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Louise Finch Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012 Posts: 5467 Location: Suffolk, England
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2024 4:47 am Post subject: How sleeves compare and which sleeve to use on a Bach 37 |
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Hi
I have a 1994 Bach 7C, 2005 Bach 3C (another Bach 3C bought used with the same lettering style), a Bach 10 backbore from a Bach mouthpieces converted to have Warburton threads (I bought this used, I have no idea what era), and a Bach 10 backbore with Warburton threads created from a 2nd 2005 Bach 3C.
Apart from my 1994 Bach 7C, which inserts 25mm in my Bach, all of these insert 24mm, which is equivalent to a James R New 6 sleeve.
However I always thought that a Reeves 5 or possibly a 5.5 replicated a typical Bach insertion amount. Do James R New sleeves insert equivalent to a one size smaller Reeves sleeve or something?
Also, for reference I use a James R New 6.5 sleeve on my Yamaha Xeno II, and that inserts like a typical Yamaha trumpet mouthpiece.
Many thanks
Lou _________________ Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs
Last edited by Louise Finch on Sat Jan 27, 2024 9:15 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Christian K. Peters Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Nov 2001 Posts: 1532 Location: Eugene, Oregon
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2024 8:30 am Post subject: sleeves |
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Hello Lou,
If all receiver to leadpipes were the same, the measurements would be valid. The real measure is the mp to venturi, that creates the gap, is what you really want to know. If you are only going on openness/stuffiness and response, then you just rely on the senses to give you the answer. My horns play well with a 3-4mm gap. Sleeves 5, 5.5 or 6 depending on horn. My Warburton and Schilke mp shanks fit in that range for my Schilkes. _________________ Christian K. Peters
Schilke Loyalist since 1976 |
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Louise Finch Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012 Posts: 5467 Location: Suffolk, England
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2024 4:38 pm Post subject: Re: sleeves |
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Christian K. Peters wrote: | Hello Lou,
If all receiver to leadpipes were the same, the measurements would be valid. The real measure is the mp to venturi, that creates the gap, is what you really want to know. If you are only going on openness/stuffiness and response, then you just rely on the senses to give you the answer. My horns play well with a 3-4mm gap. Sleeves 5, 5.5 or 6 depending on horn. My Warburton and Schilke mp shanks fit in that range for my Schilkes. |
Thanks very much Christian, this is really appreciated.
Take care and best wishes
Lou _________________ Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
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Jon Arnold Heavyweight Member
Joined: 07 Jan 2002 Posts: 2026
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Louise Finch Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012 Posts: 5467 Location: Suffolk, England
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Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2024 4:26 am Post subject: |
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Thanks very much, Jon. I've seen this before and find it very interesting, but in this instance I was just wondering what Reeves sleeve inserts most like a typical Bach trumpet mouthpiece, a Reeves 5 or 5.5, and whether a James R New 6 sleeve is more like a Reeves 5 sleeve, since a James R New 6 sleeve inserts like my Bach mouthpieces.
Many thanks
Lou _________________ Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
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Louise Finch Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012 Posts: 5467 Location: Suffolk, England
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Posted: Sat Jan 27, 2024 9:24 am Post subject: |
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As I haven't had many replies, I've amended the topic title, and will repost my original question below:
Hi
I have a 1994 Bach 7C, 2005 Bach 3C (another Bach 3C bought used with the same lettering style), a Bach 10 backbore from a Bach mouthpieces converted to have Warburton threads (I bought this used, I have no idea what era), and a Bach 10 backbore with Warburton threads created from a 2nd 2005 Bach 3C.
Apart from my 1994 Bach 7C, which inserts 25mm in my Bach, all of these insert 24mm, which is equivalent to a James R New 6 sleeve.
However I always thought that a Reeves 5 or possibly a 5.5 replicated a typical Bach insertion amount. Do James R New sleeves insert equivalent to a one size smaller Reeves sleeve or something?
Also, for reference I use a James R New 6.5 sleeve on my Yamaha Xeno II, and that inserts like a typical Yamaha trumpet mouthpiece.
Many thanks
Lou
That is what I asked originally, and I have a further question. Most Bach mouthpieces insert 24mm in the receiver of my Bach 37. A James R New 6 sleeve inserts 24mm.
A Yamaha mouthpiece inserts 25mm in the receiver of my Bach 37 (and Xeno II), as does a James R New 6.5 sleeve.
It appears to me therefore that a James R New 6 sleeve replicates the insertion amount of a Bach trumpet mouthpiece, and that a James R New 6.5 sleeve replicates the 1mm greater insertion amount of a Yamaha trumpet mouthpiece.
But people seem to be using Reeves 5 sleeves on Bachs. Is a Reeves 5 sleeve equivalent to a Jim New 6, or does a Reeves 5 sleeve give a larger gap than a Bach trumpet mouthpiece, and people are preferring larger gaps on Bachs than with a Bach mouthpiece?
I'd really like to know.
I'd also like to know whether Reeves sleeves will fit my backbores cut for James R New sleeves, as Jim New I believe, does not currently have any sleeves in stock and is making them to order. I'd rather have the option of maybe trying a few, then sending back what doesn't work.
Many thanks
Lou _________________ Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
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