SC and TCE differences

ETK · Posted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 12:36 pm Post subject:

I recently received and read the book "Trumpet Secrets" (Tongue Controlled Embouchure) by Jerome Callet. I only know about "Superchops" from what I have read on this forum. What are the differences between SC and TCE?

Since TCE is newer and SC is no longer in print, why does Mr. Callet consider TCE such an improvement to almost abandon SC?

Jerry Freedman · Posted: Mon Mar 01, 2004 12:56 pm Post subject:

go through this forum and look at past posts. This has been beaten to death in the past year. You just missed that last version by a few months

ETK · Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:33 pm Post subject:

Hi. I am a comeback player of 3 months after many years of no playing. I am motivated by love of the trumpet, a nephew and this forum. I have been practicing the "Balanced Embouchure" by Jeff Smiley for 5 weeks. Mr. Smiley spoke well of Jerome Callet so I received a copy of Mr. Callet’s book “Trumpet Secrets” 7 days ago and have been practicing TS #1 and #2. I am having a problem getting the hang of TS #3. I thought if I knew more about “Superchops” I might gain some insight.

What I have been able to understand from reading the posts in this forum section so far is that Superchops uses pressure between the lips created by the chin bunching upward to create a long aperture tunnel for the air to fight through. This creates a thicker lip mass in front of the teeth which helps endurance, etc. Tonguing is on the bottom lip and some players touch the tip of the tongue on the lower lip and leave it there to maintain air compression. The buzz is a spit buzz with the tongue forward with the “spitting of the hair” off the tongue.

Trumpet Secret #1 stresses the tip of the tongue touching the top inside of the lower lip and always remaining there while spit buzzing. Articulation is by using the top of the tongue about 1” from the tip hitting the cutting edge of the front teeth. I have spent the last 7 days practicing this way with some success.

Trumpet Secrets #3 and #4 have the top of the tongue tip touching the top lip. For high notes both lips grip the tongue. When I try this the air gets blocked. An easy high note squeaks out once in awhile. I will keep trying.

I started this post trying to keep my question short to get some insight but I decided to add this long post. Hope it is OK. Maybe somebody can tell me if I am understanding things correctly or if I am off track. I like this forum. I asked a related question in the “Balanced Embouchure” section of this forum “BE with SC and TCE.” Thanks Mike

[ This Message was edited by: ETK on 2004-03-05 08:20 ]

goldenhornplayer · Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 9:39 am Post subject:

Hi Mike--Somewhere along the way, you will have to make a decision between BE and TCE. These embouchure methods have very little in common and I would even go further to say that one is counter productive to the other. Rolling in does not work in TCE. Also, pressing the lips together does not work in TCE.

As far as the sound cutting off as you ascend, more than one bad habit can cause that but one likely choice is insufficient jaw opening. As the tongue presses forward and upward against the top teeth/top lip, more room must be made for the thickening tongue. This is facilitated by opening the jaws. Study the book carefully and look again at the illustrations, which are quite good. There is no "hidden" secret here and it will work if you do it correctly.

tptguy · Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:53 pm Post subject:

I used to have a lot of trouble with sound cutting off as I ascend, particularly as I tired. My problem was as GoldenKen describes, I was letting the jaw close. But, it was only closing on my left side under my "snaggletooth" so I wasn't catching it. A bit more forward with the tongue and I was a-ok.

<<This creates a thicker lip mass in front of the teeth which helps endurance, etc.>>

It would be much more accurate to say that the thicker lip mass is created by pressure of the lips back against the forward tongue. Lips against each other helps sustain the bunching. But trying to create the bunching by moving the lower lip up would be incorrect. This misunderstanding is a major point that Jerry wanted to correct with TCE after SC.

<< Tonguing is on the bottom lip>>

Articulation is definitely off the top lip, not the bottom lip.

<< Trumpet Secret #1 stresses the tip of the tongue touching the top inside of the lower lip and always remaining there while spit buzzing. Articulation is by using the top of the tongue about 1” from the tip hitting the cutting edge of the front teeth. I have spent the last 7 days practicing this way with some success. >>

Great stuff, keep at it!

<<Trumpet Secrets #3 and #4 have the top of the tongue tip touching the top lip. For high notes both lips grip the tongue. When I try this the air gets blocked. An easy high note squeaks out once in awhile. I will keep trying. >>

This doesn't come by adopting a different technique from Secret #1. Rather, it is an evolution from #1. It will come naturally as you continue to work on and develop the tongue strength from #1. If you try to press ahead too quickly you'll set yourself back.

Keep at it, Mike, it's great stuff. The sound, intonation, and control TCE generates is incredible.

Best regards, Kyle

ETK · Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:46 am Post subject:

Thanks for the replies. I read and worked on TS #1 over the weekend. The things you said are making sense and I am making progress.