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Yips or trouble starting notes


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comebackcornet
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dstdenis wrote:
Franquin method:

He designed these exercises as a way for trumpeters to practice starting first notes consistently well, which he observed is more difficult on trumpet than other instruments like cornet or flugelhorn, especially when trying to start a first note very softly.


Interesting, I find my articulations infinitely easier on trumpet than on cornet ...
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Seymor B Fudd
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

comebackcornet wrote:
dstdenis wrote:
Franquin method:

He designed these exercises as a way for trumpeters to practice starting first notes consistently well, which he observed is more difficult on trumpet than other instruments like cornet or flugelhorn, especially when trying to start a first note very softly.


Interesting, I find my articulations infinitely easier on trumpet than on cornet ...


Indeed! However for me just the opposite! One part-explanation being my lifelong playing in a brassband, hence concentration on pp cantabile dolce lushinghelgevolmente!
But when same mouthpiece (=equivalent) only a slight advantage for the cornet. Might have something to do with the sound wave spectrum involved?
Differences in mouthpieces, cornet pieces often deeper, cornet tubing different? (=different kinds of sound waves; longer waves easier to generate than shorter??). Or??
Conclusion (for me that is): more shallow mouthpiece more dififcult than deeper.
Or what I seem to have discovered lately: habituation to a horn/mpc is a very very powerful factor. All these minute feedback loops building up as time goes by. Furthermore on a subliminal level literally meaning you do not notice that you´re growing accustomed.
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roynj
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you will try practicing Clarke study 2, lines 27 (low G) through 32 (low C), with dynamics as marked (p), every day preferably near the start of your warm up, you will regain your confidence and blow much fewer air balls on those low notes. Practice with a metronome on starting the note is also a great thing because you will breath/play in time, which simulates the same thing as when playing music. When practicing these lines, rest as long as it takes to play after each one.
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Hugh
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been practising with a metronome for quite a while now. Things have improved but I still get problems with blocked airflow pretty often. I have worked hard on it, maybe too hard. I probably need to move away from the methods and exercises I've been using and just play more freely.

Like many things in playing trumpet it can be a labour of love.
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Turkle
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard this on masterclasses/clinics by Doc, Barbara Butler, and others:

You have to make sure that you start the note with the air, not with the tongue. The air should be like a violin bow, you start the air and then articulate from there. By ensuring your air is correct first, you'll be able to place the note more easily. It certainly works for me in the upper and lower registers.

Hope that's helpful.
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Hugh
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Turkle wrote:
I've heard this on masterclasses/clinics by Doc, Barbara Butler, and others:

You have to make sure that you start the note with the air, not with the tongue. The air should be like a violin bow, you start the air and then articulate from there. By ensuring your air is correct first, you'll be able to place the note more easily. It certainly works for me in the upper and lower registers.

Hope that's helpful.


That is helpful thanks. I've been told by teacher to get the air flowing before the tongue. I'll retry that.
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Jerry Freedman
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check out this Julie Landsman discussion about subdivision. Its a way to keep mental focus and avoid those "yips"

https://bulletproofmusician.com/julie-landsman-on-getting-into-the-zone-and-developing-trust-in-your-playing/
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lambchop
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

comebackcornet wrote:
dstdenis wrote:
Franquin method:

He designed these exercises as a way for trumpeters to practice starting first notes consistently well, which he observed is more difficult on trumpet than other instruments like cornet or flugelhorn, especially when trying to start a first note very softly.


Interesting, I find my articulations infinitely easier on trumpet than on cornet ...


I found low note response varies with the instrument. The best I've seen being an old professional Reynolds cornet. As far as touguing, KTM is harder to use for low notes and more important for high notes. Pops recommends the tip of the toungue on the tip of the top teeth for the notes under middle C, although CG would have you still use KTM.
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cbtj51
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Much great thinking in this thread, especially using a metronome during all practice sessions.

I have been starting my day (seriously, just after breakfast in the early am) with a 20-45 minute Bai Lin Section I and II warm-up session with metronome set at 80bpm for several weeks now. I focus on making every note sound as beautiful as possible by really listening to what I am playing as I play it. I often think of a line from the movie "The Last Samarai", "too many mind" to keep the focus on my sound "in the moment" and not so much on the seemingly myriad aspects of sound production. This practice is working well for me, but I must write the requisite YMMV at this point.

Kindest regards,

Mike
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MF Fan
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This may fly in the face of good technique or other expert advice, but for me I find that executing the inhalation with the tongue already lightly touching behind the front teeth, or in the case of anchor tonguing, lightly in contact with the roof of the mouth, has helped me. It removes one step in the process if you're otherwise inhaling with the tongue "floating" in your mouth. If it is, the initial attack requires you to 1). inhale, 2). move the tongue forward to contact the back of your top teeth or roof of the mouth, followed by 3). simultaneously turning the air around and pulling the tongue it back as you start the airflow to execute the articulation. You shouldn't have to consciously focus on these steps individually, they're supposed to happen in a natural fluid manner, but for me I find it easier to start with the tongue already in place which eliminates step #2, making it easier to turn the air around. Again, this may be poor considered advice by many players, but hey, it works for me.
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Blackquill
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nevermind. Doing that makes very little difference, if any, in my embouchure. Perhaps my embouchure is correct after all.
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