Why are trumpets seen as "better" than cornets or

iiipopes · Heavyweight Member Joined: 29 Jun 2015 Posts: 548

I disagree with all the above, because both my Uncle and my Dad played, and they both talked about it. The primary cause of the displacement of the cornet for the trumpet is World War II.

My Uncle was born way before WWII, and the instrument to purchase was a cornet for concert band, including solo repertoire in the tradition of Clarke and others, and other ensembles. So my grandparents purchased a King Silvertone for my uncle.

By contrast, my Dad was born just before WWII, and grew up with Harry James as his favorite player. Because of swing music, the entire musicality shifted to preference for trumpets. So my grandmother (my grandfather had untimely died by that point) purchased a King Super 20 trumpet for my Dad.

Where reasonable persons may differ, my information comes from two players who lived through the transition.
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King Super 20 Trumpet; Sov 921 Cornet
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Couesnon Flugelhorn and C trumpet

Seymor B Fudd · Posted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 3:28 am Post subject:

iiipopes · Heavyweight Member Joined: 29 Jun 2015 Posts: 548

jondrowjf@gmail.com · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Jul 2016 Posts: 663

Always thought that the big bands of the 1940s required the loud piercing of the trumpet.
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King 603 cornet
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Denis Wick 4 W classic gold cornet mouthpiece
Yamaha 11 e4 cornet mouthpiece
Yamaha 9e cornet mouthpiece
Bach 5 B cornet mouthpiece

OldKing

LittleRusty

1jazzyalex · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 12:10 am Post subject:

My own theory is that the trumpet gained ascendance because early recording was non-electronic. It wasn't even electric. It was physical. So the horns had to be loud. This is also why early jazz had things like those coconuts for percussion, because drums overwhelmed the other instruments.

Before the 1930s were even out, Whiteman even had Bix Beiderbecke, known for playing cornet, switched over to trumpet.

So my theory is: If you played cornet, it meant you were smaller-time, playing small venues, etc and not being recorded, while if you played a trumpet, it showed you were ready to make a record at the drop of a hat. And they did make 'em at the drop of a hat in the 1920s. The reason there's still so much collector vinyl from the 1920s and 1930s is they made a mind-boggling amount of it. A band or just a group of musicians with a known lead man would be gotten together, they'd cut a disc, and the lead guy'd get handed $50 and the sidemen $10 or $20 each and doing this once a week was not uncommon.
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Seymor B Fudd · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:26 am Post subject:

iiipopes · Heavyweight Member Joined: 29 Jun 2015 Posts: 548

blbaumgarn · Heavyweight Member Joined: 26 Jul 2017 Posts: 705

Just to add something after the fact. 49 years ago I made symphonic band in college as a freshman. They told me I would be in the cornet section and then gave me a horn. Every piece in the folder was marked for cornet. Our cornet section was six, and there were a 1st and 2nd trumpet. I agree with the thought on projection for outdoors that some people added. It is different horses for different courses. I had a conn 36B that could project into the next county and a Benge 5 that was much the same way, but the Getzen and Schilke cornets I have played packed a punch and good projection, too.

derby_mute · Posted: Sat May 12, 2018 7:18 am Post subject:

kehaulani · Posted: Sat May 12, 2018 8:08 am Post subject:

After reviewing all of the above, I'm wondering if it isn't as much based on personal experience and when/where you were at, at the time.

For example. the suggestion that the reason was based on marching band use doesn't apply to me at all. In Hawai'i the only marching bands were the weaker ones trying to call attention to themselves. My band was one of the best in the state and we marched in two required ROTC parades a year. That was it. So the marching band reason does not apply to us.

We can second guess the motives of musical directors, et al, but on a personal level it was simply that the "old" music used cornets and we represented the newer, hence (to me?) "hipper" instrument.
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"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

derby_mute · Posted: Sat May 12, 2018 9:25 am Post subject:

RandyTX

khedger · Posted: Sat May 12, 2018 2:59 pm Post subject:

I was remembering something the other day that relates a little bit to this thread. I started playing when I was 10 years old, in fifth grade. I come from a lower middle class family, as did most of my school chums.
When I started, one typically started on a rented (usually a Conn director) cornet. The big carrot that was held out was "Practice hard and get better and maybe next year we'll BUY you a TRUMPET!"

I don't know where this mentality came from, but I'm wondering how many other fifth graders got ingrained with this idea in the 60s. I know that when I got my first trumpet, I was on cloud nine and I distinctly remember thinking that I'd somehow 'arrived' and could now work to be a serious player.

People are weird.

LittleRusty

RandyTX · Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 6:40 am Post subject:

Richard A · Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 9:07 am Post subject:

[quote="RandyTX"]

khedger · Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 10:11 am Post subject:

kehaulani · Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 10:39 am Post subject:

I played cornet in my Jr. H.S. jazz band, then trumpet in H.S., then trumpet in university, although our concert band (Texas, 60s) had separate cornet and trumpet sections. I went from one extreme (disrespected) situation to another (fanatic).
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn