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Does practicing on Piccolo trumpet help High Range



 
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Dieter Z
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:53 am    Post subject: Does practicing on Piccolo trumpet help High Range Reply with quote

Just wondering if practicing on Piccolo trumpet helps developing a better Upper/higher register?

I have a Piccolo trumpet on long term loan, but am usually busy just practicing my Bb and sometimes my C.

However, I recently pulled out a trumpet solo book and many pieces are very high (C and up to E), probably intended to be played with an Eb trumpet or even a Piccolo trumpet.

So just wondering if doing some Clarke and Schlossberg on the Piccolo trumpet would help on developing and strengthening my upper register.

Of course I also could pull out a Hymnal and play 2 or 3 songs a day an octave higher.
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Seymor B Fudd
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:12 am    Post subject: Re: Does practicing on Piccolo trumpet help High Range Reply with quote

Dieter Z wrote:
Just wondering if practicing on Piccolo trumpet helps developing a better Upper/higher register?

I have a Piccolo trumpet on long term loan, but am usually busy just practicing my Bb and sometimes my C.

However, I recently pulled out a trumpet solo book and many pieces are very high (C and up to E), probably intended to be played with an Eb trumpet or even a Piccolo trumpet.

So just wondering if doing some Clarke and Schlossberg on the Piccolo trumpet would help on developing and strengthening my upper register.

Of course I also could pull out a Hymnal and play 2 or 3 songs a day an octave higher.



I've been contemplating this too; I have a Eb/D trumpet so lately I've played same books you have - also different parts of my solocornet charts, especially those already high up; as you are wondering - is this sorta helpful or just another way to kill your chops? "Pops" on this forum advocates high register playing in order to develop high register so in principle it should help; on the other hand (lip) these horns are not very forgiving; might be rather easy overwhelming one's chops. Earlier in my playing life I played the soprano in the brass band and seldom I practised technically difficult parts on the soprano - finding it too strenous making the runs sit properly. Not only hard to "blow air through" but also very sensitive to play in good enough pitch.
In those days the upper ceiling was B (at concerts); today C. However my ceiling on Bb trumpet is E. I think its a very special art playing these horns (piccolo, Eb/D).
The main issue, in my view, might be what exactly is the reaction of one's chops "Overkill" is always a definite risk.
Trying to make your chops very "elastic" - able to go from double pedal C up to and over high C main priority; when I play the Eb trumpet a trifle too long my chops get stiff. So watch it!!
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Christian K. Peters
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:35 am    Post subject: Does practicing pic Reply with quote

Hello all,
The word compression comes to mind, though I am not sure if it is the right word I need. You need an airstream that is congruent to the size of the instrument. I have found that when I prepare a piccolo piece, I force myself to restrain the volume and focus on the combination of aperture and speed to produce the right note at the right level. More of a pin-point stream rather than solid flow. The concept can be taken to a bigger horn producing higher pitches, possibly to the sacrificing a larger sound to a brighter timbre of play. Really, the key word is focus of sound. A smaller bore asks for a better/smaller focus. It is getting the horn to do the work not the chops. though the chops have to have the strength to keep the aperture small without distortion. At least, that is what works for me.
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Seymor B Fudd
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Does practicing pic Reply with quote

Christian K. Peters wrote:
Hello all,
The word compression comes to mind, though I am not sure if it is the right word I need. You need an airstream that is congruent to the size of the instrument. I have found that when I prepare a piccolo piece, I force myself to restrain the volume and focus on the combination of aperture and speed to produce the right note at the right level. More of a pin-point stream rather than solid flow. The concept can be taken to a bigger horn producing higher pitches, possibly to the sacrificing a larger sound to a brighter timbre of play. Really, the key word is focus of sound. A smaller bore asks for a better/smaller focus. It is getting the horn to do the work not the chops. though the chops have to have the strength to keep the aperture small without distortion. At least, that is what works for me.



Indeed! You remind me of that very focused way of blowing; pin-point stream as you name it. It became uncomfortably clear to me when we played marching and I had to be extremely aware of my breathing, playing this "cramped" horn. Ouch!
Thinking of this I want to stress the special art of playing these horns. After all maybe not that beneficial in high register training if ones legit horn is a Bb trumpet.
Or what's your opinion?
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Last edited by Seymor B Fudd on Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gstump
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It never did for me. Pic playing is different. I think everything adapts to the smaller horn. For me that does not translate back to the bigger horn.
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cheiden
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gstump wrote:
It never did for me. Pic playing is different. I think everything adapts to the smaller horn. For me that does not translate back to the bigger horn.

Ditto.
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Christian K. Peters
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:42 pm    Post subject: Pic Reply with quote

Hello Seymor,
I had to notice your sign off line. You play Eb soprano also. I consider the Eb soprano cornet, similar to the Bb/A pic in how it is approached. Or, how it should be approached. I am going to stick by my focus/ air stream statement and add that I do think for me, that playing small horn helps range on the bigger horns. I think that 'approach' to trumpet playing in general, is very specific to outcome. That is why some say it works and some say it does not work for them.
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amzi
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My personal experience is that the techniques involved are so different that what works for one does not work for the other. (Your experience may vary.) A couple of years ago I spent 3 months playing Eb and picc exclusively and my range on the Bb actually suffered significantly. The finesse required for the little horns just doesn't translate to my Bb. Like I said, this is my experience; the experience of others may vary.
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spitvalve
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Different strokes...the years I owned a piccolo and played it a lot, it helped my accuracy in the high register on the Bb trumpet. Didn't make my range any higher--but it helped me focus and play more efficiently.
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zaferis
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 4:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spitvalve wrote:
Different strokes...the years I owned a piccolo and played it a lot, it helped my accuracy in the high register on the Bb trumpet. Didn't make my range any higher--but it helped me focus and play more efficiently.


I agree, this is better discription of what affect playing picc has on my playing.
Additionally, I'd say that ANY practice in the upper register will help and translate from one trumpet to another. - remember your chops are making the faster vibration. If you play a concert D on a Bb trumpet then on a C, D/Eb, A and Bb picc, your chops are vibrating the same pitch (you are adjusting some other things to tweek the tone for each ax)

So, yes, playing high notes on one instrument can help you play high notes on another - my upper range is essentially the same from one trumpet to another
The Picc might help you more on the ear training side, accuracy in the upper register.
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