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alaskanaut Regular Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2014 Posts: 20
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Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 2:59 pm Post subject: More traditional cornet mouthpiece for beginner? |
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Hello Everyone, I am looking for some advice on beginner cornet mouthpieces. I have a Bach 184 G, and before that I played on a Schilke XA1. The Schilke belonged to the ensemble, so I couldn't keep it, even though I wanted to.
The director asked me to use a Sparx mouthpiece for a certain sound he was looking for. I had never had any first hand experience with a good set up on a cornet, and fell in love with the sound, and feeling immediately.
I recently tried a Bach cornet mouthpiece, and it obviously has a vastly different, more trumpet like sound. I'm teaching a beginner, and would like some advice on a beginner cornet mouthpiece. I don't know much about the more "traditional" sizes, or styles, from companies like Dennis Wick, and such. Do any of you cornet teachers/ seasoned players use the more traditional style mouthpieces to start students out? Do you start with the standard Bach, and switch later?
My student prefers the cornet sound, and they're small, so they feel it's easier to hold. This person is also an adult learner. A sincere thank you for any advice! |
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thomasjet123 Regular Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2018 Posts: 16 Location: Yorkshire, England
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Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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I would highly recommend the Dennis Wick 4B, it gives a very traditional cornet sound and is very common in traditional British brass bands |
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Dennis78 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2015 Posts: 673 Location: Cincinnati
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Posted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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I personally use a Bach 5b and play in a brass band. I get a very nice cornet sound, but attitude plays a big part. I’m partial to Bach mouthpieces though as they feel best to me _________________ a few different ones |
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Louise Finch Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Aug 2012 Posts: 5467 Location: Suffolk, England
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Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:18 am Post subject: Re: More traditional cornet mouthpiece for beginner? |
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alaskanaut wrote: | Hello Everyone, I am looking for some advice on beginner cornet mouthpieces. I have a Bach 184 G, and before that I played on a Schilke XA1. The Schilke belonged to the ensemble, so I couldn't keep it, even though I wanted to.
The director asked me to use a Sparx mouthpiece for a certain sound he was looking for. I had never had any first hand experience with a good set up on a cornet, and fell in love with the sound, and feeling immediately.
I recently tried a Bach cornet mouthpiece, and it obviously has a vastly different, more trumpet like sound. I'm teaching a beginner, and would like some advice on a beginner cornet mouthpiece. I don't know much about the more "traditional" sizes, or styles, from companies like Dennis Wick, and such. Do any of you cornet teachers/ seasoned players use the more traditional style mouthpieces to start students out? Do you start with the standard Bach, and switch later?
My student prefers the cornet sound, and they're small, so they feel it's easier to hold. This person is also an adult learner. A sincere thank you for any advice! |
Hi
Unless you student is also starting on a Bach cornet (which has a mouthpiece receiver/leadpipe style which will gives an actual mouthpiece gap, and at least in my opinion, works better with a Bach cornet mouthpiece as it maintains the gap of the supplied Bach mouthpiece), I also agree with the suggestion of a Denis Wick 4B. If your student is starting on a Bach cornet, I'd suggest the Bach 6.
All the best
Lou _________________ Trumpets:
Yamaha 8335 Xeno II
Bach Strad 180ML/37
B&H Oxford
Kanstul F Besson C
Yamaha D and D/Eb
- James R New Custom 3Cs
Flugel:
Bach Strad 183 - Bach 3CFL
Cornets:
Yamaha Neo + Xeno
Bach Strad 184ML
B&H Imperial
- Kanstul Custom 3Cs |
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RandyTX Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 Posts: 5299 Location: Central Texas
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Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:23 am Post subject: |
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Dennis78 wrote: | I personally use a Bach 5b and play in a brass band. I get a very nice cornet sound, but attitude plays a big part. I’m partial to Bach mouthpieces though as they feel best to me |
I played for years using a 5b on my cornet. It's not exactly the typical BBB sound, but it gets pretty close with a fairly cheap mouthpiece. One word of caution though, it has a notable different rim from a lot of Bach pieces and some people really hate it. If it works for you though, it gets a nice sound.
Also, the Trumpet shank version of the same piece can get a much less bright tone (like when you're playing cornet parts on a Trumpet and don't want it to cut through as much as say a 3C)
Curry also makes a line of interesting Cornet mouthpieces, in particular his BBC has a very nice sound, and the "vintage" ones he makes might be closest to the OP's inquiry. _________________ "Music is like candy, you throw the (w)rappers away." |
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GordonH Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Nov 2002 Posts: 2893 Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:32 am Post subject: |
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I am going to stick my neck out here and say that it is easier to play a 4 rather than a 4b in the medium to long term, in most cornets. Worth trying one for three months and see where you are after that period is over. _________________ Bb - Scherzer 8218W, Schilke S22, Bach 43, Selmer 19A Balanced
Pic - Weril
Flugel - Courtois 154
Cornet - Geneva Heritage, Conn 28A
Mouthpieces - Monette 1-5 rims and similar.
Licensed Radio Amateur - GM4SVM |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9365 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:34 am Post subject: |
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I'd guess it boils down to what "traditional" means. Do you want a 19th century-style piece? A British brass band style piece? A piece that just lets a cornet sound like a cornet instead of a trumpet? I think the last choice would be more user friendly, easier to play for a beginner. For a smaller size, I'd pick a Bach 6, and for a larger size, a Bach 3. I've been using a Bach 3 for a while now in my cornets and it works very well for melodic cornet parts and concert/wind band use. Very nice sound (not as fuzzy-sounding as a Wick 4 or 19th century-style piece), good dynamic range, fairly easy upper register, comfortable rim (for me, at least). Of course, all cornets are not created equal, and some are much brighter than others. The Bach 3 would be my suggestion, though. _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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malden Regular Member
Joined: 01 Feb 2018 Posts: 38 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:53 am Post subject: |
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CG Personal by Kanstul, or Yamaha 9C4...both are excellent. |
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boog Veteran Member
Joined: 04 Jun 2014 Posts: 247
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:01 am Post subject: |
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The cornet has other advantages other than being easier to hold. As my eyesight has deteriorated, I find it easier to sit closer to the music stand!
Really is unfortunate that the cornet has become the "red-headed stepchild" of school bands. They are perfect for kids, and for marching band!
My suggestion would be, as a few have noted, a Denis Wick 4. If you want to save a few bucks, there is a copy of the DW4 mouthpiece out there (ebay) selling for $12.50, including shipping. I bought one, and it is a very good Chinese knock-off of the original. Use it all the time! Short shank which helps bring some of my antique cornets up to pitch.
Also, the Bach 3 is good on the cornet. (the old "plain" 3). I also use a Mt. Vernon 3c when I need a more trumpet-like sound on the cornet. The MV size is slightly larger and deeper than the current 3c Bach cut. I use the Austin Custom Brass version because of it's availability at reasonable prices.
Good luck to you and your student! |
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p76 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jun 2006 Posts: 1070 Location: The Golden City of OZ
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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If your student prefers the cornet sound, don't give them a Bach. The Dennis Wick 4B that has been mentioned is a pretty standard Brass Band mpc., and is good for reinforcing the "traditional" BB cornet sound, if that is what your student is after. You should be able to pick one up pretty cheaply I would think.
There are some (I'm one), who can't get on with the rim of Dennis Wick mpc. Which is why I play a Curry 3BBC. Works well in a BB situation and is a good substitute. Curry also have some less "agressively BB" cornet mpcs which might be worth a look.
Cheers,
Roger _________________ Bb - Selmer Radial, Yamaha YTR634, Kanstul 1001, Kanstul 700.
C - Yamaha 641.
Cornet - Olds Ambassador A6T, Besson 723, Olds Ambassador Long.
Flugel - Kanstul 1525
Mpc. - ACB 3CS, ACB 3ES, Curry 3BBC, Kanstul FB Flugel |
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Andy Del Heavyweight Member
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Posts: 2665 Location: sunny Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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If you liked the Sparx mouthpiece, why not go with one of those? And buy one for yourself to use in the Bach - it might play better.
Im also one who doesn't get along with Wick rims. Just get the Sparx!
cheers
Andy _________________ so many horns, so few good notes... |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9365 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, I have a Wick 4B, a Wick 4, a Curry 3BBC, and a few other extremely deep cornet mouthpieces with huge throats. I sure wouldn't recommend starting a beginner out on one, though. I'd pick a mouthpiece that wasn't so demanding to play to start out on. Unless you are a soloist or plan on playing in a brass band where everyone is using a similar mouthpiece, I don't think a Wick is a very good choice for general cornet playing. _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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F.E. Olds Nut Veteran Member
Joined: 15 Mar 2010 Posts: 343 Location: Detroit
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Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 5:44 am Post subject: |
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boog wrote: | The cornet has other advantages other than being easier to hold. As my eyesight has deteriorated, I find it easier to sit closer to the music stand!
Really is unfortunate that the cornet has become the "red-headed stepchild" of school bands. They are perfect for kids, and for marching band!
My suggestion would be, as a few have noted, a Denis Wick 4. If you want to save a few bucks, there is a copy of the DW4 mouthpiece out there (ebay) selling for $12.50, including shipping. I bought one, and it is a very good Chinese knock-off of the original. Use it all the time! Short shank which helps bring some of my antique cornets up to pitch.
Also, the Bach 3 is good on the cornet. (the old "plain" 3). I also use a Mt. Vernon 3c when I need a more trumpet-like sound on the cornet. The MV size is slightly larger and deeper than the current 3c Bach cut. I use the Austin Custom Brass version because of it's availability at reasonable prices.
Good luck to you and your student! |
I just purchased one of the generic Denis Wick 4B copies off of Amazon and other than a couple minor imperfections in the finish, is looks and sounds just as good as a real Wick. _________________ Del Quadro "The Mother" |
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roynj Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Oct 2002 Posts: 2065
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Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 7:18 am Post subject: |
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You have made a good choice. A Wick 4B is a very good starting point. I prefer the sound and playability of the Wick 4 no letter, but the 4B will be "easier" perhaps for a beginner to adapt to. I personally play on a Wick 2B right now. I like the tone and response of this rather large mp. But it is not for the faint of heart (or air). |
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