Yamaha flugelhorn mouthpiece gap

[fblues]

Hi, I have a Yamaha 631 flugelhorn with Wick 3BFL mouthpiece.
My question is about the mouthpiece gap.
In my feeling, the mouthpiece seems to be inserted deeply.
But it could be just an appropriate position or gap for flugelhorn.
I have not had previous experiences on flugelhorn; so, it is hard to tell for myself.

Here is a picture of the situation:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/10WhgPm3gfqFdzHe0mqr9ObnlJPVDdKkElw/view?usp=sharing

Do you think this is normal position or gap for a flugelhorn mouthpiece?

[Christian K. Peters]

Hello there,
Is there an actual receiver on the leadpipe? I thought it was just a pipe. In that case there is no gap at the venturi, and all you are asking about is how far the mp fits in. As long as it is a good fit of taper, there is not a problem.
_________________
Christian K. Peters
Schilke Loyalist since 1976

[fblues]

Thanks for the input, Christian.

The picture was not showing it clearly
but I think the mouthpiece is in the actual receiver
linked to the pipe that is inside of the lead-pipe.
(I am sorry if my description is unclear.)

The mouthpiece seems to be secure in that position.
So, based on your advice, it should be an okay situation.

I was curious because it seems to be much deeper into the receiver
compared to the trumpet or cornet case.

[Christian K. Peters]

Hello there,
That mouthpiece just looks deceiving. If the fit as good, all is good.
_________________
Christian K. Peters
Schilke Loyalist since 1976

[fblues]

I got it, Christian.
Thank you for the kind response.
It is very helpful to me!

[Flugelnut]

It looks like your 3BFL inserts into the Yamaha leadpipe the same distance as my 4FL (identical shank) into my Benge 5's pipe, which has a receiver similar to the Yamaha.
My mouthpece inserts for 1.0 in (25.4 mm) give or take a few tenths of a mm.
I also think you're OK.

[Irving]

Inhave a 731 Yamaha flugel. With a Wick flugelhorn mpc, with yamaha shank, I forget what the model is, it plays pretty badly. It fits fine, but doesn't work. With a Yamaha flugel mpc, the horm works 100% better. The difference is incredible.

[fblues]

Thanks for the additional info.
I also didn't think the combination is an ideal one.
But, since I only have one flugelhorn Mpc,
I did not have a way to verify it..

Will definitely try Yamaha Mpc!

[Bandcity]

When my lead pipe is fully inserted into the mouth pipe there is a gap of about 1/8 inch (3mm) on my Yamaha 631. That is, if I understand gap.

First take out the lead pipe and call the distance from the end of the remaining tube (which I believe is called the mouth pipe) to the part of that tube that has a transition. Call that A.

Measure the distance of the brass section of the lead pipe (do not count the silver). Call that B.

When the lead pipe is fully inserted the gap is A-B. In my case it is 1/8 of an inch (3mm). If you pull out the lead pipe to tune you need to add that amount because you have increased the gap by that amount.

Your gap could easily end up being 1/2 inch if you tune by pulling the lead pipe out by 3/8 of an inch.

I never cared about my gap until I started reading forums. One of my favourite trumpet mouth pieces has a 5/8 inch gap, but I don’t care. There are too many other things to think about.
_________________
Tim

[delano]

Flügelhorns have no receiver (in the sense as a trumpet has) so also no gap. I admit I did not play all of them but still.
'Gap'is then understood as the space between the end of the mouthpiece in the receiver and the beginning of the leadpipe on the other end of the receiver.
On a flugel you insert the mouthpiece in the leadpipe that is only reinforced on the outside of the leadpipe by a piece of tube that not functions as a receiver.

Illustration:

http://www.dwerden.com/forum/entry.php/692-The-Adams-Adjustable-Gap-Receiver#.W8LtpmgzaUk

[maynard-46]

[delano]

There is no ring in a trumpet receiver, it's the beginning of the leadpipe.
The beginning of the leadpipe of a fügel is tapered to hold the mouthpiece (I dunno about French taper). That there are different tapers will not say that there will be a gap.
The whole thing considering the gap is only important if the gap is way out. I only once had to have a receiver resoldered because the horn would not play.
Maybe if you are a pro under immense stress to produce the most difficult scores it will be beneficial to experiment with the gap.
Mr. Schilke himself had the strong opinion that the best gap was no gap:

http://everythingtrumpet.com/schilke/Leader_Pipe.html


I like this statement of Tim Wendt: here on TH:
A while back, maybe 16 or 17 years ago, I had an adjustable gap receiver put on my Kanstul 1502.

Also got a set of heavy-weight bottom caps and a tuning slide with the slab of brass filling in the crook.

After 6 months or so of experimenting with my regular slide / new slide, using one, two or all three caps and in assorted valve combinations, constantly searching for the primo gap, and driving myself absolutely CRAZY with "well, is it me or is it the way I have my horn set up at that particular time?" I decided to have the adjustable receiver replaced with the original, gave the caps to students, and had the brass plate removed from the extra tuning slide and took all the responsibilty for what came out of the business end of my horn on myself instead of blaming it on the set up du jour.

And I've never been happier.

[maynard-46]

[delano]

[maynard-46]

delano

Not quite sure what ur point is by offering up that video. He didn't say anything new that I haven't known for years. I think the only point to my original post was that ADAMS flugels DO have a receiver ring UNLIKE the majority of the other flugels on the market. That's ALL I was trying to make a point of!!!

Butch
_________________
TRUMPE: SCHILKE B7 / Legends .585 "CatMaster" Top / KT "RT1" BB / Reeves #5.75 Sleeve.
FLUGELHORN: ADAMS Custom "F1" / Legends .585 "CatMaster FL.

[delano]

I phoned Adams today (they are close to where I live) and they assured me that all their flügels, including the F5, have a standard receiver, so made for large morse taper. I am not sure whether they make custom tweakings.
If your F5 has a ring in the receiver (just like your trumpets?) I have really no idea where those rings are for. Do they have any function except being a ring and being in te way?

[maynard-46]

delano