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esossai
Regular Member
Joined: 04 Sep 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Florida, USA
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 Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:59 pm Post subject: What Hetman to use? |
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Hi
I know some have already enquired what the best valve oil but I have a slight different question for the Hetmans fans out there.
I have been using Hetmans #3 but was wondering which one is the best compared to the #2 and the light version.
I am a student and use a King Silver Flair 2055T.
Thanks |
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HERMOKIWI
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2008
Posts: 2625
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| Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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Honestly, I don't think it makes much difference. I think they're all about the same (and I've used all three). The problem I've had with Hetman's is that it turns fluorescent yellow after it's been in your horn awhile which makes it a mess to deal with. I'm using Ultrapure now with no such problems.
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wiemelen
Veteran Member
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 463
Location: Belgium
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 12:13 am Post subject: |
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| HERMOKIWI wrote: | | Honestly, I don't think it makes much difference. I think they're all about the same (and I've used all three). The problem I've had with Hetman's is that it turns fluorescent yellow after it's been in your horn awhile which makes it a mess to deal with. |
Fluorescent yellow? Would be nice for those "Back to the 70-ties" gigs 
I'm using Hetman 2 for some years now. Good oil which keeps my old, bit worn out valves running.
I'm guessing the issues you had may either relate to the alloy of your valves/trumpet tubes and/or chemistry of your saliva.
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Trumpet : Yamaha YTR-9335CHS + Yamaha YTR-6335H
Trumpet mouthpieces : Lotus 2L (main) + Lotus 2L2
Flugelhorn : Kanstul 1525 with Curry 1,5FL + Ray Far Diamond
Cornet : Conn 80a (1919) with Curry 1,5 BBC + Curry 1,5 VC + GR L66,9 #6 |
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GeorgeB
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Joined: 20 Apr 2016
Posts: 1063
Location: New Glasgow, Nova Scotia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:50 am Post subject: |
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I use #1 for my newer Bach and Hetman #3 classic for my 1952 Selmer Paris.
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GeorgeB
1960s King Super 20 Silversonic
2016 Manchester Brass Custom
1938-39 Olds Recording
1942 Buescher 400 Bb trumpet
1952 Selmer Paris 21 B
1999 Conn Vintage One B flat trumpet
2020 Getzen 490 Bb
1962 Conn Victor 5A cornet |
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Dayton
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Joined: 24 Mar 2013
Posts: 2343
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:00 am Post subject: |
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I've used all three weights with great results. I use Hetman #1 on my newer horns, #2 on horns that are a bit older, and #3 on my vintage horns. If you aren't sure of how tight your valves are, I'd suggest starting with Hetman #2.
Good luck! |
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Brad361
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Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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Location: Houston, TX.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 7:03 am Post subject: |
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I don't know for certain how different 1, 2 and 3 are, but I use 2 on my newer horns, 3 on my oldest. As far as any residue, none that I have seen....can't say the same for a few other oils.
Brad
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“Some days you get up and put the horn to your chops and it sounds pretty good and you win. Some days you try and nothing works and the horn wins. This goes on and on and then you die and the horn wins.”
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TrumpetMD
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Oct 2008
Posts: 2496
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 7:33 am Post subject: |
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I use Hetman #1 on pretty much all of my horns. I had been using #3 on my 1974 Strad, until I had the valves rebuilt. No problems. No "fluorescent yellow".
Mike
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Bach Stradivarius 43* Trumpet (1974), Bach 6C Mouthpiece.
Bach Stradivarius 184 Cornet (1988), Yamaha 13E4 Mouthpiece.
Olds L-12 Flugelhorn (1969), Yamaha 13F4 Mouthpiece.
Plus a few other Bach, Getzen, Olds, Carol, HN White, and Besson horns. |
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Craig Swartz
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Joined: 14 Jan 2005
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 7:59 am Post subject: |
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I use 2 on most of my trumpets, just tried some 3 on an old Bach, really can't tell the difference. Never tried 1. I've also never seen any yellow, I think you're just drinking real cheap booze, HERM.  |
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HERMOKIWI
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2008
Posts: 2625
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:18 am Post subject: |
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| Craig Swartz wrote: | | I use 2 on most of my trumpets, just tried some 3 on an old Bach, really can't tell the difference. Never tried 1. I've also never seen any yellow, I think you're just drinking real cheap booze, HERM. |
Actually it might be the opposite. I'll have to think about whether this has been going on only since I switched from Johnnie Walker to Ardbeg, Laphroaig and Lagavulin.
Seriously, though, a lot of players have had the problem of Hetman turning fluorescent yellow. If you Google it you'll find multiple comments. With some players it may be a combination of the valve oil and the Hetman slide grease. All I know for sure is that when I stopped using Hetman the problem disappeared (and it's a really gross problem). I never had a functional problem with Hetman, it was just the issue of a river of fluorescent yellow gunk coming out of the spit valves and a yellow deposit building up on all the slide joints, valve cap joints, etc. I haven't seen a definitive explanation of why this happens with some players.
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Brad361
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Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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Location: Houston, TX.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:27 am Post subject: |
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| HERMOKIWI wrote: | | Craig Swartz wrote: | | I use 2 on most of my trumpets, just tried some 3 on an old Bach, really can't tell the difference. Never tried 1. I've also never seen any yellow, I think you're just drinking real cheap booze, HERM. |
Actually it might be the opposite. I'll have to think about whether this has been going on only since I switched from Johnnie Walker to Ardbeg, Laphroaig and Lagavulin.
Seriously, though, a lot of players have had the problem of Hetman turning fluorescent yellow. If you Google it you'll find multiple comments. With some players it may be a combination of the valve oil and the Hetman slide grease. All I know for sure is that when I stopped using Hetman the problem disappeared (and it's a really gross problem). I never had a functional problem with Hetman, it was just the issue of a river of fluorescent yellow gunk coming out of the spit valves and a yellow deposit building up on all the slide joints, valve cap joints, etc. I haven't seen a definitive explanation of why this happens with some players. |
I think that very well could be something to do with body chemistry and Hetmans oil, if there have been multiple accounts of this happening, there has to be something to it. I use Hetmans grease with the oil, no problems for me.....again, body chemistry?
Personally I've not had the problem, I did have a problem with Five Star leaving a waxy residue that was very noticeable. I spoke to somebody at the manufacturer who told me that it was parafin, and was harmless. Probably so, but it was annoying enough to me to switch to
Hetmans.
Brad
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“Some days you get up and put the horn to your chops and it sounds pretty good and you win. Some days you try and nothing works and the horn wins. This goes on and on and then you die and the horn wins.”
— Dizzy Gillespie — |
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TrumpetMD
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 Oct 2008
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Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:30 am Post subject: |
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| Craig Swartz wrote: | | I think you're just drinking real cheap booze, HERM. |
Or accidentally using Hetman Vodka, instead of Hetman valve oil? 
https://www.facebook.com/Hetman-Vodka-117322954982371/
(Just kidding.)
| HERMOKIWI wrote: | | Seriously, though, a lot of players have had the problem of Hetman turning fluorescent yellow. If you Google it you'll find multiple comments. With some players it may be a combination of the valve oil and the Hetman slide grease. All I know for sure is that when I stopped using Hetman the problem disappeared (and it's a really gross problem). I never had a functional problem with Hetman, it was just the issue of a river of fluorescent yellow gunk coming out of the spit valves and a yellow deposit building up on all the slide joints, valve cap joints, etc. I haven't seen a definitive explanation of why this happens with some players. |
I use Hetman oils and grease, and have never seen this problem. Could there be other variables here that we're overlooking? I should add that I keep my horns pretty clean, with frequent leadpipe swabbing and frequenty wiping down of my valves. So there isn't much time in my horns for this to happen.
Mike
_________________
Bach Stradivarius 43* Trumpet (1974), Bach 6C Mouthpiece.
Bach Stradivarius 184 Cornet (1988), Yamaha 13E4 Mouthpiece.
Olds L-12 Flugelhorn (1969), Yamaha 13F4 Mouthpiece.
Plus a few other Bach, Getzen, Olds, Carol, HN White, and Besson horns. |
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jadickson
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Joined: 23 Jun 2006
Posts: 1317
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:55 am Post subject: |
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#2 On most, like my Getzen valves
#1 on Yamaha valves
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Justin Dickson
Middle school band director. Still learning.
www.BandmateTuner.com |
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trumpjosh
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Joined: 26 Jan 2002
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 10:23 am Post subject: |
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I'm pretty sure it's a body chemistry issue. I've been using Hetman #2 on most of my horns for over 20 years with no issues, but I have some customers who have had the issue you mentioned. Usually just switching to a different brand solves the issue.
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esossai
Regular Member
Joined: 04 Sep 2014
Posts: 11
Location: Florida, USA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 1:45 pm Post subject: |
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| trumpjosh wrote: | | I'm pretty sure it's a body chemistry issue. I've been using Hetman #2 on most of my horns for over 20 years with no issues, but I have some customers who have had the issue you mentioned. Usually just switching to a different brand solves the issue. |
I will try #2. My horn is not that old and maybe it will run better and faster than #3. Never had any real issu but just feel not as fast with #3. |
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Craig Swartz
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 7824
Location: Des Moines, IA area
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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| HERMOKIWI wrote: | | Craig Swartz wrote: | | I use 2 on most of my trumpets, just tried some 3 on an old Bach, really can't tell the difference. Never tried 1. I've also never seen any yellow, I think you're just drinking real cheap booze, HERM. |
Actually it might be the opposite. I'll have to think about whether this has been going on only since I switched from Johnnie Walker to Ardbeg, Laphroaig and Lagavulin.
Seriously, though, a lot of players have had the problem of Hetman turning fluorescent yellow. If you Google it you'll find multiple comments. With some players it may be a combination of the valve oil and the Hetman slide grease. All I know for sure is that when I stopped using Hetman the problem disappeared (and it's a really gross problem). I never had a functional problem with Hetman, it was just the issue of a river of fluorescent yellow gunk coming out of the spit valves and a yellow deposit building up on all the slide joints, valve cap joints, etc. I haven't seen a definitive explanation of why this happens with some players. |
Well- there's a good new poll for you then: how many players on TH find that Hetman's lubes turn a fluorescent yellow? I'd be interested to see if it's actually "a lot" or just one or two more vocal persons. (Or the maker of another brand of lubes. ) So far, in this thread, you're losing that argument... |
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trompette229
Veteran Member
Joined: 21 Mar 2016
Posts: 214
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| I've used Hetman for years, great stuff. I too have noticed the yellow in the bottom caps on all of my horns. It seems to me it gets a tad gummy although it takes a while (seems to coincide with about the time the horn needs cleaning). I'm still a happy customer but also wonder about the cause. |
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dstdenis
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Joined: 25 May 2013
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Location: Atlanta GA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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I used to use Hetman 1 with a previous trumpet. I do recall seeing a slight yellow tint in water dumped from the third valve slide if it had been a long time since I cleaned the instrument, like 8 weeks or more. I usually clean my primary trumpet more often than that, so I didn't see this very often, and it was never a bright fluorescent yellow. I have no idea why it did that, and I haven't seen this happen with other oils.
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jojocat
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Joined: 08 Dec 2012
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Location: Baie St-Paul, Quebec, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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I use #2 with any of my horns, whatever it is a brand new or a vintage one. I oil the valves every day.
I don't know how often you oil your valves, but you have to know Hetmann #1 is almost like water, so if you oil your valves once a week, perhaps you'll have some problem using this grade. You'll have to use a lot of this oil to keep your valves lubed.
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Last edited by jojocat on Sat Dec 24, 2016 4:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Crazy Finn
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Joined: 27 Dec 2001
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Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2016 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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I've found the new Yamaha synthetics to be a good alternative to Hetman. It comes in various weights and doesn't seem to have any yellow issues, and works very well in the school horns I use it on.
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Louise Finch
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Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 5674
Location: Suffolk, England
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| Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 3:18 am Post subject: |
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Hi Guys
Merry Christmas everybody.
I have the fluorescent yellow issue with Hetman and Yamaha Synthetic Light, but on horns that I don't play very often and leave oiled up. I play my Bach 183 flugel every couple of weeks and oil it with Yamaha Synthetic light. Fluorescent yellow leaches out of the slides. I haven't had an issue with it coming out of the water keys.
I however add a few drop of valve oil to my slide grease. Maybe this is the issue, and I should swap to a slide oil for the tuneable slides.
I use either Yamaha Synthetic Light or Hetman 1 on my Yamaha horns and Bach 183. I use Hetman 2 or Yamaha Synthetic Regular on my Boosey and Hawkes Oxford. I oil and swab the leadpipe and tuning slide (leadpipe only of course with the flugel) every time I play.
Take Care
Lou
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Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
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