• FAQ  • Search  • Memberlist  • Usergroups   • Register   • Profile  • Log in to check your private messages  • Log in 

GETTING STARTED 1


Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Carmine Caruso
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
PH
Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator


Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 5362
Location: Bloomington Indiana

PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 10:52 am    Post subject: Re: Getting started 1 Reply with quote

TrpPro wrote:
JohnO wrote:
The advice in MCFB states that substantial mouthpiece pressure while doing these exercises is ok and also states (in the seconds, thirds, etc) to not force the intervals past a certain point.


Could you direct me to the place in MCFB where this is mentioned. Thanks


It appears in most of the interval studies, beginning with the 2nds.
_________________
Bach trumpet artist-clinician
Professor of Jazz Studies, Indiana University Jacobs School of Music
Faculty Jamey Aebersold Jazz Workshops since 1976
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
TrpPro
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 12 Jan 2006
Posts: 1282
Location: Las Vegas

PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see where he mentions in the 2nds when referring to notes above high D: "Play these notes only if youíre able, donít force." Didn't see where it got mentioned again.

My experience would make me believe that CC was NOT making a reference to arm pressure with the term "force." His mantra always seemed (to me) to allow all the pressure you want
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PH
Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator


Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 5362
Location: Bloomington Indiana

PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TrpPro wrote:
I see where he mentions in the 2nds when referring to notes above high D: "Play these notes only if youíre able, donít force." Didn't see where it got mentioned again.

My experience would make me believe that CC was NOT making a reference to arm pressure with the term "force." His mantra always seemed (to me) to allow all the pressure you want


True, I'm not sure he literally says that again. However, the higher notes are bracketed in all of the interval drills and I always took that to be where he was warning people to not go if it seemed to difficult. Regardless, I do not know of anyone who studied with him personally who ever received such a warning.
_________________
Bach trumpet artist-clinician
Professor of Jazz Studies, Indiana University Jacobs School of Music
Faculty Jamey Aebersold Jazz Workshops since 1976
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
tmarshall
Regular Member


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 23
Location: Parker Colorado

PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 5:09 am    Post subject: Just starting Reply with quote

I've started doing theses two weeks ago, first week I did them on my own but have since started doing them this way. Thanks for the clarification. CC was vague on some things; not all. The Subdivision has been a challenge, I really have to focus and keep it slow (60 bbm) hopefully it will get easier. What is your opinion on doing these calenentics on a day you know your going to have a big gig? Do you hold off knowing you need all the energy for that night or do you just go for it and hope you you have it for that 30th chart? My hope is that continued use of this will get me more endurance, utilizing my chops more efficiently. Your thoughts?
_________________
tmarshall
Kanstal 905
Mt Vernon Bach Strad 43 (Dr valve restored)
Bach CL 229
Taylor Chicago Standard 2 46
Yamaha 6310z (Dr valve modfied)
Yamaha 6310z Flugelhorn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bagmangood
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 26 Feb 2009
Posts: 1156
Location: NYCish

PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 5:24 am    Post subject: Re: Just starting Reply with quote

tmarshall wrote:
I've started doing theses two weeks ago, first week I did them on my own but have since started doing them this way. Thanks for the clarification. CC was vague on some things; not all. The Subdivision has been a challenge, I really have to focus and keep it slow (60 bbm) hopefully it will get easier. What is your opinion on doing these calenentics on a day you know your going to have a big gig? Do you hold off knowing you need all the energy for that night or do you just go for it and hope you you have it for that 30th chart? My hope is that continued use of this will get me more endurance, utilizing my chops more efficiently. Your thoughts?


You should be able to do your routine (so at 2 weeks, 6 notes + seconds) and still have plenty of gas for the rest of your practice time. If you have a gig you are worried about, I would still do your Caruso and do significantly less of the rest of your routine.

If Caruso is more than 50% of your practice time, you should cut down on which exercises you are doing and play more music!
_________________
More than one trumpet
A "few" mouthpieces
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PH
Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator


Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 5362
Location: Bloomington Indiana

PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2015 5:43 am    Post subject: Re: Just starting Reply with quote

tmarshall wrote:
I've started doing theses two weeks ago, first week I did them on my own but have since started doing them this way. Thanks for the clarification. CC was vague on some things; not all. The Subdivision has been a challenge, I really have to focus and keep it slow (60 bbm) hopefully it will get easier. What is your opinion on doing these calenentics on a day you know your going to have a big gig? Do you hold off knowing you need all the energy for that night or do you just go for it and hope you you have it for that 30th chart? My hope is that continued use of this will get me more endurance, utilizing my chops more efficiently. Your thoughts?


I'm pretty much on the same page with bagmangood. If you are still relatively new to Caruso you might try not doing them on a gig day. However, your routine is relatively brief and not too demanding for the first few weeks, so it might not matter. When I was doing this routine every day (which was for a period of quite a few years), this was the first thing I played every day. I played better if I could get all or most of my routine in earlier, take a break of at least 20-30 minutes and then hit it. If I had a heavy blowing work day I would shorten my Caruso routine, especially at the point in my study with CC where my calisthenics routine had gotten up to over an hour of exercises. At that point, maybe try doing just 6 notes, 2nds, harmonics and one or two other drills and then go into battle.
_________________
Bach trumpet artist-clinician
Professor of Jazz Studies, Indiana University Jacobs School of Music
Faculty Jamey Aebersold Jazz Workshops since 1976
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
tmarshall
Regular Member


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 23
Location: Parker Colorado

PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:21 am    Post subject: Warm up Reply with quote

I start CC first thing in the AM is warming up nessesary?
Also when I do the #2 excercise (seconds, I'm in my 2nd week now) and am attempting to play G to A, A is still a G, at this point do I go to the next interval even though it won't come out? Also when I'm at the end of my excercise with no sound coming out there is however a lot of air leakage is this normal?
Your thoughts? Thanks
_________________
tmarshall
Kanstal 905
Mt Vernon Bach Strad 43 (Dr valve restored)
Bach CL 229
Taylor Chicago Standard 2 46
Yamaha 6310z (Dr valve modfied)
Yamaha 6310z Flugelhorn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
gstump
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 755

PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 6 notes can be your warm-up. I follow them with some petals, short flexibility licks, and then the harmonics. That is my warm-up every day. At my age it is more of a work out than a warm-up.

If the notes are coming out very flat at the end that is not necessarily a bad thing. It shows you are not manipulating things to squeak out the next note. I usually stop on the second "set" if the note does not change. If it is the first set I rest 20 seconds or so and try one more time. Usually this results in a positive thing.

Air leakage is normal if you are in new territory. That will go away as you learn to tongue up there.

Best of luck,

Gordon Stump
_________________
Schilke B5
Couesnon Flug (1967)
Caruso Student
Trumpet Stand
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
tmarshall
Regular Member


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 23
Location: Parker Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:12 am    Post subject: Fourth week Reply with quote

I'm on my fourth week now, and I was wondering whether or not on the six notes do I repeat still? I'm really glad that this is not a musical exercise because it sounds really horrible but you can really feel it physically. I do feel like my chops are getting stronger. I do however still have the issue that on the seconds when I go from G to A, the A is still a G. So I attempt that again-and then I rest for 15 to 20 seconds and then try again and then it works, the same with the thirds and fourths at about the G level. Is this normal? Do I try that interval twice, then rest and try again until no sound comes out? (By the time no sounds comes out my starting to develop air leaks)😨
Thanks
_________________
tmarshall
Kanstal 905
Mt Vernon Bach Strad 43 (Dr valve restored)
Bach CL 229
Taylor Chicago Standard 2 46
Yamaha 6310z (Dr valve modfied)
Yamaha 6310z Flugelhorn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
gstump
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 755

PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:33 am    Post subject: Re: Fourth week Reply with quote

tmarshall wrote:
I'm on my fourth week now, and I was wondering whether or not on the six notes do I repeat still? I'm really glad that this is not a musical exercise because it sounds really horrible but you can really feel it physically. I do feel like my chops are getting stronger. I do however still have the issue that on the seconds when I go from G to A, the A is still a G. So I attempt that again-and then I rest for 15 to 20 seconds and then try again and then it works, the same with the thirds and fourths at about the G level. Is this normal? Do I try that interval twice, then rest and try again until no sound comes out? (By the time no sounds comes out my starting to develop air leaks)😨
Thanks


The 6 notes are always repeated. Think of them with the repeat as a package that is not to be messed with. That can be your warm-up if you like. Are you saying the 6 notes sound terrible. If so you may need a day off to let the chops adjust to your routine.

Also, when I overdo it and the 6 notes sound bad, I add lip bends on the whole notes down in half steps to a whole step and back up to the pitch in 8th notes. For me, after a few lip bends incorporated in the 6 notes, my sound cleans up. Also, I like to decrescendo when the sound cleans up to get a nice pp.

Caruso is not about gorilla playing, my avitar aside!


Which G to A are you describing? Regardless, the rules should be followed to the letter. Play as far as you can. This is called the first setting. Then rest for 15-20 seconds. Then try one more time to go on. This is called the second setting. That is it, over and out! Since you are new to Caruso, I would not repeat the interval studies on the same day.

Also, try not doing the intervsl studies every so often and replace them with softer lower playing like Clark or petals.

Best of luck,

Gordon Stump
_________________
Schilke B5
Couesnon Flug (1967)
Caruso Student
Trumpet Stand
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
tmarshall
Regular Member


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 23
Location: Parker Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not so much on the six notes but mainly on the intervals. Thanks for your advise. Appreciate your input!
_________________
tmarshall
Kanstal 905
Mt Vernon Bach Strad 43 (Dr valve restored)
Bach CL 229
Taylor Chicago Standard 2 46
Yamaha 6310z (Dr valve modfied)
Yamaha 6310z Flugelhorn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TrpPro
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 12 Jan 2006
Posts: 1282
Location: Las Vegas

PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To the OP. It sounds like you are being overly result conscious (as CC used to say) with the intervals. It's normal, but you will be better served not to be concerned about how well you think you are succeeding with them and really treat the exercises as pre-music. Disregard musical results such as attack, intonation, etc., and focus totally on the Four Rules, especially the timing. Give it several months for improved results to start showing up in your music practice.

If you put a musical goal on playing the calisthenics you will likely only get frustrated. That goal is probably unreachable and doesn't matter anyway. Embrace the non-musical results and enjoy the ride!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
american boy
Veteran Member


Joined: 22 Sep 2012
Posts: 274
Location: ny

PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:26 am    Post subject: My Caruso experience Reply with quote

In the mid/late 70s,I took a few lessons with Carmine;At the time,I was free lancing in NYC and playing mostly the jazz chairs in big bands,and some broadway show subs.Being the 70`s there was a lot more gigging going on.Anyway,I was playing often with some of Carmine`s greatest students who would recommend I visit him,so I did.My initial reaction was,ugh,I feel really stiff after doing this stuff and couldn't get real comfortable on my gigs..Guess I was impatient,but the gig came first,so I moved on from his studies..Shoot ahead a few years,and I had a bit of a break in the action,so I decided to "Revisit" the Caruso exercises,without the worry about being fresh for gigs,so I used a little patience,doing like 5 days of 6 notes only(like 4 times a day),then adding 2nds,then harmonics,and doing only These things 3,4 times a day..After 2 weeks I started to experience a balance I had never had before..A confidence playing things like Concone,as is,8 va,and everything in between.Not to mention being able to play good A`s and b`s.over Hi c,.all new to me.What i didn't realize at the time,was when I went to play in ensembles again,I found my tuning slide had to be out a lot,like over 2 inches,to be in tune.That I found was not acceptable,so I again moved away from his system..Could be that overdoing it and not playing enough other stuff made for the tuning problem..As i`m now in my 60`s I'm going to start again,but with a little common sense thrown in..Do any Caruso students have an opinion on why that pitch change occurred? I was starting to imagine my playing as becoming really good there for a while
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PH
Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator


Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 5362
Location: Bloomington Indiana

PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, it sounds like you just overdid the Caruso in balance with everything else. I wouldn't do those calisthenics more than once or twice per day and I'd be sure to still do a reasonably well balanced assortment of other kinds of playing every day.
_________________
Bach trumpet artist-clinician
Professor of Jazz Studies, Indiana University Jacobs School of Music
Faculty Jamey Aebersold Jazz Workshops since 1976
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
gstump
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 755

PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am in my late 60s. I would not do the intervals 3-4 times a day anymore.

Even back in the day I might do a set of REG, SLS and LSL intervals but not repeating any single one 3-4 times.

Regarding the tuning slide thing, I can take shot:

Being "result conscience" and trying to get to the same note or higher notes by manipulating or pacing is not the proper mental state for Caruso Studies.

Think of them as medicine. Mr. Caruso once asked me...."do you have to think about where an aspirin is supposed to go if you have a headache?"

Great stuff!!!

Best of luck,

Gordon Stump
_________________
Schilke B5
Couesnon Flug (1967)
Caruso Student
Trumpet Stand
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
american boy
Veteran Member


Joined: 22 Sep 2012
Posts: 274
Location: ny

PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2015 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks gstump and PH; I think looking back,I did not have the real patience needed to succeed with Carmines stuff..That said,I can say that in the heat of the battle(free lancing in NYC) my thoughts were on the tasks at hand,or the gig that day..Perhaps if I took his system on pre working for a living,It may have been more effective..I know that he told me to do 6 notes right into 2nd,and doing that caused me too much stiffness to play comfortably that day or night..He was a great guy..Used to have drinks with him at the old china song
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bendertrumpet
New Member


Joined: 05 May 2011
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2015 11:13 am    Post subject: Dominic Derasse Reply with quote

I just started into the Carmine Caruso world studying under one of Caruso's top students, Dominic Derasse (NYC based). It's been great for my playing so far. If you're in NYC area, or want to visit to take the 4 lessons contact him. dominicderasse.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Capsyde
New Member


Joined: 05 Mar 2015
Posts: 5
Location: Philadelphia, Pa

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Starting my students with The 1st exercise form Laurie Frink's Flexus book..which is the 6 note Caruso study.. Focus of embouchure is what i'm striving my students obtain.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Whitewinds88
New Member


Joined: 26 Mar 2015
Posts: 1
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 4:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rookie here, I have been playing for a while, but just recently started these Caruso exercises about a week ago. Where I live I don't have an area that I can practice without a practice mute very often, so i guess what my question is is how terrible is this for my playing if I am using a practice mute all the time?

Also disclaimer, I freely admit to being an impatient person so while I have only been doing these exercises for about a week, I have been doing them at an accelerated pace. Or in other words I do the 6 notes, then seconds, then harmonics and have had no issues with doing them so far. So question is should I reign in my impulsiveness and start over with the recommended lesson plan laid out in earlier pages, or keep going as I am and start adding new stuff as I am able to play it? Also thanks for this forum, great reading in here!
-Tim
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
gstump
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 755

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have been playing for awhile it should be ok. Doing just lighter practice 1 or 2 days a week might be a good idea if your sound get ratty.

Also, after your Caruso routine and a long break doing petals or soft stuff is great for balance.

There is a difference between not being concerned with sound quality playing reg 2nds and playing other non-Caruso music.

I say this all the time so forgive my redundancy: If start to sound ratty on the 6 notes, I add lip bends to the whole note going down 1/2 step, whole step, and back up.

Best of luck,

Gordon Stump
_________________
Schilke B5
Couesnon Flug (1967)
Caruso Student
Trumpet Stand
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Carmine Caruso All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
Page 8 of 9

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group