View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
BrightonY125 Regular Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2018 Posts: 20
|
Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:38 pm Post subject: From a medium deep to a shallow mouthpiece |
|
|
Hey guys, I know its stupid. I'm going from a Bach 1C to a shallow 20S Curry mouthpiece. I've been playing with medium mouthpieces only before, and I find that I can't get a consistent buzz on my new shallow mouthpiece. Please suggest any exercises so that can help me adapt from a medium mouthpiece to a shallow one. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BudBix Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jun 2006 Posts: 519 Location: United States
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
If you're being serious, I'd say start with a less extreme change. Like a 70M in the Curry 600 series. Small changes make a bigger difference than you might think. Play with less pressure. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Beaker Regular Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2007 Posts: 26 Location: Ellicott City, MD
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
How long have you been using the shallow mouthpiece? It may take some time for the transition _________________ Benge (L.A. era), Bach 5C, Benge 7C
ACB Doubler Flugel
Taylor acoustics, G&L and Carvin basses
Flatiron mandolin, Strat/Tele/LP electrics |
|
Back to top |
|
|
cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8911 Location: Orange County, CA
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
The exercise I'd suggest is taking both those pieces, burying them in the backyard, and buying a sensible, middle-of-the-road piece for a while. Seriously, a preponderance of players statistically speaking won't have an easy time with pieces on the far ends of the spectrum. Note that this advice is coming from someone who for years played a JetTone MF mouthpiece with absolutely no cup. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Billy B Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 6130 Location: Des Moines
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
The 1C is an extreme mouthpiece and by playing on it you have probably acquired some bad habits. Get a Bach 3C and learn to play it. _________________ Bill Bergren |
|
Back to top |
|
|
LSOfanboy Veteran Member
Joined: 08 Jul 2018 Posts: 347
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:20 am Post subject: Re: From a medium deep to a shallow mouthpiece |
|
|
BrightonY125 wrote: | Hey guys, I know its stupid. I'm going from a Bach 1C to a shallow 20S Curry mouthpiece. I've been playing with medium mouthpieces only before, and I find that I can't get a consistent buzz on my new shallow mouthpiece. Please suggest any exercises so that can help me adapt from a medium mouthpiece to a shallow one. |
What is the reasoning behind this?
Never a good start when you open with 'I know its stupid'... |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Brad361 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 7080 Location: Houston, TX.
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
cheiden wrote: | The exercise I'd suggest is taking both those pieces, burying them in the backyard, and buying a sensible, middle-of-the-road piece for a while. Seriously, a preponderance of players statistically speaking won't have an easy time with pieces on the far ends of the spectrum. Note that this advice is coming from someone who for years played a JetTone MF mouthpiece with absolutely no cup. |
Not certain I would go quite as far as interring them in the yard, but for the rest of this, +1.
Brad _________________ When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Seymor B Fudd Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2015 Posts: 1468 Location: Sweden
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:30 am Post subject: Re: From a medium deep to a shallow mouthpiece |
|
|
BrightonY125 wrote: | Hey guys, I know its stupid. I'm going from a Bach 1C to a shallow 20S Curry mouthpiece. I've been playing with medium mouthpieces only before, and I find that I can't get a consistent buzz on my new shallow mouthpiece. Please suggest any exercises so that can help me adapt from a medium mouthpiece to a shallow one. |
The way I see it is that this shallow mouthpiece simply stalls every vibration because there is no room for your lips; probably your´e bottoming.
As the others has asked: why!!!!
I suppose you are not buying shoes half your footsize? Choose a mouthpiece that fits your lips. If you want a more shallow one, say for playing lead, then get yourself a piece that helps you, probably it will be more shallow - but there is a limit. Which you should be able to find out, testing various mpc:s. _________________ Cornets:
Getzen Custom Series Schilke 143D3/ DW Ultra 1,5 C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Yamaha YCR6330II
Getzen Eterna Eb
Trumpets:
Yamaha 6335 RC Schilke 14B
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970)
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1974)
Last edited by Seymor B Fudd on Mon Nov 19, 2018 1:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
John Mohan Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Nov 2001 Posts: 9830 Location: Chicago, Illinois
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
Billy B wrote: | The 1C is an extreme mouthpiece and by playing on it you have probably acquired some bad habits. Get a Bach 3C and learn to play it. |
Yes, after all, look at the bad habits players such as Adolph Herseth, Frank Kaderabek and Uan Racey developed by playing on 1C (or bigger) mouthpieces...
Seriously, Billy's suggestion to move to something less dramatically different, such as a Bach 3C, is a good one. That is, assuming there is any reason to switch in the first place. What are you after? Brighter sound and a slightly easier upper register (assuming you are only playing commercial type music)? Those would be about the only good reason to change.
Best wishes,
John Mohan
Skype Lessons Available - Click on the e-mail button below if interested _________________ Trumpet Player, Clinician & Teacher
1st Trpt for Cats, Phantom of the Opera, West Side Story, Evita, Hunchback of Notre Dame,
Grease, The Producers, Addams Family, In the Heights, etc.
Ex LA Studio Musician
16 Year Claude Gordon Student |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Billy B Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 6130 Location: Des Moines
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
John Mohan wrote: | Billy B wrote: | The 1C is an extreme mouthpiece and by playing on it you have probably acquired some bad habits. Get a Bach 3C and learn to play it. |
Yes, after all, look at the bad habits players such as Adolph Herseth, Frank Kaderabek and Uan Racey developed by playing on 1C (or bigger) mouthpieces...
Seriously, Billy's suggestion to move to something less dramatically different, such as a Bach 3C, is a good one. That is, assuming there is any reason to switch in the first place. What are you after? Brighter sound and a slightly easier upper register (assuming you are only playing commercial type music)? Those would be about the only good reason to change.
Best wishes,
John Mohan
Skype Lessons Available - Click on the e-mail button below if interested |
I seriously doubt the OP is anywhere near Bud, Frank, or Uan. Undeveloped players have no business playing extreme mouthpieces. And seriously, don't be such a condescending ass. _________________ Bill Bergren |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BrightonY125 Regular Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2018 Posts: 20
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Well, some people decided to be an ass and didn't help at all. Thank you to those who actually gave a helpful response. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dstdenis Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 May 2013 Posts: 2123 Location: Atlanta GA
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The 20S isn't just shallower--it also has a much smaller inner diameter, which is probably the most significant thing you're dealing with. How big are your lips? _________________ Bb Yamaha Xeno 8335IIS
Cornet Getzen Custom 3850S
Flugelhorn Courtois 155R
Piccolo Stomvi |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BrightonY125 Regular Member
Joined: 11 Oct 2018 Posts: 20
|
Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
dstdenis wrote: | The 20S isn't just shallower--it also has a much smaller inner diameter, which is probably the most significant thing you're dealing with. How big are your lips? |
I’m sorry, how is lip size measured? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
dstdenis Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 May 2013 Posts: 2123 Location: Atlanta GA
|
Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 5:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
Here's an article from Phyllis Stork about lip size and mouthpiece selection:
https://storkcustom.com/how-your-lips-dictate-your-mouthpiece-choice/
She helped me choose a mouthpiece several years ago, and her advice was spot-on for me. _________________ Bb Yamaha Xeno 8335IIS
Cornet Getzen Custom 3850S
Flugelhorn Courtois 155R
Piccolo Stomvi |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Brad361 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 7080 Location: Houston, TX.
|
Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 8:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
BrightonY125 wrote: | Well, some people decided to be an ass and didn't help at all. Thank you to those who actually gave a helpful response. |
You started your thread with “......I know it’s stupid....”, I don’t think you should be surprised when you get responses that might confirm that.
Hey, no big deal, this is just an online forum, with a handful of very accomplished and knowledgeable people, and a lot who probably are not. You’re going to get responses that run the gamut, from helpful to sarcastic, it’s just a forum with a lot of opinions. And trumpet players tend to be pretty opinionated.
Brad _________________ When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval |
|
Back to top |
|
|
L.A.Benge New Member
Joined: 16 Nov 2018 Posts: 9
|
Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 1:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Useful link. Looking for my own receipt for a new mouth piece. Looks like I lean towards the meatier side. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
veery715 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 4313 Location: Ithaca NY
|
Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:37 pm Post subject: Re: From a medium deep to a shallow mouthpiece |
|
|
BrightonY125 wrote: | Hey guys, I know its stupid. I'm going from a Bach 1C to a shallow 20S Curry mouthpiece. I've been playing with medium mouthpieces only before, and I find that I can't get a consistent buzz on my new shallow mouthpiece. Please suggest any exercises so that can help me adapt from a medium mouthpiece to a shallow one. |
Can you tell us what you are trying to achieve? No one in their right mind calls a Bach 1C "medium". Do you have a teacher? I suspect not. Get a Bach 3C as recommended (they're easy to find and cheap used- I can sell you one) and spend some money on a good teacher. _________________ veery715
Hear me sing!: https://youtu.be/vtJ14MV64WY
Playing trumpet - the healthy way to blow your brains out. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Bflatman Heavyweight Member
Joined: 01 Nov 2016 Posts: 720
|
Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 12:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Its not stupid at all, there are many reasons for changing a mouthpiece, in my view the most important reason is tone manipulation, ease of playing comfort and articulation follow.
I second the advice to use a middle of the road transitional piece to help the change go smoothly.
If I could offer any advice it is to not approach this with any expectations, it can be easy to be hung up on the differences in feel on the lips which can be slightly disconcerting at first.
You may see a slight ease of reaching the upper register but dont try to hit the high notes at first simply play and explore. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Ed Kennedy Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2005 Posts: 3187
|
Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 2:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The late great Leon Merian played a 1C for combo and general playing and a Jettone T2B for big band solo and lead. Patrick makes a modern equivlent: BMT. This is a large diameter but very comfortable,medium shallow piece.
http://patrickmouthpieces.com/store/#!/BMT/p/13885757/category=3241027 |
|
Back to top |
|
|
deleted_user_680e93b New Member
Joined: 03 Apr 1996 Posts: 0
|
Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: From a medium deep to a shallow mouthpiece |
|
|
BrightonY125 wrote: | Hey guys, I know its stupid. I'm going from a Bach 1C to a shallow 20S Curry mouthpiece. I've been playing with medium mouthpieces only before, and I find that I can't get a consistent buzz on my new shallow mouthpiece. Please suggest any exercises so that can help me adapt from a medium mouthpiece to a shallow one. |
try going from a Bach 1C to a curry 80S or 70S, something that is closer diameter wise than the 20S, thats like jumping from the grand canyon into a water glass, keep your diameter closer to what your used to and change the cup depth or backbore or drill size and i think you will have better results.
good luck
tom |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|