the time"
Practicing is the answer!!! |
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chuck in ny
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Joined: 23 Sep 2006
Posts: 3597
Location: New York
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 4:43 am Post subject: |
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i'm with arturo on this one. massive practice is required for the flugel in particular to concentrate its distinct sound. then you have to be practicing the trumpet right along so your dance card is pretty full.
there is no nonpareil flugel that i can determine. there are a fair number of excellent ones and yet more very acceptable ones that you can sound great on nonetheless. |
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GuidoCorona
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Joined: 29 May 2014
Posts: 377
Location: Summerville, SC
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| Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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The CarolBrass Legendary Series flugel horn CFL-7200-GSS-SL seems to be now available. Has anyone tried, listened to, or seen this intriguing horn already?
I have found no discussion of it on TH, or on that other forum yet.
A good description with specs is on the California Music Supply site. . Amongst other things, the description asserts that CFL-7200 has "some of the
most accurate intonation possible in a flugelhorn". This might simply mean that the intonation imprecisions reported by some on the CFL-6xxx series have been addressed with this model.
http://www.carolbrasscms.com/CFL-7200-GSS-Bb-SL.php
No videos or Youtubes of it either anywhere.
So... I canvas the TH community… any Opinions of this new CarolBrass creation?
Regards, Guido
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Cornet: Carolbrass CCR7772R-GSS
Euphoniums: Miraphone M5050. Wessex Festivo
Last edited by GuidoCorona on Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
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rpoutan
Veteran Member
Joined: 29 Jan 2009
Posts: 141
Location: Wausau WI
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| Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| GuidoCorona wrote: | The CarolBrass Legendary Series flugel horn CFL-7200-GSS-SL seems to be now available. Has anyone tried, listened to, or seen this intriguing horn already?
I have found no discussion of it on TH, or on that other forum yet.
A good description with specs is on the California Music Supply site. . Amongst other things, the description asserts that CFL-7200 has "some of the
most accurate intonation possible in a flugelhorn". This might simply mean that the intonation imprecisions reported by some on the CFL-6xxx series have been addressed with this model.
http://www.carolbrasscms.com/CFL-7200-GSS-Bb-SL.php
My Google search came up with one single video of it, performed by Jim Bohm. Unfortunately the YouTube seems to make use of a certain amount of sound processing which modifies the sound of the instrument:
http://www.jimbohm.com/footprints/
Thus I canvas the TH community… any Opinions of this new CarolBrass creation?
Regards, Guido |
Jim Bohm is not playing the new Carolbrass CFL-7200-GSS Legend flugel in this video. It's his older CFL-6200-GSS flugel.
Does anyone know which Stomvi flugel Pacho Flores is playing in the video above? |
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feedback@stomvi-usa
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Posts: 433
Location: Newhall California
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musicman0097
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Joined: 10 Jul 2012
Posts: 601
Location: SF Bay Area, California
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| Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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Anyone have thoughts on the Olds L-12 flugel?
Matthew
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"There are no secrets to success. It is the result of preparation, hard work, learning from failure"- Colin Powell |
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GuidoCorona
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Joined: 29 May 2014
Posts: 377
Location: Summerville, SC
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| Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2015 4:54 am Post subject: |
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Oops... Thank you rpoutan for the correction. I have removed mention of the incorrect video from my original post... So, no Youtubes of CFL-7200 at all on the net?!
G.
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Cornet: Carolbrass CCR7772R-GSS
Euphoniums: Miraphone M5050. Wessex Festivo |
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Alan H
Regular Member
Joined: 25 Jun 2015
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:30 am Post subject: |
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I just bought an ACB Doubler flugelhorn from Trents ebay store.
Seeing as I'm coming into this with a very basic trumpet background and the only flugelhorn I've played AT ALL is a 70's era Getzen, I just went with all you lads/lasses comments that the "Doubler" is a solid horn, if not "fancy" that plays better than lots of horns that cost twice as much.
So, we shall see! |
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Jodyj
New Member
Joined: 09 Mar 2015
Posts: 5
Location: Saginaw mi.
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| Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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Seems that most have forgotten why you got into playing in the first place. For the Love of making music and becoming the best you can be - I also am a beginning trumpet player and also just acquired a 78 Getzen 895 that I just love. Try before you buy yes and it just comes down to what sounds good to your ear. As for me "I'm a Getzen fan and maybe Someday a Getzen Artist, but that's along time down the road. And as I'm 62 , might not get there but am going to love trying
Getzen 390
Getzen 700 Eterna II
Getzen Eterna 895S |
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