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Mouthpieces for rotary trumpets



 
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tp2038
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Joined: 03 Jan 2009
Posts: 97

PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 9:21 pm    Post subject: Mouthpieces for rotary trumpets Reply with quote

I just got a new Kuhn rotary trumpet Berlin type. As selecting a mouthpiece for it, the knowledgeable store consultant told me that German rotary trumpets require a larger inner diameter, deeper cup and more open backbone to produce German sounds. He explained me about the German design philosophy. I think I understood it.

My issue is that I just downsized my mouthpiece to Bach 5 size from Bach 1 size. It took me about a couple of months to downsize. I feel I do not want to go back to a larger size.

I researched it. But I did not find credible rotary trumpet mouthpieces other than Braselmair.

Fortunately or unfortunately, my new Kuhn came with two interchangeable mouth pipe. One for Kuhn original and another for Braselmair original.

I do not want to do mouthpiece safari again.

Do you think I have to oversize mouthpiece to get German sounds? I must get used to a larger mouthpiece again if I cannot get the true German sounds with smaller mouthpieces like Bach 5C rim.

Where can I get Braselmair G1 under part and Y5C rim for example?

I appreciate any input.
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WAKeele
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Joined: 25 Aug 2004
Posts: 383
Location: The Wild West

PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yamaha makes some good rotary mouthpieces and I believe a 14E4 is around a 3C feel with all the appropriate rotary mouthpiece characteristics. Last I was aware of, they made three sizes--at least for U.S. markets: 14E4, 15E4, 16E4. I have a 15E4 and once had a two piece 16E4. I love the 15E4 and is generally my mouthpiece of choice for rotaries. I normally play a Parke setup around a 1B and the 15E4 feels and works great to me--it's supposedly a 2C rim. For my hunt, Yamaha made it easy. It came with my first rotary. All the German/Austrian ones are usually hard to come by and are pricey, so I never experimented like I wanted to with rotary mouthpieces. The 15E4 worked so well for me too, so I never went out of my way looking. If you play rotaries a lot, you might want to invest the time and money now. I didn't when I first got one about 10 years ago.

I have a Schagerl G1 I'm going to list in the marketplace soon. It actually has a smaller throat and just doesn't do it for me.

Good luck!
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WAK
Ace Hardware Hoseophone w/heavy-weight funnel
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Handguard once believed to be used by Arban
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tptfrbrains
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Joined: 05 Jan 2007
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Location: Moers, Germany

PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really don't want to sound pedantic about this topic, but I grew up in the States, went to college there (Northwestern) as well as grad school (New England Conservatory).
I've worked in Germany my entire professional life, and done it almost exclusively playing the German trumpet.
I play the same mouthpiece as I do on perinet trumpets. Always have.
There are many people who will tell you that they use a larger cup, diameter, or backbore, and I'm sure they do, indeed, and they probably feel more comfortable and thus sound better.
However, anyone who tells you that you must do this to have an "authentic German sound" has spent too much time by himself. It's simply not true.
The entire Vincent Bach line of mouthpieces was designed after the "Kölner Mundstücke" designed (and still produced) by Wilhem Monke (and his company after his death). They were designed with rotary trumpets in mind. The people that played them had an "authentic German sound".
Play the trumpet every day for hours. Don't use it just to play a Beethoven symphony in rehearsals. Vet to know it as intimately as your other trumpets and THEN decide if you have to make some mi or adjustments to your present perinet trumpet mouthpiece for the optimal sound on your German trumpet.
Sorry to be so direct, but I believe that any other advice is silly.

r.
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Albert Castillo
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Joined: 29 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

+1
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tptfrbrains
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Location: Moers, Germany

PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The second to last sentence in my post should have read "Get to know..." and "minor adjustments", but my iphone is acting up at the moment...

r.
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WAKeele
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Joined: 25 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would like to add that the 15E4 I use helps compensate for the differences of the my rotaries against the much larger bore of my piston horns and always for less of a change in how I play. I personally can't pop in my regular mouthpiece and get the sound I want on a rotary. It usually comes off as I might as well just use one of my piston horns.
Everyone is different. The best guide to equipment selection is sound first and how easily it allows you to get that sound. You could do that with a Schilke 6A4A or a Breslmair G1, regardless of the type of horn you are playing. I have a friend that plays in a professional orchestra that had a Chuck Findley model mouthpiece (a very shallow cup) come up on top in a blind play-test. I was completely floored--we still joke about it to this day. We even played back the recordings. How some people's combination of equipment and how they are put together can yield surprising results. He didn't use the mouthpiece for his orchestral playing, but it got him thinking he didn't have to play that 1C anymore and lead him to a better fitting mouthpiece for his playing, his equipment and his physical makeup.
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WAK
Ace Hardware Hoseophone w/heavy-weight funnel
Bach 20C Megatone (gold plated) w/ 30 throat
Handguard once believed to be used by Arban
$10,000 Stoneline mute bought on eBay
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thrashkrieg
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Joined: 20 Jul 2011
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with all of the above. I use for my rotary trumpet what I use on my pistons and it works great for me, but I also have a natural tendency toward a darker sound. A lot of it depends on how you play, not what you play.
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Hairston
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Joined: 13 Jul 2018
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, thanks for sharing this with us.
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Andy Del
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another vote for don't fix something which isn't broken. I use the exact same Bb and C mouthpieces on my piston or rotary instruments. Other musicians can tell there is a pronounced difference in tonal colour.

The audience? Doesn't care and usually cant tell the difference either. They do care about wrong notes!

cheers

Andy
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