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Warm-Up order changes



 
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Larrios
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Joined: 14 Nov 2003
Posts: 794
Location: Serooskerke (Walcheren), The Netherlands

PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2004 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi all,

I just wanted to share a little of how I experiment with the order of the focused warm-up. I'm very interested in your experiences as well. Similarities, differences, let's hear and discuss them!

As some of you already know from previous posts or personal contact, I've experimented with the focused warm-up. The main order change I made, was to start with the roll in excersises instead of the roll out. Physically, I found them the most demanding for a very long time, so I wanted to start out fresh on those, as that would make it easier to make my lips remember the movement.

However, I've shifted the order back again recently. I reached a point at which I got my roll in more or less stable, finally. Top of the staff G is now always there in that position. As happy as I was with that, I did reach a plateau again. After a bit of experimentation, I found that the other excersises (hold till empty, crescendo, tongue on lips) gave me better results if I did them before roll in and after roll out. (Exactly as it is suggested in the lesson plans, by the way.) Before, I wouldn't be able to do any roll in in this order, but now that I am more stable, I can play them at the end of the warm-up with not much trouble. It's still demanding, of course, but I have enough strength now to keep it in place. This gives me a much higher overall benefit of the warm-up, as the lips are not yet very tired of doing the roll in.

So, to summarise a bit, I found it very useful to work on the roll in first, but in the end, when the basic range of motion excersises are more or less stable, I believe that the order suggested in the lesson plans, how the excersises compliment eachother, gives the best results, although I'm aware that not everyone will start out the same way.

This is the first topic on my name, so it's new to me and I'm a bit scared, but I'm ready for the attack!

Ko
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zipdude
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Joined: 13 Nov 2001
Posts: 100
Location: Wooster,OH

PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2004 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

I've been working on BE for about 18 months and have changed up the routine more than once! I started off doing the lesson plan for a beginner for a week or so, then every week or two I moved to the next lesson plan just like the book says to do. This went on until I arrived at the 2-3 yr. outline and had a solid G3 using the roll-in 1 setting. This was eventually to end up about at about 6 months later, only moving on as I started to feel more comfortable all the way around. All I did during this time was move through the lesson plans as I gained some proficiency on the basic roll-in and roll-out exercises.

So, after some e-mails with Jeff, he suggested trying the roll-in stuff first. I was reluctant at first to do that, since I was used to the lip massage I get from doing roll-out 1,2,3. Later on I tried it and didn't have a problem with it like I thought I would . It helps some people to get the lips in the right position early in the day.

In the meantime during the "roll-in first thing" time period, I was trying the tounge on lips exercises at the end of everything that had to do with roll-in/out exercises. lol Usually, it was because I forgot about it, so here it goes!! I was pretty tired by then, since it probably took me at least 30 mins to get to this point. Heck, just going through all 7 valve positions on roll-out #4 will take a while in itself

Even if it's just going a 12th above the root note, i.e low C1 to G3. (not to mention doing roll-in 1,2,3 and roll-out 1,2,3, including tounge on lips roll-out #2b and "tounge on lips rolled-in" on the bottom of page 89).

I'm still not real sure where I should put the "tounge on top lip #2" drill, but definitely not after a heavy duty work-out doing everything I mentioned above. I might go ahead and put it in the regimen in the middle of the roll-in stuff. I've dabbled with it that way for 2-3 weeks now.

All I can say is that the tounge on top lip, for me anyway, is the most demanding of everything considering it's simplicity. If you can go all the way up to G3 with out struggling on it to much, then there's got to be some chop coordination/ strength/ developement going on in there. I've been know to warm-up on a gig/rehearsal with just that exercise as the very first notes coming out of the horn. BTW, I was running late and used it to get something going as soon as possible. In my opinion, it's kind of a rough way to start, especially if the mouthpiece isn't warm, but quick in it's results, if there's no other way/time to warm-up before the down beat. YMMV

Keep in mind this is all taking place during my "roll-in first" routine, which happened in the summer after 9 months or so of doing BE according to the lesson plans.

SOooo......it's been 5-6 months at least since that episode (man, I wish I kept a practice log!) and now I'm back to doing...

1) roll-out 2a,2b,3 as the first things of the day because I still like the tingle and massage of the double pedals. It gets the blood circulating. I don't do roll-out #1 anymore in lieu of time. Besides, I've done it enough times that I know where those notes/setting are at.

2) Go to the roll-in things next starting with roll-in 1,2. Sometimes I start on high C if it feels ok.

3)Followed by the "tounge on top lip" drill using the roll-in setting, (found on the bottom of pg 89). Occasionally going up to high C if I feel strong enough to do it. I must say, the tounge on lips drill will tell you about how strong your set-up is at that point. Always keep in mind the "3 strikes and you're out" advice. If you're struggling to get to tuning note C, E2 or G3, don't keep beating a dead horse. Stop and rest. Try it again the next day or something. This is someting I do maybe once a week, going above G3 I mean. Maybe I don't even get to G3. Some days that's just the way it goes.

4) Finish up the roll-ins with R/I #3. Mostly starting on G3, but sometimes on C3.

take a good break if needed. Chances are, even if you're doing the beginning lesson plan suggestions, you've been at it for at least 10-15 mins. Take a break for at least as long as you played. That's just common sense when practicing in general.

And last but not least....

I do roll-out #4 as a practice session in itself. Go through as many valves combinations as needed. Preferably all 7, but sometimes I will only do 5 whole steps, or if time is really short, maybe just open position-12 position-123 postion. Even in the shortened version I've mentioned, a good 10-15 mins. will be involved depending on how high you can go. Be sure to take a good rest after this one. Like I said, I kinda use it as a mini practice session within a practice session. Lately, I've just been doing open, 2nd and 1st positions for a week trying to get two octaves from the root note. I should clarify; that means with a huge sound throughout the entire range from the pedals to the highest I can go that day. It varies a little bit. The goal for me is to reach that G4 just like on the CD.

I've got a ways to go yet, but little by little it's happening.

Who knows, in the months to follow, I'll try a different order than described above. If nothing else, it's refreshing just to mix up the practice routine, not only pertaining to BE, but whatever you might be inclined to work on!

Well I've rambled enough.

Looking forward to hear what others have found out!

Mike


edited for spelling



[ This Message was edited by: zipdude on 2004-01-22 10:43 ]

[ This Message was edited by: zipdude on 2004-01-22 10:44 ]
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HJ
Veteran Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2003
Posts: 387
Location: The Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2004 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Ko,

That is typical. We discussed this half a year ago or so, and I made the change from roll-out first to roll-in first. And just like you and Mike I changed back about two months ago. I just follow the lesson plan again. I do hold till empty as the first thing on a normal day, always, then roll-out 1,2,3,4. Crescendo, roll-in 1,2,3,4. I take a few short breaks inbetween if it does not feel comfortable anymore, or when I feel fatigue.
I laid off the roll-out #4 on and off, because sometimes it does not really work that good, but now it is back in my routine and I play it in a very relaxed fashion up to high C, not further, because I loose the right feel. I can play it up to high G if I want to, but things get easily out of control when I do that.

Tonguing is a bit different. I always tongue on my lips from the moment I read in Jeffs book that it was allright do do so. This is what I did as a kid, so I had little difficulty in relearning it. Tonguing on a rolled in position is something else.I make a short session out of this after the BE part. I take a short brake and then practice tonguing rolled in for ten minutes. I start with roll-in #2 tongue on lips. And I end up doing a TCE way of tonguing described by Callet (look in the Callet forum if you want to know more). For me this is a transitional part between BE and TCE practice which I do for about thirty minutes a day after BE.

Bert

[ This Message was edited by: HJ on 2004-01-23 11:32 ]
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