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Lukarino
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Joined: 18 Apr 2017
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Location: Minneapolis, MN
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 Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Robert P wrote: | | trickg wrote: | | Here it is: If you don't have the self-discipline to check a watch or clock so you know how long you have practiced something, or to help you structure your practice time, then maybe playing trumpet isn't for you and you should find an endeavor that doesn't require that level of self-discipline and focus. |
My thoughts exactly.
Turning to a gadget for everything is ludicrous - people have become purchase point zombies for these cell phone cartels. Another pet peeve of mine is people being dependent on a #*@&! GPS - it makes them stupid. Buy maps and study your route, know where you are. Use the GPS as a reminder not a lifeline you're dependent on.
Maurice Andre, Doc Severinsen, Maynard, Bud Herseth etc. etc. became great players without apps. Buy a metronome. Put the cell phone away and start practicing. |
Tom Hooten of the LA Phil has said that he uses the Seconds pro app that I and another poster mentioned earlier. He is one of the top trumpet players in the country, and he uses an app to help structure his practice. I am sure that Tom Hooten is no stranger to self discipline. Different people need different things to be successful, and if it helps the OP practice better, what’s the harm? |
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trickg
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Joined: 02 Jan 2002
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Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Lukarino wrote: | | Tom Hooten of the LA Phil has said that he uses the Seconds pro app that I and another poster mentioned earlier. He is one of the top trumpet players in the country, and he uses an app to help structure his practice. I am sure that Tom Hooten is no stranger to self discipline. Different people need different things to be successful, and if it helps the OP practice better, what’s the harm? |
He might use it now as a means to streamline and simplify things for continued progress and maintenance, but I'd lay money on it that he didn't use anything like that to get where he is in the first place.
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Lukarino
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Location: Minneapolis, MN
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| trickg wrote: |
He might use it now as a means to streamline and simplify things for continued progress and maintenance, but I'd lay money on it that he didn't use anything like that to get where he is in the first place. |
“One of the things I noticed in my abundance of energy when I was younger is that I wouldn’t rest enough. Without rest … not only am I not physically resting, I’m not thinking enough. This app allowed me to create routines and you can add drones to them as music tracks. I have a routine right now but usually I don’t do any routine more than six months or nine months, I change it up because I get really bored and I feel like it gets stagnant. I do have this thing that I click on and it says, “Beep, stop playing you idiot, you need to rest.”
“It’s like a little guide that says, you can spend more time on this but it’s time to move on because you have intervals, you have scales, you have arpeggios, you have all these things you have to go through. The cool thing is, eh, if I don’t get to it today, I can start there tomorrow when I have time or something like that.” -Tom Hooten from an interview at http://www.chopsaver.com/blog/tom-hooten-principal-trumpet-los-angeles-philharmonic-orchestra-interview-part-1/
Ok, he may not have used it as a kid, but from that quote it seems it would have helped. Also it says elsewhere that before he used a kitchen timer, so it could have been something he used earlier. But that’s not the point. Hooten uses this app exactly like the OP wants: to give timed structure to his practice, and to factor in rest. This can be a valuable resource for the OP, and I don’t see why anyone should discourage him from using it, let alone discourage him from playing the trumpet. |
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Steve A
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Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 1808
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| trickg wrote: |
He might use it now as a means to streamline and simplify things for continued progress and maintenance, but I'd lay money on it that he didn't use anything like that to get where he is in the first place. |
No offence, but why does that matter? If he finds it useful, isn't that reason enough? I don't think anyone really believes a timer app will make you play as well as the principal of the LA Phil, but that doesn't mean it's not something that could be helpful. |
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Crazy Finn
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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Any device is a useful tool if it helps you improve and focus. Anything that distracts from focus and your tasks is not useful.
There's so much griping about things on lawns in this thread. Soon someone will bemoan the presence of terrible devil wires carrying electric charge in the house and those darned motorized carriages. What's wrong with torches, oil lamps, and horses?
No one's on your lawn, folks. Getting distracted by things isn't a new problem, it's just the things doing the distracting that's changed.
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chi2lon
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| Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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You could try using free music notation software to create the structure of your practice session. This would also allow you to have a metronome, drone, etc. You just need to figure out the number of bars you need for the desired time and separate sections with something obvious in the music. This could also potentially be useful as a metronome when working on pieces that are heavily mixed meter.
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Robert P
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2018 3:56 am Post subject: |
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I still stand by my previous disdain for the pervasiveness of gadgets but out of curiosity are there any private instructors at any major music schools or conservatories who advocate or even require app use as an official part of their individual instrumental instruction? I.e. - it's a required part of being under their tutelage?
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trickg
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2018 6:53 am Post subject: |
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I think that the point I'm trying to make here is that playing music, particularly with trumpet, takes focus and dedication, and it might not be a great idea to start developing a dependence on a crutch or tool. A better idea might be to work on developing an internal system utilizing nothing more than your brain and a clock or stopwatch.
The human mind is an amazing thing, and when you work to utilize it to its full potential, it can do some amazing things.
I went to a motivational speech once with Edward L. Hubbard, a former Air Force fighter pilot and POW who spent 6.5 years in captivity during the Vietnam War.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_L._Hubbard
I bring him up because he talked about the fact that being stuck there in a cell with nothing, the only thing they had was their mind to deal with the long days and boredom. They developed a means of communication utilizing a tap code because they were not allowed to speak or they'd be beaten, and even then they had to be careful.
Here's an example of how to tap the code for the letter S.
In the time he spent as a POW, he became fluent in Spanish without ever seeing it or hearing it, utilizing tap code, one letter at a time.
Tell me again how someone "needs" to use an app to manage their practice time. Don't get me wrong - I utilize certain tools to assist me in practice, and in particularly, utilization of recordings - but long ago I developed the backbone of all of that without the use of any technology or internet. I never even owned a metronome or tuner.
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"95% of the average 'weekend warrior's' problems will be solved by an additional 30 minutes of insightful practice." - PLP |
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JoseLindE4
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2018 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| I threw out my metronome years ago - it always seems to speed up when I got to the hard licks. Emancipation of time and all. |
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Brad361
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Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 7080
Location: Houston, TX.
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2018 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Crazy Finn wrote: | Any device is a useful tool if it helps you improve and focus. Anything that distracts from focus and your tasks is not useful.
There's so much griping about things on lawns in this thread. Soon someone will bemoan the presence of terrible devil wires carrying electric charge in the house and those darned motorized carriages. What's wrong with torches, oil lamps, and horses?
No one's on your lawn, folks. Getting distracted by things isn't a new problem, it's just the things doing the distracting that's changed. |
I’m not sure if some of the detractors of this app are in the “you kids get off my lawn” category, maybe it’s more of an “oh boy, another APP” mindset.
Hey, if it helps someone, great, but I wonder if getting distracted and forgetting to return to practice might be a bigger problem than using or not using an app.
Brad
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chi2lon
Regular Member
Joined: 25 Mar 2018
Posts: 14
Location: UK
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| Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 5:56 am Post subject: |
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| trickg wrote: | I think that the point I'm trying to make here is that playing music, particularly with trumpet, takes focus and dedication, and it might not be a great idea to start developing a dependence on a crutch or tool. A better idea might be to work on developing an internal system utilizing nothing more than your brain and a clock or stopwatch.
The human mind is an amazing thing, and when you work to utilize it to its full potential, it can do some amazing things.
I went to a motivational speech once with Edward L. Hubbard, a former Air Force fighter pilot and POW who spent 6.5 years in captivity during the Vietnam War.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_L._Hubbard
I bring him up because he talked about the fact that being stuck there in a cell with nothing, the only thing they had was their mind to deal with the long days and boredom. They developed a means of communication utilizing a tap code because they were not allowed to speak or they'd be beaten, and even then they had to be careful.
Here's an example of how to tap the code for the letter S.
In the time he spent as a POW, he became fluent in Spanish without ever seeing it or hearing it, utilizing tap code, one letter at a time.
Tell me again how someone "needs" to use an app to manage their practice time. Don't get me wrong - I utilize certain tools to assist me in practice, and in particularly, utilization of recordings - but long ago I developed the backbone of all of that without the use of any technology or internet. I never even owned a metronome or tuner. |
Because not everyone has as much time as a POW to practice trumpet? I typically work extremely long hours, and I don't have time to waste in my practice sessions. I have even collated my routine for fundamentals into a binder so I dont have to fuss trying to switch between books/finding pages. I then use a timer app to keep myself on the correct pace so I can work on everything I need to keep things ticking over. I certainly don't see using a timer as a crutch or an indication of lack of discipline.
_________________
Parke 640-285-24
Bb - Bach 37 MTV-MV
C - Bach 229 MV7
Toshi 16EWS
Bb - Schagerl Hans Gansch
Laskey 75MC
Eb/D - Yamaha 9610
Laskey PIC
Picc - Stomvi Elite
Monette B2 FL R6/FLG2
Cornet - Stomvi Titan
Flugel - Adams F2
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trickg
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2002
Posts: 5677
Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland
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| Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| chi2lon wrote: | | Because not everyone has as much time as a POW to practice trumpet? I typically work extremely long hours, and I don't have time to waste in my practice sessions. I have even collated my routine for fundamentals into a binder so I dont have to fuss trying to switch between books/finding pages. I then use a timer app to keep myself on the correct pace so I can work on everything I need to keep things ticking over. I certainly don't see using a timer as a crutch or an indication of lack of discipline. |
Once again, the point I was trying to make seems to have been missed. My point was simply to state that when one puts forth the effort to train their mind, it is capable of some pretty amazing things, and you don't need to be a POW to do it.
What you've done sounds very logical to me. You figured out what you needed, streamlined it by putting it into a logical, easy to access order, and then you utilize a basic timekeeping device to further facilitate efficient, productive practice sessions. That's actually pretty much in line with what I was suggesting to the OP, and that they didn't "need" an app to accomplish those things.
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Patrick Gleason
- Jupiter 1600i, ACB 3C, Warburton 4SVW/Titmus RT2
- Brasspire Unicorn C
- ACB Doubler
"95% of the average 'weekend warrior's' problems will be solved by an additional 30 minutes of insightful practice." - PLP |
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JoseLindE4
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 791
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| Posted: Wed May 02, 2018 6:27 am Post subject: |
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I'm considering foisting an early morning studio fundamentals session on my students next fall. Since we'd only have the 7:00-7:50 am block to do so, I'll need to be efficient with the time. I think I'll play with a timer app this summer to see if it helps things.
If it works for Tom Hooten and Chris above has been pushing it on his college students with success, it's worth a shot. |
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