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dbanks
Regular Member
Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 37
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 Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:14 pm Post subject: Re: flugel mouthpiece |
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| Benge.nut wrote: | | iiipopes wrote: | | santiagomusic wrote: | | dbanks wrote: | | Whats wrong with a good ol Bach fluegel mpc? Ive been using one for years |
Bach flugel MPs are fine. I also play a bach 7C Fl but it doesn't give me the dark sound I like. However, it is easier to play up to a high C. I've never had chops on flugel. |
I tried a Bach flugel mouthpiece in my Queenie. It wobbled until I couldn't play it. The intonation was off, due to the differences in the receiver and leadpipe, and the tone was fuzzy.
I know folks who play Bach flugels, or even some others, where the Bach mouthpiece works very well, indeed. But not on my Queenie. As with everything else, YMMV. |
A Bach flugel mp shouldn't fit in a Couesnon receiver. If it does the receiver has been worked on or replaced, or the mp shank has had work done to it.
You need a french mp shank to fit in a French flugelhorn receiver. Bach mouthpieces have a different length and taper. |
Thanks for the info. I guess my receiver has been worked on and Ive had it since the late 1970's. Most guys Ive known over the years with Couesnon flugels use a standard mouthpiece so I guess their shanks have been modified also. |
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B. Scriver
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Jan 2002
Posts: 1204
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 7:30 am Post subject: |
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The task of fitting an old Couesnon Flugelhorn receiver with a mouthpiece shank is going to very tough. Can you just order one and have it fit? Maybe, usually not. Why, it's a straight shank and the diameters vary, age and wear from putting Bach or other (.050" taper mouthpieces) tapered mouthpieces will deform the Straight Shank French Taper. Nothing fits it correctly after this has happened.
Can you get a mpc shank made for it? Yes, custom to fit that specific leadpipe perfectly and may or may not fit other Straight Shank leadpipes.
Often the French Straight Shank Mpcs are made with a smaller diameter and they have a taper that locks only about the last 1/8 inch. This is not ideal. We have tried it all from custom fitting so tight that .0002 thickness in plating caused an issue to using an O-ring. All these fixes are band-aids that only work for one horn and one mouthpiece. The cost is high.
The last one I made French Taper leadpipe was a GR/Melk Couesnon a certain player that had his FL redone. He wanted for his horn to be used with a specific mpc with the French Taper. I think he already had the GR/Melk tapered leadpipe. I had the mouthpiece to fit it too that was hand made. With careful measuring, doing test run, the fit was perfect. This took hours. I will not be making another one, took too much time, didn't charge for it as the cost would be too great, and is not worth it unless you have deep pockets and want to pay time and material.
"A Bach flugel mp shouldn't fit in a Couesnon receiver. If it does the receiver has been worked on or replaced, or the mp shank has had work done to it."
A Bach mpc will go into the Couesnon and if you crank on it, over time it will form the receiver to it. This is not ideal as the seal will not be great.
"Go to mouthpieceexpress.com and click through all the flugelhorn mouthpiece offerings. Several (Curry, Marcinkiewicz, Stork) list Couesnon taper as an option. Others probably offer it as well but only as custom."
To do a custom like this they will need your leadpipe if you really want a proper fit.
There is another option if you choose! GR and Charlie Melk looked at this years ago because frustration trying to fit all these old horns . No matter how much work went into fitting the Couesnon shank to the receiver there were always problems with this deforming from using the wrong taper and age.
http://grmouthpieces.com/leadpipes.html
Therefore, GR and Charlie designed a new Couesnon FL leadpipe with the Standard .050" taper per inch to fit the tapered shanks. This pipe will fit the GR FL and FD shank. This is an option if you get frustrated.
We have found the older Couesnon horns may have had the front end of the horn altered. No problem Charlie can fix that if the horn is worth fixing.
Gary Radtke
www.grmouthpieces.com |
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Benge.nut
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Mar 2017
Posts: 695
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2017 7:58 am Post subject: |
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| The "grind it till you find it" approach with a Bach mouthpiece or another brand seems to have destroyed a lot of Couesnon receivers. |
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BuddyRogersMusic
New Member
Joined: 03 Aug 2017
Posts: 6
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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| Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:14 am Post subject: Stork MP |
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| I have used a Stork MP for my Couesnon flugel and it has worked well for me. |
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Tony Scodwell
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2005
Posts: 1961
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 9:31 am Post subject: Bach flugel mouthpieces |
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For what it's worth concerning Bach flugel mouthpieces (nothing to do with a proper fit in Couesnons) I have found over the years with a bit of trial and error that the optimum throat size for a Bach flugel piece is an 18 drill. They come stock with a 22 throat and although OK for most players, the 18 throat doesn't degrade pitch or response but really improves sound quality. Bigger than an 18 throat goes away fast so if you have the drills, go one drill size at a time.
Tony Scodwell
www.scodwellusa.com |
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dupac
Regular Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2012
Posts: 65
Location: Bordeaux, France
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 10:26 am Post subject: |
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A bit expensive though: Monette FLG6 (or another number) in « French taper »...
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