Can I buy and install new springs myself?

trumpet_bob_silver · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 Jan 2005 Posts: 1155

Bach Strad, standard classical model, whichever one that is.

I thought my valves seemed a little sluggish. I cleaned my trumpet but they still feel that way, if not more sore. (Actually computer keyboard feels sluggish too...

)

I saw a youtube video with replacing a whole valve spring mechanism that came apart. That was just a screw on top. It's not quite the same on my trumpet.

I haven't had my trumpet professionally cleaned for... probably ten years now... There's not a place nearby that's professional that I would trust. But when I had it cleaned in the past, I believe they were replacing springs and valve caps standard with the cleaning.

Can I just buy some new (regular) springs and somehow unscrew my valve and add the springs in? Does it matter which springs I get in terms of brand? I saw someone posting about light Bach strad springs. I'd want regular or even something with more punch to it for sure. I just want them to pop back up with a ltitle more oomph than they're doing now.

Also, is it normal to wear springs out or should I never or very rarely have to replace springs? If my valves are sluggish and it's not actually the springs (if spring replacing isn't normal) then maybe there's something corroded or solidifying on the valves that's doing it. I think the springs probably need to be replaced though.

Any suggestions on where to buy new springs?

Should I get the spring guides too if I'm adding in new springs? A whole spring kit?

My second valve I've noticed tends to feel stickier if I sit in an ensemble with the horn tilted. I think that causes it. Something with spit moving in there I think. After cleaning it, I'm noticing the third valve being a little more sluggish though tonight. It might work itself out, but I remembered, I think, springs being replaced in the past.

Danbassin · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 11:44 pm Post subject:

Yes, you can replace your valve springs. Since you own a Bach Strad, a quick internet search will bring you several options for a genuine Bach 'care kit.' Do not attempt to replace your valve springs with anything other that valve springs specifically designed for your model trumpet. Genuine Bach is probably best, though some aftermarket custom options surely exist which are designed to outperform OEM.

Now, this said, valve springs are very rarely the issue when it comes to sluggish valves. Consider your regular cleaning and care regimen. You say it's been a decade since your horn has been serviced, which is fine so long as you give the horn a bath every few months, and scrub out your leadpipe, slides, and, yes, valve casings. A conscientious repair tech is likely to replace your valve springs following a complete cleaning and service of your instrument, as issues from general wear to less-than diligent maintenance can cause some small issues with the valves which can lead to unequal strain on your springs. Cleaning and servicing the instrument will ultimately address whatever issues may be at hand, and replacing the valve springs acts as a good, uniform 'reset.'

So, I've answered your question with a quick, direct answer, and a longer detailed explanation of what we should all keep mindful of as stewards of finely-crafted tools for artistic expression. One final note, however, is that I'm unsure of what you described when it came to the differences you saw in your valve construction when compared with the youtube video you saw. Things should be fairly uniform among Bach Strads, and frankly most valves are put together in quite a similar fashion.
So, I recommend that you try to find a tech in the near-term, but if it's been a long, long while, get your horn in the tub with some generic dish soap (avoid ones with hand softeners and so-forth), and get to the routine maintenance that keeps the horn happy. There are undoubtedly dozens of instructional videos for this process available on the internet, as well. I recommend doing this when you order a Bach 'care kit' as they'll have some valve felts you should probably also swap-out.

Best of luck!

-DB
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zaferis · Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:35 am Post subject:

good stuff from Danbassin...

there are also several videos that show you decent processes of cleaning your trumpet.. something you should be doing much more often. I did three trumpets yesterday and it didn't take me more than about an hour.

Since you haven't done it in so long, I would also add a good chunck of time soaking in warm watter (dismantled) and a couple cups of white vinegar... this will break up some of the thicker junk... then rinse and wash as directed.

+1 on a Bach "care kit"
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trombahonker · Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 5:19 am Post subject:

Switch valve oils, try 5 Starr. Sounds like build up of gook in your casings.

New springs are easy, you can buy them from mouthpiece express, or Doctor Valve. Get Bach OEM.

VetPsychWars · Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 5:48 am Post subject:

If you haven't had your trumpet cleaned by a professional in a while, it might be time. I don't even bother to clean them myself any more, I just carry it to Charlie Melk. Definitely worth the expense.

Tom
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roynj · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Oct 2002 Posts: 2065

trumpet_bob_silver · Heavyweight Member Joined: 08 Jan 2005 Posts: 1155

Yep, no professional clean for a long time. I've cleaned my horn myself. That usually takes me 3-4 hours and kills my fingers and back though. That's from leaning over and trying polish or scrub away anything sticking on the horn or that gets discolored.

I got daring and opened my valves. That's just as simple as the youtube video I watched. It was only finger tight. I carefully stretched the spring out a little and that seemed to help.

I'm wondering though, if I take the spring and valve guide out, can I just soak the whole valve? I've always been careful about water around the valves but I guess it's just the felt, or potentially getting liquid inside the valve in case it wouldn't dry out right away.

It could be the placebo effect, maybe stronger fingers, or I'm wondering if some residue from cleaning got into the valves. Even with the extra slight stretch in the springs, it's more like my fingers come up faster than the valve is coming up.

trumpaholic · Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 2:59 am Post subject:

Stretching springs is not the answer to any valve issues. IMO, the very best replacement springs for Bach Strad's are made by Brass Sound Creation, made in Germany by Tomomi Kato. For Bach, I suggest his steel springs which are fantastic, the regular bronze springs are certainly an improvement over Bach springs. I know several places in the US carries them, Osmun for sure in the East.

Trump
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Brad361 · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:52 am Post subject:

Bucaneer61 · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:41 am Post subject:

For what it's worth to the OP, I have a 1925 Conn 28B Concert Grand that, as far as I know, has never had the springs replaced. Springs don't wear out, IMO. My 1970 Selmer Paris Radial also has the original springs and the valve action on that horn is absolutely fantastic. Something else must be involved with the OP's horn..
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Conn 28B Concert Grand Bb - 1925
Martin Handcraft Imperial - 1937

cheiden · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:41 pm Post subject:

ML52K · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:14 pm Post subject:

There are several cleaners designed just for cleaning valves:

http://warburton-usa.com/index.php/clean-stroke-valve-wash

https://www.prestovalves.com/

This may be a direction to go to if valves are still sticky after a good bath. If really good cleaning doesn't change things tech consultation may be indicated.

etc-etc · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 6180

1jazzyalex · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:44 pm Post subject:

etc-etc · Heavyweight Member Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 6180

At least it is not an Upright Grand.

Bucaneer61 · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:43 pm Post subject:

Well, it depends upon whether or not I point the bell toward the sky. In that case, I assume it could be an Upright Concert Grand. On a more serious note, it was made for only a few years in the 20's and features a .484 bore on the lower slide leg and, I think, a .460 or so bore on the top leg. Wonderful horn - very easy to play and in great shape for a horn that old.
_________________
Selmer Radial Bb ML - Jan., 1972
Selmer Radial C XL - Jan., 1972
Getzen 580S cornet - c. 1973
Blessing Artist Flugelhorn, rose brass bell
Accent Picc by B & S
Conn 28B Concert Grand Bb - 1925
Martin Handcraft Imperial - 1937

Bstradivarius

1jazzyalex · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:31 pm Post subject:

Branson · Heavyweight Member Joined: 26 Jan 2011 Posts: 503

http://www.thetrumpetblog.com/put-a-spring-in-your-playing/
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