• FAQ  • Search  • Memberlist  • Usergroups   • Register   • Profile  • Log in to check your private messages  • Log in 

Complete overhaul?



 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Horns
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Mdbri
Veteran Member


Joined: 19 Jul 2010
Posts: 150
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:53 am    Post subject: Complete overhaul? Reply with quote

I play a vintage Schilke. It's 30 years old, the valves still have an excellent (...!) compression and are still tight. The problem is, one of the valves is sticky, since the inside of the valve casings is scratched (because of 30 years of use).

I am trying to decide what to do. I adore the sound of my horn, and I am not really keen on replacing it with a new horn.

Will the overhaul solve the problem? I know that valve overhaul can be problematic. How much does it cost?

Thanx.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Yamahaguy
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 09 Dec 2004
Posts: 3992

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:52 am    Post subject: Re: Complete overhaul? Reply with quote

Mdbri wrote:
Will the overhaul solve the problem? I know that valve overhaul can be problematic. How much does it cost?
You might not need a complete overhaul.
And it's only problematic when done by someone who doesn't know what they are doing.
I suggest contacting Dr. Valve, Steve Winans...he's the best IMO
http://www.doctorvalve.com/

Peace,
-Dennis
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ubungstickle
Veteran Member


Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 186
Location: New York City, New York

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You might not need a complete overhaul.
And it's only problematic when done by someone who doesn't know what they are doing.
I suggest contacting Dr. Valve, Steve Winans...he's the best IMO
http://www.doctorvalve.com/


+1
_________________
Yamaha YTR-4335G Bb
Yamaha YTR-9445CHS C
Schilke P5/4 Picc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Royal Lancer
Veteran Member


Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Posts: 137
Location: Detroit, Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My vote is for Steve as well. He is the man with valves. No better.
_________________
‘20 Schilke Xa1 Cornet
‘19 Schilke 1041 Flugel
'17 Schilke B5
'07 Lawler C7 Deluxe
'01 Scodwell
'75 Olds Custom
'73 Getzen Severinsen
'67 Bach Stradavarius
'63 Martin Committee
'54 Contempora Trumpet (LB)
'53 Contempora Trumpet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Lboretrumpets
Veteran Member


Joined: 02 Feb 2010
Posts: 288

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not only is he the man with valves... he's an ex-Schilke employee, who can bring your valves right back into stock tolerances.
_________________
Bb- Stomvi Mambo
Bb- Custom Strad
Flugelhorn- Hunter NY
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mdbri
Veteran Member


Joined: 19 Jul 2010
Posts: 150
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanx, but I'll have to find someone here in Europe.

How's this problem fixed? I'm not sure if the valves need to be replated.

I'd like to do a complete overhaul with silverplating and all that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Richard A
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 721
Location: Rhode Island, USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mdbri wrote:

How's this problem fixed? I'm not sure if the valves need to be replated.

I'd like to do a complete overhaul with silverplating and all that.


Typically, the valve cylinders will be honed until they are round and straight. The the pistons will be plated until they're too large for the cylinders, then turned down / lapped for the desired fit.
_________________
Richard Ashmore
I am a Mechanical Engineer and have many years of Social Distancing experience.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
supportlivejazz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 3757

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd contact Schilke and see what they would charge for the work you want done. I'd also contact Dr. Valve and a couple of other well respected techs here and in Europe and get similar estimates. It may well be that shipping is a good option. I've never used Dr. Valve, but many techs end up sending the horn to Anderson's and getting the valves done there initially and then fine tuning them in house.

But I'd start with Schilke as a base line option.
_________________
Conn 6B
1940s Blessing Artist
Olds LA Special Model Cornet






"I'm not apologizing, I am what I am. There'll be no compromising, I don't give a damn."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mdbri
Veteran Member


Joined: 19 Jul 2010
Posts: 150
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Initially, I was thinking about sending it to Schilke to have all the work done. But, when I started to look into the paperwork needed to have it returned without paying customs' taxes and fees as if it were new, and decided to do things locally.

Thanx for all the info
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ed Kennedy
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 3187

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:46 am    Post subject: Valve Repair Reply with quote

Schilke has a good dealer network in Europe. Why not ask for a recommendation from Schilke for a competent repair shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
supportlivejazz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 3757

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are in Poland, see who worked on Tomasz Stanko's Schilke. I'm sort of kidding... sort of not. His horn was from the 60s and he just switched to a Monette. Somebody had to keep it running smooth.
_________________
Conn 6B
1940s Blessing Artist
Olds LA Special Model Cornet






"I'm not apologizing, I am what I am. There'll be no compromising, I don't give a damn."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Yammie
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 22 Feb 2005
Posts: 819
Location: sunny Sarasota, FL

PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:10 am    Post subject: Schilke Reply with quote

Last time I spoke to Schilke (2008, I think) they offered a great price on a complete overhaul of Schilke horns. I believe the price was $400 at the time, and included everything needed to bring the horn to new. Valve rebuild, new parts, whatever. Their reasoning was they want every Schilke out in the wild to be in great shape. If I had a Schilke needing work, I wouldn't send it anywhere else, even if I were overseas.
_________________
6340S, Connstellation 36B, 38B, 38A, and 28A, Couesnon flugel, Blackburn C, Kanstul/Besson 920 picc, and a HUGE pile of Messina Covers gig bags
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
trumpetera
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 1210
Location: Gothenburg,Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a thread I started recently that might be helpful!

http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1106502&highlight=#1106502
_________________
Principal trumpet Gothenburg Opera Orchestra
Bach LT 37 Bb (Mr. Findleys old)
Bach Mt Vernon 1957 Bb
Bach NY ML 1943 vintage Bb
Very old YTR-6335
Bach/Malone/Lechner C
Malone-Bach 229 C
H.Ganter Bb
Schagerl Wienna (older model) C
Parker Natural
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Capt.Kirk
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Feb 2009
Posts: 5792

PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It might just need a really good cleaning a mild lapping if the compression is still good a mild lapping is not going to harm it. I use .5 micron diamond paste that is between 5000-8000 grit depending on which of the 4 media grading policies you follow. I would use a benc motor or a cordless drill and in 30 seconds of less nice clean smooth bores. I would clean before and after the lapping. 30 years is a long time so I would use Naptha first on the inside of the bores followed by Castrol Super Clean. brush out the bores before and after the lapping. Same thing for the pistons I would clean them before and after the lapping.

Ferree's sells a 1000 grit lapping compound specifically for use with their bench motor to lapp pistons in under 60 seconds. I have used it and it works great as well and is also non-embedding.

The reason for the cleaning first is to prevent any old material that is oxidized from being pushed into the material.

If this is too aggressive for you then consider picking up some white toothpaste like Ultra Bright or a whitening polishing toothpaste. 5 minutes of toothpaste lapping is as mild as it get's and will really clean things up with out removing much. Think about it if it was too abrasive you would damage the ultra then enamel layer on your teeth. I guarantee you monel pistons are tougher then the enamel on your teeth and thicker as well!
_________________
The only easy day was yesterday!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Horns All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group