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My jazz horn question


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GoodSandpiper96
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:45 pm    Post subject: My jazz horn question Reply with quote

Hey forum! So I've been playing on a Getzen 700s Eterna for 4 years now and I have finally outplayed my (low level) intermediate horn. I'm looking to upgrade to a newer horn that will help me progress into college as a lead trumpet player that give me a warm tone and powerful when needed. I was looking at a Bobby shew model horn, but I don't know even where to start looking for a new horn, so any help will be greatly appreciated!
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Dennis78
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There’s actually nothing about your horn holding you back. The Sev is regarded as a top tier trumpet. Any “faults” you may find in it will likely be in any other horn too
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jhatpro
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Shew is a great trumpet but so are a lot of others. Try as many as you can and don't forget that what you do for the horn will always be more important than what it does for you.
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HERMOKIWI
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're in for a disappointment if you really feel you've "outplayed" your present horn because you're going to have the exact same deficiencies on a new horn you have on your present horn.

Assuming your present horn is in good condition a new professional level horn might have a little smoother valve action, might play a little more in tune, might be a little more responsive and flexible and might produce a fuller sound but don't expect miracles because there are no miracle trumpets.

In my experience it's always a red flag when a student starts thinking that their horn is "holding them back." Exactly how is your horn hindering your advancement to any significant degree? Is there anything Wynton Marsalis does on his Monette that he couldn't do at a similarly amazing level on your present horn? If not, then how could you actually be "outplaying" your existing horn?

There are good reasons to get a professional level horn. The reasons relate primarily to ease of operation (valves), better intonation, more responsiveness and flexibility and a fuller sound. No horn can cure deficiencies in skill or ability. Only study and practicing the right things the right way can cure deficiencies in skill or ability.
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Shoe
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Shew 8310z is a really popular trumpet that can be used in a ton of settings. You can use it for sizzling lead licks or in wind ensamble and it will work well for you! They sell online for around 2300 new, and they pop up on eBay for 1,000-1500 a few times a month.
If your Getzen is a 700 special, the shew will be a lot more open and free blowing than your getzen. If you have a true eterna 700, the diffrences will be less noticible, but still there.
Goof luck and happy hunting!
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jon_norstog
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You might get as much mileage out of a new mouthpiece, as a new horn. If you are moving a lot of air when you play, for instance, you could be overblowing your 'piece. Or maybe there is a rim profile that will work better for you.

FWIW you already have a pretty decent instrument.

Good luck!

jn
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jhatpro wrote:
The Shew is a great trumpet but so are a lot of others. Try as many as you can and don't forget that what you do for the horn will always be more important than what it does for you.


This.

Brad
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Pete
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure why the term Jazz horn is used. I assume that you want a horn that you can play with a bright sound when pushed. The Getzen may be a bit tighter than people expect. If it is a Severinsen Getzen, I wouldn't get rid of it.

I play a few horns so here are my opinions on them. The 8310Z is a great horn for many different things. It is very adaptable to any mouthpiece. I love to play it when doing theater work. It is accurate and easy to play. My Bach 1981 LT43/43 is bright, focused and more powerful than the 8310Z when I play in loud (mostly big band loud!) situations. The 1964 Conn 38B plays great in all situations that I play in. It probably has the most powerful sound of the three for me but the Bach and Yamaha valves are easier to deal with.

Now all this being said, the horn that got away from me (long story) was a standard weight 1977 Bach Strad 37 with a 43 leadpipe. It did play as good as any horn that I have ever played. A standard Bach 37 is not usually thought of as a commercial sounding setup but with the 43 pipe, it worked for me.

The 8310Z was bought new but the others were used when I got them. If your Getzen is an older one, you might consider a valve alignment and a chemical or ultrasonic cleaning. This may get it to where you want it.

As mentioned by others, a new or different horn will not make you play better. I play the same on the different horns. The response and sound may differ a bit and I use them as tools for the job that I'm doing.

Pete
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete wrote:
I'm not sure why the term Jazz horn is used. I assume that you want a horn that you can play with a bright sound when pushed.

Actually, when I read jazz horn, I personally think of mainly solo work and in a darker context, not a brighter horn, which I would say, perhaps, big band or lead horn.

I'm not challenging the want of a brighter horn, just pointing out that jazz horn may not mean the same thing, one reader to another. Probably a more specific characteristic may get what one wants, quicker.
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Pete
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kehaulani wrote:
Pete wrote:
I'm not sure why the term Jazz horn is used. I assume that you want a horn that you can play with a bright sound when pushed.

Actually, when I read jazz horn, I personally think of mainly solo work and in a darker context, not a brighter horn, which I would say, perhaps, big band or lead horn.

I'm not challenging the want of a brighter horn, just pointing out that jazz horn may not mean the same thing, one reader to another. Probably a more specific characteristic may get what one wants, quicker.


The OP suggested that he wanted it to play lead in a big band. The term jazz horn as you say, is different to all. All horns to me are jazz horns because I play jazz on them. I sense that he really means a commercial or big band horn that would be on the brighter side. I am only going by his post since he has not chimed in since initially posting.

Pete
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oxleyk
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just stick with the Getzen. It will serve you well in high school.

BTW, the OP refers to a Getzen 700S, not a Severinsen.

Kent
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LittleRusty
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dennis78 wrote:
There’s actually nothing about your horn holding you back. The Sev is regarded as a top tier trumpet. Any “faults” you may find in it will likely be in any other horn too

A used severinson might indeed be a good alternative to his 700s.

However, I see no evidence to support, nor refute, your statement that his horn is not holding him back. But a trumpet that was purchased for a middle schooler four years ago might just have seen a lot of miles and abuse.

It might make sense to wait until you pick a college before purchasing a new horn. Some schools have a preference for certain instruments for their students.
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Mike Sailors
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every one knows you gotta have a Monette to play jazz.
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:40 pm    Post subject: Re: My jazz horn question Reply with quote

GoodSandpiper96 wrote:
Hey forum! So I've been playing on a Getzen 700s Eterna for 4 years now and I have finally outplayed my (low level) intermediate horn. I'm looking to upgrade to a newer horn that will help me progress into college as a lead trumpet player that give me a warm tone and powerful when needed. I was looking at a Bobby shew model horn, but I don't know even where to start looking for a new horn, so any help will be greatly appreciated!


If your Getzen (which by the way really is not a “low level” horn at all) is in good mechanical condition, I seriously doubt you have reached a point where you have “outplayed” it; maybe that was just a poor choice of words?
That being said, if you WANT a new horn that’s not necessarily a bad thing (many of us here are “gearheads”), as long as your expectations of a new/different horn are realistic. You talk about a “warm tone” and something powerful ,and for “lead”, are you certain you’re going to BE on lead?

Unless you have the financial capability to buy a brighter sounding “lead/commercial” horn, AND one that may be a bit better for all around playing, you might want to consider going with the “all around” horn and making a mouthpiece change for lead/big band. Or as others have mentioned, wait until you get to college and find out what you really need. That’s what I did, I ended up on a Schilke B5, which worked more than fine for concert band, solo/recitals, jazz band and weekend rock/wedding band gigs.

Tone, “power”, “lead” playing has as much to do with you as a player as it does with equipment.

Brad
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Pete
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Sailors wrote:
Every one knows you gotta have a Monette to play jazz.
LOL!

Pete
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GoodSandpiper96
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My horn is literally splitting in half xD. It's falling out of repair so much so that there are air leaks in valves that can't be fixed. I am first in jazz and I am very positive that I will be lead trumpet for the upcoming years. I have played on different yamahas and bachs and have gotten a very great sound and power from it. I have been doing big band work and combo works that I go to States to compete in.
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rufflicks
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are considering the 8310Z you might want to look at a Stomvi S3 and/or VRII. 2 fantastic and versatile horns. Here are a couple playlists

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL642C7E6BE644D195

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL67A07C94B4498194

Best, Jon
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GoodSandpiper96 wrote:
My horn is literally splitting in half xD. It's falling out of repair so much so that there are air leaks in valves that can't be fixed. I am first in jazz and I am very positive that I will be lead trumpet for the upcoming years. I have played on different yamahas and bachs and have gotten a very great sound and power from it. I have been doing big band work and combo works that I go to States to compete in.


In that case, sounds like you do need a new horn.

If you’re ABSOLUTELY sure that your focus will be big band/lead/commercial, some horns you might consider are Benge (LA or Burbank), Schilke, Getzen Eterna 900/Severinsen (yours is not a Severinsen), Bach 43, Kanstul Chicago.....there are TONS of choices. As others have said, pretty much any horn can be used for what you want with the correct approach and mouthpiece, but certain horns do lend themselves to be a bit brighter, maybe a bit more focused with an ability to “cut” through an ensemble...which does NOT mean a lead player should not blend in addition to leading a section.

Brad
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Richard III
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GoodSandpiper96 wrote:
My horn is literally splitting in half xD. It's falling out of repair so much so that there are air leaks in valves that can't be fixed. I am first in jazz and I am very positive that I will be lead trumpet for the upcoming years. I have played on different yamahas and bachs and have gotten a very great sound and power from it. I have been doing big band work and combo works that I go to States to compete in.


Holy crap! I'm thinking no one should ever consider buying a used Getzen 700 horn if that happens. Dang.
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Brad361
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richard III wrote:
GoodSandpiper96 wrote:
My horn is literally splitting in half xD. It's falling out of repair so much so that there are air leaks in valves that can't be fixed. I am first in jazz and I am very positive that I will be lead trumpet for the upcoming years. I have played on different yamahas and bachs and have gotten a very great sound and power from it. I have been doing big band work and combo works that I go to States to compete in.


Holy crap! I'm thinking no one should ever consider buying a used Getzen 700 horn if that happens. Dang.


Come on. ANY horn, if mistreated, never cleaned, dropped off a kid’s lap, banged into doors, thrown into the case, left laying on a cement parking lot, dropped off a set of bleachers, clobbered by a tuba, stepped on (all of which I see kids sometimes do) is going to fall apart and become unplayable, I don’t think it has anything to do Getzen 700s! Probably has more to do with (some, not all) people’s carelessness.

Brad
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