Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 11:44 pm Post subject: Re: Louis Dowdeswell
[quote="Robert P"][quote="trolarg"]how in the hell can he reach such highnotes looking like its nothing?????[/quote]
I wouldn't say it looks like nothing but a lot of it is that he was blessed with the right tools.[/quote]
I wouldn't say it's a blessing but more of some serious hard work and concentration on exactly what he needs to do for the past 10 years of his life.
Sorry I'm late to the party but I thought I should clear some stuff up on here.
I don't usually get involved with conversations like this for obvious reasons.
First off, I'd like to say thanks to everyone that watches the videos and has such positive things to say about them. A HELL of a lot of time is put into it and I appreciate people for recognising that. To all the people that want more videos, we have a few not far from coming out and thanks for being patient with that.
I make YouTube videos for lots of reasons. Callum and I had only planned on doing one, Let it Go, but the response was so positive, we decided to make a series of it.
Please realise too, the music we have decided to cover are VERY popular tunes and this was a tactic we used to build a large following as we were always aware that trumpet videos were a niche thing to produce anyway. We needed some help from somewhere.
For me, making these videos is all about getting a chance to record some of my favourite musicians in the world playing some really well constructed arrangements by Callum Au, mixing them, mastering them and putting the video together. The high note thing is secondary to that and I believe that most people seem to forget about all the other stuff that goes into it.
The main reason I am getting involved with this particular post is that it confuses me when people say that the only thing I release to the world is high notes... if you actually watch all of the video (and not just skip to the high bit at the end) you'll find some middle range stuff in there too, which is another aspect of playing I have spent a tonne of time trying to get together. I was taught that below top C was the "cash" register, and if you can't play in that area of the horn, you won't make any...
For the people who suspect that I am somehow "gifted" and "natural" at playing high notes, I would whole-heartedly disagree. To assume that someone has that kind of privilege takes away from the hours of hard work that the have invested into it. Just because someone can play in that register at a young age, doesn't mean they haven't put the hours in. I know people will disagree with me here, because they for some reason can't imagine anyone else being able to do what they can't do, but there are plenty of amazing young trumpet talents in London at the moment and I can't wait for you all to search for them and hear them. It's pretty special.
Anyway, the last thing I'd like to mention is the fact that I was never planning on doing any of these videos. I (like many people do) said that I wasn't ready to release tracks to the world. Ryan Quigley, my lead trumpet player, very close friend and a complete badass player, told me that I'll never feel ready, so just release them. He was right. We are all trying to get better and aiming for the same goal, but if no one is proactive about it, there wouldn't be any music in the first place.
To me, the most important thing is that I get to play with my favourite people and if these videos give me more chances to do that, then that's cool by me.
Joined: 02 Jan 2002 Posts: 5675 Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:35 am Post subject:
Louis, you've just proven what a class act you are - bravo to you!
I think that a lot of what has made its way into this thread has to do with an assumption that based on the recent vids - "Let it Go," "Go the Distance," "Bridge Over Troubled Water," and that kind of thing - that playing in the stratosphere is the only thing you can do.
They clearly haven't seen this vid of you from when you were 16 or so? I can't play like that NOW, and I've been at this thing for 36 years!
Just keep on keepin on Louis! No matter what, there are going to be naysayers and detractors, (After all, it still happens to Maynard) but the proof is in the career you are building. I'm looking forward to seeing and hearing more from you in the future! _________________ Patrick Gleason
- Jupiter 1600i, ACB 3C, Warburton 4SVW/Titmus RT2
- Brasspire Unicorn C
- ACB Doubler
"95% of the average 'weekend warrior's' problems will be solved by an additional 30 minutes of insightful practice." - PLP
Joined: 04 Oct 2015 Posts: 805 Location: South Carolina
Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:05 pm Post subject:
Quote:
Just keep on keepin on Louis! No matter what, there are going to be naysayers and detractors, (After all, it still happens to Maynard) but the proof is in the career you are building. I'm looking forward to seeing and hearing more from you in the future!
+1
Warm regards,
Grits _________________ Bach Stradivarius 37 (1971)
Schilke HC 1
Getzen 3810 C Cornet
King Master Bb Cornet (1945)
B&S 3145 Challenger I Series Flugelhorn
Life is short; buy every horn you want and die happy.
For the people who suspect that I am somehow "gifted" and "natural" at playing high notes, I would whole-heartedly disagree. To assume that someone has that kind of privilege takes away from the hours of hard work that the have invested into it. Just because someone can play in that register at a young age, doesn't mean they haven't put the hours in.
Gifted doesn't mean it happens with no work. However it's a reality that in all physical endeavors there are going to be those that have a leg up.
Btw, if you're referring to my comments I didn't say you never demonstrate anything besides high notes. Re-review my comments to see what I actually said. However high notes is what the OP was raving about and it's clear that they're a prominent part of your videos.
Quote:
I know people will disagree with me here, because they for some reason can't imagine anyone else being able to do what they can't do
They don't have to imagine they can see for themselves. I disagree with you because I absolutely can imagine someone being able to do something I can't and look at reasons why. If you were to claim that you never saw any of your peers work hard but not get the same results I think you'd be engaging in deep denial.
A fundamental element you're overlooking is that you've never played with anyone's physiognomy other than your own.
Your videos sound fine and it's obvious that a lot of work has gone into them. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Robert P, I think Louis was spot on with what he was saying about hard work; he's obviously known what he's wanted to achieve with playing and worked very hard and efficiently at it which is why he might possibly find it frustrating that people call it a blessing. Two people can do the exactly same amount of practice for however many years and come out with different results and he's clearly approached his hours in a very focused way.
I'm not sure Robert P understood why I posted here. It was to say that all this chat about trumpet is largely irrelevant to me, and I'd rather people listened to the product for what it is. Please show me some examples of you trying to do something positive for the industry, it would give me some context on your opinion I think.
If kids are picking up the horn because of my videos, then I've done my bit. I don't usually waste my time behind a keyboard, for example determining what embouchure type somebody may or may not be utilising, or giving your opinion on what you feel technically proficient actually means, because in the broader scheme of music, it isn't really helping anybody.
Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 1063 Location: New Glasgow, Nova Scotia
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:03 am Post subject:
Way to go, Louis ! Love the videos. Please keep them coming. _________________ GeorgeB
1960s King Super 20 Silversonic
2016 Manchester Brass Custom
1938-39 Olds Recording
1942 Buescher 400 Bb trumpet
1952 Selmer Paris 21 B
1999 Conn Vintage One B flat trumpet
2020 Getzen 490 Bb
1962 Conn Victor 5A cornet
Also, I have "re-reviewed" your comments and this is exactly what you said.
"Maybe he's since developed into a technical beast, I don't claim to have a comprehensive awareness of his work - the only thing I've seen of him are more demonstrations of loud and high. I'll give him credit - his high range is more musically executed than that of many others I've heard."
Please explain how you feel you are being fair about the content I'm producing. If you actually listened to it, the videos are quite varied in register and dynamic.
Joined: 18 Dec 2004 Posts: 80 Location: Hannover, Germany
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:23 am Post subject:
Robert P wrote:
[...]
Quote:
I know people will disagree with me here, because they for some reason can't imagine anyone else being able to do what they can't do
They don't have to imagine they can see for themselves. I disagree with you because I absolutely can imagine someone being able to do something I can't and look at reasons why. If you were to claim that you never saw any of your peers work hard but not get the same results I think you'd be engaging in deep denial.
I believe what Louis is alluding to, is the fact that some people can't imagine anyone else being able to do what they can't do by putting in countless hours of work and committment alone, and therefore rather attribute it to a myth which they call 'Talent".
Quite independently of whether such a thing as "Talent" - in the sense of a mystical unique unexplainable physical trait - exists, the above attitude is exactly the mind set that will guarantee that you will not be able to grow to and possibly exceed your limits and therefore act as self fulfilling prophecy. If anything, Talent is a mindset, the willingness to pursue your dreams and goals and do whatever is necessary to reach them, to take set backs as feedback to learn from and keep on going no matter what.
I find it almost condescending to wash away the countless hours of practice, immense continues effort and adament tenacity someone has put in to reach a certain skill level in any disipline by announcing that this must be the result of a natural ability rather than a developed skill.
Maybe there is some small portion of insurmountable genetic preposition that stops someone to reach a certain cream-of-the-crop skill level. But it is my firm believe that trumpeters too often hold the believe that they just don't have the talent (whatever that is) to do a certain thing and by that actually creating the very limit stopping them from exploring their potential that would have otherwise not been there. And it is particular sad when trumpet teachers instill this believe in their students.
Violinist Aex Krob has stated:
"When people tell me. 'God has blessed you with the gift of music', you're damn right I get offended. I did not practice hours a day for eigteen years to have my success atrributed to a myth."
While this, I believe, was meant as a criticism of Religion, it equally applies to the myth of Talent.
Last edited by dobs on Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:27 am; edited 1 time in total
Also, I have "re-reviewed" your comments and this is exactly what you said.
"Maybe he's since developed into a technical beast, I don't claim to have a comprehensive awareness of his work - the only thing I've seen of him are more demonstrations of loud and high. I'll give him credit - his high range is more musically executed than that of many others I've heard."
Please explain how you feel you are being fair about the content I'm producing. If you actually listened to it, the videos are quite varied in register and dynamic.
Who agrees?
Yeah, Louis, plain as day!
Robert
Quote:
Btw, if you're referring to my comments I didn't say you never demonstrate anything besides high notes. Re-review my comments to see what I actually said.
RobertP
Quote:
the only thing I've seen of him are more demonstrations of loud and high.
The standard of musicianship you show, your production skills etc... superb. Keep em coming, Louis!!
Also, I have "re-reviewed" your comments and this is exactly what you said.
"Maybe he's since developed into a technical beast, I don't claim to have a comprehensive awareness of his work - the only thing I've seen of him are more demonstrations of loud and high. I'll give him credit - his high range is more musically executed than that of many others I've heard."
Please explain how you feel you are being fair about the content I'm producing. If you actually listened to it, the videos are quite varied in register and dynamic.
I never said there was anything wrong with what you're producing. I never said it sounded bad or poorly played. I'll state again that it sounds great. The focus is my response to the OP - he asked "how does he do it?" specifically related to high notes as if it were some unfathomable mystery.
You've specifically dismissed the notion that some people have a knack, gift, advantage for doing a particular thing - in this case playing high - apparently because you think it's some insult to you. Not an insult, just reality. I assert that whether playing high notes, stuffing a basketball, running 100 yard dash, powerlifting etc. - work/practice/training is part of the equation, it's not the whole story. To claim otherwise is absurd. Again, did you not know others who also worked at it who didn't achieve the same results as far as high notes? I'm guessing you did. Again, you've never played with anyone's physiognomy but your own. You can claim it doesn't make a difference, there's a mountain of evidence that it does. I have direct personal experience that physical attributes make a difference. I had my teeth altered which made an immediate difference.
When I say what I've seen are demonstrations of high notes - to clarify, that's not synonymous with saying I've never heard anything below a C on the staff which is self-evident from watching the videos - but focusing on the aspect that people pick up on - such as the OP.
People posted video of a couple of things you played when you were younger. Concerto For Trumpet, Maynard Ferguson, presumably to prove a point. What it really did was prove my point. I don't know the full extent of what you can do now but it was clear that your capacity for playing high was well ahead of your technical facility. That's not an insult, it's an objective observation. In high school you already had more usable range than Harry James ever did, but you weren't even close to him technically and musically. Do *you* think it was the equal of Harry's renditions? The other video showed you had the requisite range to play Maynard Ferguson but as a whole it was very much a work in progress. "But he was just a high school kid". Again, the point is clearly the high notes obviously came to you relatively easily in comparison to your peers. Maybe you knew someone somewhere who could play even higher, it still remains that compared to most of your peers, it came more readily to you. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Flugel
Last edited by Robert P on Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:27 am; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 03 May 2005 Posts: 8951 Location: Monument, CO
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:45 am Post subject:
"You don't have to blow out another's candle to make your own shine brighter." _________________ "After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
Joined: 18 Dec 2004 Posts: 80 Location: Hannover, Germany
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:21 am Post subject:
Robert P wrote:
I assert that whether playing high notes, stuffing a basketball, running 100 yard dash, powerlifting etc. - work/practice/training is part of the equation, it's not the whole story.
What exactly do you consider the other part of the story?
I assert that whether playing high notes, stuffing a basketball, running 100 yard dash, powerlifting etc. - work/practice/training is part of the equation, it's not the whole story.
What exactly do you consider the other part of the story?
If you seriously need to ask that after reading what I've already said - and what I assume most people are generally aware of - you're not going to be satisfied with any answer I give you. _________________ Getzen Eterna Severinsen
King Silver Flair
Besson 1000
Bundy
Chinese C
Getzen Eterna Bb/A piccolo
Chinese Rotary Bb/A piccolo
Joined: 18 Dec 2004 Posts: 80 Location: Hannover, Germany
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:10 am Post subject:
Robert P wrote:
If you seriously need to ask that after reading what I've already said - and what I assume most people are generally aware of - you're not going to be satisfied with any answer I give you.
I feel your assertions were rather general so far and I was hoping you could be a little more specific especially after claiming that there is a "mountain of evidence" that a special physiognomy is necessary to be able to play in the high register. I am not aware of that evidence, let alone a mountain thereof, and it would be great if you could put me in the right direction for further study.
I am not contesting your opinion, rather then finding loopholes in my own and I am seriously interested in an honest discussion, in particular after having read an interesting study by Florida State Psychology Professor Anders Ericsson that appears to support what I have believed so far:
The Role of Deliberate Practice in the Acquisition of Expert Performance (Psychological Review 1993, Vol. 100. No. 3, 363-406)
Andersen's study rejects the notion of innate limits while also acknowledging that not everyone can easily attain a high level of skill but linking this to other constraints that expert performers have overcome:
Anderson etl al. wrote:
Contemporary elite performers have overcome a number of constraints. They have obtained early access to instruc-tors, maintained high levels of deliberate practice throughout development, received continued parental and environmental support, and avoided disease and injury. When one considers in addition the prerequisite motivation necessary to engage in de-liberate practice every day for years and decades, when most children and adolescents of similar ages engage in play and leisure, the real constraints on the acquisition of expert perfor-mance become apparent. The commitment to deliberate prac-tice distinguishes the expert performer from the vast majority of children and adults who seem to have remarkable difficulty meeting the much lower demands on practice in schools, adult education, and in physical exercise programs.
This thread is awful. Louis is a heck of a player and seemingly a very nice guy. Why pick apart and minimize anything about his playing or career or YouTube vids just escapes me.
He sounds great, makes cool videos, is budding into his career and is getting people excited about playing trumpet. And amazing many listeners along the way and giving many of his friends and musicians in his recordings a chance to shine as well.
Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 2450 Location: New York City
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:32 am Post subject:
trumpet.trader wrote:
This thread is awful. Louis is a heck of a player and seemingly a very nice guy. Why pick apart and minimize anything about his playing or career or YouTube vids just escapes me.
He sounds great, makes cool videos, is budding into his career and is getting people excited about playing trumpet. And amazing many listeners along the way and giving many of his friends and musicians in his recordings a chance to shine as well.
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