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Q's about Monkes


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TheBrassBandMajor
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:13 am    Post subject: Q's about Monkes Reply with quote

I know I have created a thread previously on about Monke rotary trumpets and I am wanting to explore more about this 'landmark' rotary of Germany.

Question 1: I know all (or some says a few people) have a sock-in-the-bell factor 'naturally' built in the Monke but how is this sock factor generated from? The bracing? The inner structure or build process?

Question 2: How do you get 'rid' of the sock factor?

Question 3: If the question above is impossible, how do you overcome the sock factor or make your Monke a little more free-blowing? Is it mouthpiece choice or putting a interchange-able leadpipe?

Question 4: What are some nice mouthpiece combinations for a Monke rotary?

Question 5: Are older pre-1965 (Pre-Liselotte Monke era/Verfertigt) better than the post 1965 Angfertigt?

Question 6: Are the newer 21st centuries any different from the older Monkes?

Question 7: Would I be accepted in a top tier orchestra with a Monke? Or would I be tossed out into the darkness just because a different player maybe has the brand new Schagerl, Lechner or Weimann?

Question 8: What are some tips you would give to a fellow trumpeter who wants to be a Monke? Any warnings or bewares?

Question 9 (FINAL!!): Would you recommend an original Monke or the Yamaha Monke copy based off the Monkes?

Thanks in advance!
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John Mohan
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adolph Herseth didn't get tossed out of the CSO for having a Monke. Seriously, your question about that is a little absurd. People don't get hired because they have the shiniest, newest instrument.

When I subbed in the Berlin Radio Symphony Orchestra I tended to use a Bach 1X with a #22 throat and the #24 Symphonic backbore with my Monkes. But that's me, not you. Big, deep, open mouthpieces seem to be favored by folks playing rotaries. I have a feeling I just stated the obvious.

While I'm sure the Yamahas are fine horns, they are not used by pros as much as Monkes or the other major European brands. That said, if you get the chance to, play them all with a critical listener (or a few) and make your own determination.
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homebilly
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

just be careful of the dreaded Monke Breath.....
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oxleyk
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Davy Jones was so dreamy.
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TheBrassBandMajor
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Mr Mohan,

I know I have put it rather wrongly but Herseth was top of his game and 'his' CSO era was the golden era of Monkes throughout the world.

Now it is a different story with the new Weimanns and etc therefore that was why I asked.
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Vincent Bach Mt Vernon Mercedes
B&S Challenger 3137/I
Hermann Ganter G7aN
A.Windisch Silber-Deluxe, Dresden
Couesnon 'Triebert Moderne' piccolo
Conn 'Connstellation' 28A
SO many more trumpets.....
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ravel
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doesn't matter what brand you play so long as you play it well and sound great. Nobody in the audience knows or really cares what brand it is.
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TheBrassBandMajor
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

True that, ravel. You just need to sound great. Just wanted to confirm that.

Someone in a German orchestra said it was impossible to see someone with a Monke in a top tier orchestra.
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Vincent Bach Mt Vernon Mercedes
B&S Challenger 3137/I
Hermann Ganter G7aN
A.Windisch Silber-Deluxe, Dresden
Couesnon 'Triebert Moderne' piccolo
Conn 'Connstellation' 28A
SO many more trumpets.....
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delano
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oxleyk wrote:
Davy Jones was so dreamy.


Yes, from The Monkees brass quartet, they blew the socks of your feet!
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Daniel Barenboim
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would listen to Mr. Mohan. He knows what he is talking about. After all, he auditioned for the CSO once.

DB
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TheBrassBandMajor
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oxleyk wrote:
Davy Jones was so dreamy.


?
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Vincent Bach Mt Vernon Mercedes
B&S Challenger 3137/I
Hermann Ganter G7aN
A.Windisch Silber-Deluxe, Dresden
Couesnon 'Triebert Moderne' piccolo
Conn 'Connstellation' 28A
SO many more trumpets.....
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delano
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Monke(e)s

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Monkees
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TheBrassBandMajor
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please do not divert this thread with other subjects. I still haven't received my answers for my questions.
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B&S Challenger 3137/I
Hermann Ganter G7aN
A.Windisch Silber-Deluxe, Dresden
Couesnon 'Triebert Moderne' piccolo
Conn 'Connstellation' 28A
SO many more trumpets.....
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delano
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You got all the answers you could expect.
And I only explained your ? But maybe that was too difficult for you.
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TheBrassBandMajor
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh please, Franklin do this somewhere else. I am trying to get legit answers.
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B&S Challenger 3137/I
Hermann Ganter G7aN
A.Windisch Silber-Deluxe, Dresden
Couesnon 'Triebert Moderne' piccolo
Conn 'Connstellation' 28A
SO many more trumpets.....
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delano
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then better try a German forum like Trompetenforum.de. More Monke's there I presume.

Last edited by delano on Sat Aug 19, 2017 5:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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delano
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheBrassBandMajor wrote:
oxleyk wrote:
Davy Jones was so dreamy.


?


They were all cute.
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Gottfried Reiche
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 6:56 am    Post subject: Re: Q's about Monkes Reply with quote

TheBrassBandMajor wrote:
I know I have created a thread previously on about Monke rotary trumpets and I am wanting to explore more about this 'landmark' rotary of Germany.

Question 1: I know all (or some says a few people) have a sock-in-the-bell factor 'naturally' built in the Monke but how is this sock factor generated from? The bracing? The inner structure or build process?
Can't really answer this...probably both.

Question 2: How do you get 'rid' of the sock factor?
Every time I've experimented with Monkes, I've never been able to really make them play the way that I want to. Occasionally you'll find a great one, but they are rare.

Question 3: If the question above is impossible, how do you overcome the sock factor or make your Monke a little more free-blowing? Is it mouthpiece choice or putting a interchange-able leadpipe?
Probably both, but your mileage may vary.

Question 4: What are some nice mouthpiece combinations for a Monke rotary?
There are lots of mouthpieces that work well on rotaries...Breslmair, Klier, Tilz, Toshi, Bach (with the right backbore), Curry BC series, etc. You should experiment...but I would use something with a pretty large backbore. Short shank also works well. Monette mouthpieces work great on rotary (and I do not prefer them on piston trumpets at all).

Question 5: Are older pre-1965 (Pre-Liselotte Monke era/Verfertigt) better than the post 1965 Angfertigt?
no idea

Question 6: Are the newer 21st centuries any different from the older Monkes?
Again, no idea...I'm not a Monke scholar...I just play trumpet full time in a major US orchestra.

Question 7: Would I be accepted in a top tier orchestra with a Monke? Or would I be tossed out into the darkness just because a different player maybe has the brand new Schagerl, Lechner or Weimann?
In theory, yes, but in practice, probably not. This is where Mohan and I probably differ. Yes, the most important thing is how you sound and blend with the section. But that's going to be tough on a Monke. Huge strides have been made in rotary trumpets, like Weimann, Schagerl etc., which makes Monke's pretty obsolete. The newer makers play so well, that transitioning is easier. Can you do that on a Monke? Probably...but the amount of time and effort for you to do it may not be worth it. And it's just factual that it's going to be tougher to produce the same sound (not just tone quality, I'm including articulations, intonation, etc.) as on a Weimann or Schagerl. So it's going to be tougher to just plop in a section and do that. That being said, if you win a job in a full time orchestra that uses those instruments, chances are the orchestra will own a set that you can use from. We have a guy who is a GREAT player that subs with us often...he's brought his Monke in, and it just did not work. The instrument, quite frankly, was holding him back. So, as I said...in theory, yes, but in practice, probably not.

Question 8: What are some tips you would give to a fellow trumpeter who wants to be a Monke? Any warnings or bewares?
I really would look into something else.

Question 9 (FINAL!!): Would you recommend an original Monke or the Yamaha Monke copy based off the Monkes?
The Yamaha would be a better instrument, in my opinion.

Thanks in advance!
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homebilly
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think Mickey Dolenz doubled on a Monke
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ron meza (deadbeat jazz musician) & (TH 5 post ghost neighborhood watch ringleader)
waiting for Fed-Ex to deliver a $50 trumpet to my door. shipping was prepaid by seller of course!
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http://highdefinitionbigband.com
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good one, LOL.
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ravel
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobody has complained about my monke though admittedly it is a little more dofficult to play compared to newer rotaries that play and sound more like Pistons. I think the older horns are indeed better....
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