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Mpc and BE


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trumpetteacher1
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 2964
Location: Garland, Texas

PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Someone out there able to explain this miracle?


It's only a miracle if you don't understand basic lip mechanics (pages 12 - 15 in the BE book) and clearly grasp how players get off-track so easily. But I understand. In the beginning, it all seemed like a miracle to me, too. Now, after firsthand seeing the transformation of hundreds of players, it is an expectation.

Jeff
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Seymor B Fudd
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 17 Oct 2015
Posts: 724
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trumpetteacher1 wrote:
Quote:
Someone out there able to explain this miracle?


It's only a miracle if you don't understand basic lip mechanics (pages 12 - 15 in the BE book) and clearly grasp how players get off-track so easily. But I understand. In the beginning, it all seemed like a miracle to me, too. Now, after firsthand seeing the transformation of hundreds of players, it is an expectation.

Jeff



You are right, of course. And I have read the pages, numerous times.
But still!!
Also I wonder how come BE hasn´t spread like wildfire? I know, mankind is a dífficult-to-move-lot. As the french say "chacun a son gout" If we disregard the tendency to get fascinated by charismatic madmen, so prevalent since the dawn of recorded history.
I have tried to introduce the basic concepts to the trumpet- /cornetplayers I know, but the impact I´ve made so far is meager. But, I´ve noticed raised eyebrows.......
And thanks for your comment!
_________________
Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Denis Wick Ultra 7C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Getzen Eterna Eb /M V 1 1/2 C
Trumpets:
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970) Stork VM6
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1973)/Stork VMS6
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mark61
Veteran Member


Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok , I should probably know this , but someone steer me in the right direction to this Book.

Thnks
Mark
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kehaulani
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 3167
Location: Texas, by way of Germany and Hawaii

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mark61 wrote:
Ok , I should probably know this , but someone steer me in the right direction to this Book.

Thnks
Mark


http://www.trumpetteacher.net/
_________________
If you haven't lived it, you can't blow it.

"Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis." Chet Baker

Benge 3X
Martin Committee (1956)
Connstellation 38B (1959)
Hans Hoyer G10 French Horn
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trumpetteacher1
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 2964
Location: Garland, Texas

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Ok , I should probably know this , but someone steer me in the right direction to this Book.


Hi Mark,

Are you OK? I'm asking sincerely. This is the third time you have posted asking for info about BE (including starting your own thread). Each time your inquiry was answered.

If you are just being absent minded, I apologize for my question!

Jeff
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trumpetteacher1
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 2964
Location: Garland, Texas

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Also I wonder how come BE hasn´t spread like wildfire? I know, mankind is a dífficult-to-move-lot.


I used to wonder about that myself, and spent years trying to understand it. There is an old quote often attributed to Einstein: "It is a sad age when it is more difficult to break a prejudice than an atom."

The short answer is, the human experience is very challenging - in any age - and the tendency to polarize is built into the system. A good starter book on the subject is Thomas Sowell's "A Conflict of Visions." These days, I am less concerned about why people resist BE. There will always be resistance, and life is short. It is better to focus instead on helping those who are somehow drawn to the vision and logic of BE and want to improve.

Jeff
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mark61
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Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea, I'm OK. Spent a lot of money trying to improve range. Lessons , didgeradoo, different methods. Ton of mpcs and still play a d above high C. Practice 1 1/2 - 2 hours a day in 2 sessions.
Have a ring in my top lip after playing approx 20 minutes on the staff.
Play low pressure on just the lead pipe to start my day.
Very frustrated with the results. And your right forget where I've been on forum .
Just very frustrated. Have a lot of people go out of there way to help for free also.
All appreciated, but my playing sucks. Not even sure how to blow or place the mpc any more.
Thanks for your concern , but , yea, I have multi responded and I guess looking to get better instead of taxed and worse.
Thanks
Mark
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kehaulani
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Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 3167
Location: Texas, by way of Germany and Hawaii

PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark, I'm making no judgements, but is it possible that you're just trying to do too much; looking for too many things to "help" you play, instead of just playing and going back to solid basics?
_________________
If you haven't lived it, you can't blow it.

"Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis." Chet Baker

Benge 3X
Martin Committee (1956)
Connstellation 38B (1959)
Hans Hoyer G10 French Horn
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Seymor B Fudd
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 17 Oct 2015
Posts: 724
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trumpetteacher1 wrote:
Quote:
Also I wonder how come BE hasn´t spread like wildfire? I know, mankind is a dífficult-to-move-lot.


I used to wonder about that myself, and spent years trying to understand it. There is an old quote often attributed to Einstein: "It is a sad age when it is more difficult to break a prejudice than an atom."

The short answer is, the human experience is very challenging - in any age - and the tendency to polarize is built into the system. A good starter book on the subject is Thomas Sowell's "A Conflict of Visions." These days, I am less concerned about why people resist BE. There will always be resistance, and life is short. It is better to focus instead on helping those who are somehow drawn to the vision and logic of BE and want to improve.

Jeff


Being a pro in my field I always do at least two long interviews before accepting people; the first in order to penetrate amongst other topics the willingness to change, the second to examine the effects of the first one + deepening.
Some do not have the inclination to make changes, deep down - others genuinely want help and there is an opening somewhere, in spite of superfiscial reluctance. Tricky business this is; I always tell them: This enterprise requires blood sweat and tears....(from both of us)in psychotherapeutic work; in any enterprise that comprises making changes.
I fully agree - life´s too short to be wasted on too "gated" persons.
I believe that playing in general, blowing a trumpet, is closely related to one´s personality, beliefs. Not being able to blow constitutes a tremendous blow to one´s self-esteem (been there suffered that).
Some of us keep banging our heads (been there done that ) before we realize "the way out is through the door" (old chinese saying).
I´ll try to get a copy of "A conflict of visions"!

Anyhow I am genuinely happy I found BE. Life begins at 71!
Ps although I am able to use the Wick 7 C for legit I keep doing roll ins´
on the Schilke 14D3D ´cause it is more difficult. Good idea or??
_________________
Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Denis Wick Ultra 7C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Getzen Eterna Eb /M V 1 1/2 C
Trumpets:
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970) Stork VM6
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1973)/Stork VMS6
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trumpetteacher1
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 2964
Location: Garland, Texas

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Yea, I'm OK. Spent a lot of money trying to improve range. Lessons , didgeradoo, different methods. Ton of mpcs and still play a d above high C. Practice 1 1/2 - 2 hours a day in 2 sessions.
Have a ring in my top lip after playing approx 20 minutes on the staff.
Play low pressure on just the lead pipe to start my day.
Very frustrated with the results.


Mark, I've heard similar stories before from others coming in to BE. We all bring baggage and internal conflict to the table when we engage in any learning activity. I am willing to help you if you choose the BE path, but you must be willing to acknowledge that you are at least partially responsible for your current situation. It will likely take at least some degree of reorienting your approach to the instrument. Some can do it without a live teacher, others can't. Stories of those who did it successfully are located on the BE testimonials page:

http://www.trumpetteacher.net/testimonials.html

Best of luck to you!

Jeff
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trumpetteacher1
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 2964
Location: Garland, Texas

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Ps although I am able to use the Wick 7 C for legit I keep doing roll ins´
on the Schilke 14D3D ´cause it is more difficult. Good idea or??


There is no way to answer this. BE is about pushing the envelope, but it is not about purposely "making things more difficult." Yet, I have heard from other players who use similar mouthpiece techniques. If you feel like it is helping you, then it probably worth going down the path a bit and see what happens. If it is a blind alley, you can always turn around and find a better street.

Jeff
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Seymor B Fudd
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 17 Oct 2015
Posts: 724
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 7:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trumpetteacher1 wrote:
Quote:
Ps although I am able to use the Wick 7 C for legit I keep doing roll ins´
on the Schilke 14D3D ´cause it is more difficult. Good idea or??


There is no way to answer this. BE is about pushing the envelope, but it is not about purposely "making things more difficult." Yet, I have heard from other players who use similar mouthpiece techniques. If you feel like it is helping you, then it probably worth going down the path a bit and see what happens. If it is a blind alley, you can always turn around and find a better street.

Jeff


Thanks! I shall go down, gently that path to see/hear what happens! With the modification of swapping Schilke with a Wick 3B, one of the stations along my safari....
One of the benefits of BE is the non-rigidity!
Probably I can´t refrain myself from reporting back
_________________
Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Denis Wick Ultra 7C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Getzen Eterna Eb /M V 1 1/2 C
Trumpets:
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970) Stork VM6
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1973)/Stork VMS6
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mark61
Veteran Member


Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not blaming anyone but myself. I'm the one behind the horn. Just sharing and want to get it right. I'm frustrated, is all. . I will look over the testimonials you sent and read more of the forum.
Thanks for your replies.
Mark
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Seymor B Fudd
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 17 Oct 2015
Posts: 724
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2016 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mark61 wrote:
Not blaming anyone but myself. I'm the one behind the horn. Just sharing and want to get it right. I'm frustrated, is all. . I will look over the testimonials you sent and read more of the forum.
Thanks for your replies.
Mark



Mark! "Where do I read to get educated?" please excuse me for quoting you -I mean no harm; Just a question though - I got stuck with "get educated". I am not trying to play guru...... Been there myself, nothing seemed to help. Easy then, to end up in underestimating oneself...out of hope, nothing more to be done...but to throw in the towel as we say over here.
In my (humble) opinion you do not "get" educated" - you actively fight with the new knowledge; blood sweat and tears - to see if it is compatible with "your way"(thereby exposing you to the risk of finding new ways..). As you keep trying you´ve got the stamina!
I fought all by myself ending up in ruined chops, banging my head you might say. Then found this pro who helped me - I was fighting myself.... I was forced to admit my chops had been "faulty" all my life (in spite of performing rather well at many occasions).
So maybe a consultation with a pro, over skype or else to get some input.
It sure helped me!

Like you I had never heard of BE prior to January 2016. Not a coincidence though, I was actively searching for something that would further enhance my chops. Partly driven by the fact that I am getting older (thank God), partly by the fact I happened (literally) to occupy the leadchair in a bigband - I wanted to see if I actively could progress even more - and man - what an epiphany . Really changing the blowing prospect of my future...Never even dreamed this would happen.
New member to the cult eh? This is not a cult it is a congregation of open minded individuals ( ). Open the door and walk right out!

ps found this:http://www.bulletproofmusician.com/the-most-important-question-to-ask-yourself-after-a-fail-epic-or-otherwise/
_________________
Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Denis Wick Ultra 7C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Getzen Eterna Eb /M V 1 1/2 C
Trumpets:
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970) Stork VM6
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1973)/Stork VMS6


Last edited by Seymor B Fudd on Mon May 23, 2016 6:58 am; edited 4 times in total
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trumpetteacher1
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 2964
Location: Garland, Texas

PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2016 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Not blaming anyone but myself. I'm the one behind the horn. Just sharing and want to get it right. I'm frustrated, is all. . I will look over the testimonials you sent and read more of the forum.
Thanks for your replies.


Very well said. Can't ask for much more.

Jeff
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