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Lost Another Important Member


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supportlivejazz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 3757

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

omayarts wrote:
Some people, like you, just seem to pop up whenever there is conflict and thrive on the misery and problems of others, never helping, but only exacerbating already heated issues.


Speaking of baloney.... I have popped up 3600 times, at least a couple of thousand times before CK got tossed off TM and came here. I have contributed to this site since 2003. You've been here since yesterday, have 5 posts, 3 are about CK and/or about long term members, all posted in this thread. Did I miss something here?

Anyway, I read all your posts. Please be fair and do the same with mine before you accuse me of popping "up whenever there is conflict and thrive on the misery and problems of others, never helping, but only exacerbating already heated issues. "

If you weren't referring to me.... ooops.
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supportlivejazz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 3757

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 8:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forgot... welcome to the site. Being a contributing member is better than lurking. Lots of great stuff posted in the Forums. I've learned more from TH about trumpets, trumpeters and some about playing than I can state. Great site.
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Conn 6B
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"I'm not apologizing, I am what I am. There'll be no compromising, I don't give a damn."
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Louise Finch
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 5461
Location: Suffolk, England

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

This may be a daft question, but has Capt.Kirk definitely been banned. Maybe I am misunderstanding, but his profile still says Heavyweight member, or do profiles remain as they were after people have been banned?

I suppose I was expecting his profile to say Ex-Member or something.

Anyway, I was just asking.

Take Care everyone.

Lou
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dmb
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Dec 2002
Posts: 1305
Location: Anderson, IN

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If/when a member gets banned, he is restricted from further postings, but posts that already exist will remain. At least that is my understanding.
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Flattergrub
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Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 762

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dmb wrote:
If/when a member gets banned, he is restricted from further postings, but posts that already exist will remain. At least that is my understanding.


So just in case we get nostalgic regarding CK we can always go back and remember the "good ole days"
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Don Lee
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Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 730
Location: California

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Diversity and tolerance, kids.


I would, of course, agree with the sentiment, (but I'm too old to be called a kid).
But those two qualities do not apply to CK-nor did he ever aspire to them.

It should be a two way street and I'm reasonably sure the moderators contacted him at least several times about his conduct in the forum.

Mostly, it was his way or the highway. He chose the highway.
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PH
Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator


Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 5859
Location: New Albany, Indiana

PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dmb wrote:
If/when a member gets banned, he is restricted from further postings, but posts that already exist will remain. At least that is my understanding.


This.
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gstump
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 934

PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is really no way to get banned from a forum like TH. The code can deny an IP address, email address or username. Mr. Kirk can read these posts from another IP address. I am not a lawyer but have been sued over Internet Copyright issues. This is an emerging area. I hired better lawyers and won. Libel and slander have a very high standard and the WWW is the really the Wild Wild West.

Perceived anonymity can allow one to become arrogant and disrespectful. I try not to sink to that level but I certainly have in the past. I am working on that!

I find this entire situation rather sad but such it is on anonymous forums. When I was a union boss we did not allow anonymous posts. But then, we broke a few knee caps to get our point across.

This is a meaningless post so.....Merry Christmas
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supportlivejazz
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 3757

PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gstump wrote:

When I was a union boss we did not allow anonymous posts. But then, we broke a few knee caps to get our point across.

This is a meaningless post so.....Merry Christmas



It was a simpler time... and having lived in Detroit in the 1960s, a simpler place as well.

Merry Christmas to all.
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Conn 6B
1940s Blessing Artist
Olds LA Special Model Cornet






"I'm not apologizing, I am what I am. There'll be no compromising, I don't give a damn."
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gbdeamer
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 31 Dec 2007
Posts: 2288

PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gstump wrote:
There is really no way to get banned from a forum like TH. The code can deny an IP address, email address or username. Mr. Kirk can read these posts from another IP address. I am not a lawyer but have been sued over Internet Copyright issues. This is an emerging area. I hired better lawyers and won. Libel and slander have a very high standard and the WWW is the really the Wild Wild West.

Perceived anonymity can allow one to become arrogant and disrespectful. I try not to sink to that level but I certainly have in the past. I am working on that!

I find this entire situation rather sad but such it is on anonymous forums. When I was a union boss we did not allow anonymous posts. But then, we broke a few knee caps to get our point across.

This is a meaningless post so.....Merry Christmas



You're correct that anyone can read the posts here (it's an open forum) but you can absolutely be "banned" from posting because privilege is reserved for registered members.

If Kirk was banned he can absolutely read posts here, and from another IP he can attempt to register under a new name, but because of his "unique" communication style he would be quickly identified.

The real-life identities of many people who post here (including Kirk) are known, so there's not as much anonymity as you may think.
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tommy t.
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 01 Mar 2002
Posts: 2599
Location: Wasatch Mountains

PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LittleRusty wrote:

... some of the posts on TH cross into the legal category of libel. They are definitely defaming craftsmen's character and are written.

If I am right, and I may be wrong, it would seem that TH and it's moderators would want to do their best to avoid being caught up in a libel suit. But I am just your average citizen and not a lawyer.


Well, I am trained as lawyer, although my practice was in a very rarified form of finance and I am retired and not an active member of any state of federal bar. Deliberately causing the publishing of falsehoods for the purpose of harming another, financially or in reputation, is libel and the harmed person could maintain a suit for damages. (Whether the person harmed would win and if so what the compensation might be is always a difficult prediction.)

Someone knowingly aiding and abetting a person guilty of libel might also be subject of a suit -- although in the case of a moderator of an openly argumentative forum, proving that there was any duty between the moderator and the harmed person might be pretty hard.

Personally, I don't know what the moderators should do in the present circumstance. I don't like ugly controversy -- that's why I'm not a moderator of anything. If I were a moderator, I would resign.

Again, personally, I am quite upset at these events on TH. Through TH, I discovered DQ and received some of the best personal service I have ever encountered -- then I see that terrible name-calling going on in the 4-valve thread against Michael. There may no libel in the thread because there may be no actual intent to harm -- it's sophmoric and for sure there is no redeeming merit either -- probably just grandstanding by someone who wants to attract attention.


Tommy T.
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Louise Finch
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 5461
Location: Suffolk, England

PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Thanks guys for the clarification.

I was asking, because as far as I remember, on the now ended Brass-Forum UK, members who were banned or who had asked to leave, screen names had Ex-Member written under their profile name, rather than Heavyweight member etc., and I have a feeling that their screen name was kind of greyed out.

You couldn't view the profile of these members, or PM them.

I just expected the same on here.

Never mind.

Take Care

Lou
_________________
Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
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Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs
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Mr.Hollywood
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Dec 2002
Posts: 1730

PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is this the guy ???

https://www.google.com/search?q=trumpet+herald+forum+Capt+Kirk+photo&sa=X&tbm=isch&source=iu&imgil=Bw0L6OvKIuXEyM%253A%253Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fencrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com%252Fimages%253Fq%253Dtbn%253AANd9GcTRCXXVlMgC3LiS_wvnxRH9ddG5W4JP1ifzay1KCZ2aerbMGV-T_Q%253B300%253B300%253Bv0-S3BDGoVqdDM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.trumpetherald.com%25252Fforum%25252Fviewtopic.php%25253Ft%2525253D126694%25252526postdays%2525253D0%25252526postorder%2525253Dasc%25252526start%2525253D0%25252526sid%2525253D83f7b8fc5a52c14ddf7bc686d96ec23b&ei=HOrGUp3_KOv22QWvg4CoBQ&ved=0CC4Q9QEwAA&biw=1093&bih=479#facrc=_&imgrc=Bw0L6OvKIuXEyM%3A%3Bv0-S3BDGoVqdDM%3Bhttps%253A%252F%252Fa3-images.myspacecdn.com%252Fimages03%252F25%252Ff8afe3df29b4419abc61a7e728049269%252F300x300.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.trumpetherald.com%252Fforum%252Fviewtopic.php%253Ft%253D126694%2526postdays%253D0%2526postorder%253Dasc%2526start%253D0%2526sid%253D83f7b8fc5a52c14ddf7bc686d96ec23b%3B300%3B300

I missed it the first time, but its still out there......

Nice head of hair.

CLB
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razeontherock
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 05 Jun 2004
Posts: 10609
Location: The land of GR and Getzen

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PH wrote:
I think the problem has been that the Moderators have traditionally only banned people who violate the usage agreement. Being an idiot and a blowhard is not against the current usage agreement. I agree that something has to change.




Can I quote you on that? (Oh wait, I just did)

Hoping 2014 finds you well, Mr Harbison
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