Sound stops and starts!

[kehaulani]

This is a continuation of an earlier thread which pertains to coming back after a couple of strokes. I have a problem and I would like the responses to pertain specifically to that and not broader. That was covered in the previous thread. Thank you.

The problem is that I am not able to sustain a buzz throughout a phrase. For example, when I play consecutive notes, they don't all come out, like a phrase with four eighth-notes might have some notes just air, the others as expected.

I know that for a good legato, instead of thinking and playing four stop-start-stop-start notes, you should rather think of playing one half note that is merely interrupted by the tongue, with the air continuing throughout.

Yet, I get a choppy phrase with some notes simply not sounding. I am using a soft, not explosive tongue and, to the best of my knowledge, with the air continuing, not stopping and starting. It seems like the sound/buzz just momentarily stops.

Does anyone have any suggestions beyond just continuing to work on, first, long tones then a long tone broken apart in parts with gentle tonguing? Or should I just keep doing what I'm doing and giving it more time? Thanks.
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"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

[gchun01]

Some clarification, please.

Are you saying this in regards to JUST buzzing on the mouthpiece? Or when you play the horn, the tone stops?

If the tone doesn't stop on the horn, but it stops on just the mpc, I wouldn't be overly concerned. Some people just don't have a buzz on the mouthpiece, but everything works okay when done on the horn. This is especially true as you move up the horn's range.

In my one year layoff, I have problems with my mpc buzz stopping after a while, but everything is fine on the horn. If I try to restart the mpc buzzing, I find myself pressing and introducing excessive tension.

So I basically don't worry about it. I'll check it in a few weeks after some of muscle coordination comes back, then re-evaluate.

Good Luck,
Garry

PS. check your pm.

[dstdenis]

What you've described doesn't sound unusual to me. For me, it's a normal part of trumpet playing maintenance to work on embouchure response so it doesn't stop buzzing as one plays through a phrase. Maybe you're just experiencing less responsiveness than you're used to?

Here's an exercise approach I use often that helps me improve responsiveness: just play any normal exercise (e.g., Clarke Technical #2, Arban p. 21 #47, etc) and I play it three times: first time, slurred; second time, staccato tongued; third time, legato tongued.

For me, this gets progressively more difficult. The slurred version is easy. The staccato tongued is pretty easy too, but I have to work on getting a clear, consistent articulation in tempo. The legato articulation is much, much more difficult, and that's the one where the buzz sometimes falters.

If you have the Franquin Method, this was a major topic with him too. His method has lots of exercises on "detached slurring" that are designed to work on this specific skill. You're not alone in identifying a need to work on this stuff.
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[mark61]

I do the same thing. Frustrating . Sounds like a good practice regime for me too.
Thanks
mark

[JVL]

hello
does it happen mostly in the same areas, where you'd have breaks in your tessiture, or in the "snake pit" Bobby Shew talks about ?

or your tissue that lost a bit of vibration ?

[pepperdean]

Sorry to hear the challenges you're dealing with.

I'm a little unclear. Does this happen when you're slurring or only when you're playing varied articulations? Does this occur in a particular register? Does changing dynamics create a different result?

As someone who has come back from nerve damage caused by shingles, I firmly believe that repeating a demand will eventually cause a 'reflex' response from the muscles. I feel this was the basis of the work I got from Carmine Caruso many years ago. The key, of course, is applying the right demand.

Without further information or observing it happen, i"m guessing you are not consistently keeping the lips together in a relaxed fashion. I might suggest one or both of the following:

1. Long, low F# at ppp. Throughout your practice sessions, sustain a low F# at a volume level where it threatens to stop speaking, as long as possible.

2. Carmine's tongue brushing exercise. Carmine said, 'Think of the tongue as a valve releasing the air to push through the lips.'

It's a busy season for us all but, if you think it might help, we could get together and I could take a look. I'm out here in JC but I get to town frequently.

Alan

[B. Scriver]

I have seen this many times when players come to see me for a moutpiece consultation. What has worked for me and all of those that I have seen is to make sure you "FEEL" the wind passing the lips. Actually feel the moving wind passing over or through your lips. Yes, this may be more of a visualization thing, but if you FEEL the wind, then the air keeps moving and problem solved.

Either that or you could be dealing with a rim contour / alpha angle issue.

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com

[mark61]

I think mine is more when I'm not warmed up, but, majority is after getting up
Around high C (just above the staff) for a bit then trying to play again on the staff. I just shut off at times.
Been trying to practice soft with good air support but not tensed or constricted.
I think I get a little pinch or swelling, messes with my air flow.

Tried to play lead , then next song is a solo . Very insecure feeling.

Mark

[mark61]

Can't believe I'm the only one that pinches or swells a bit. Others compensate some how.

Thanks
Mark

[oldenick]

I would tackle this issue from the perspective of aperture control.

Take Schlossberg Long Note Drills No. 2 and No. 6. Play the crescendo decrescendo while focusing on the flex of the aperture. Don't worry about anything else visualize and feel the aperture through the exercise.

The aperture starts open flexes for the crescendo and returns to open, don't get so soft that the note cuts out. Getting this smooth and even helps eliminate airballs.

I have had this issue off and on in my playing. Doing these exercises this way has helped me.

Good Luck
Nick
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[kehaulani]

@gchun. Mahalo, Gary. It happens when I play the horn. When I free buzz or buzz with the mouthpiece, the sound is consistent.

@dstdenis. That's my approach, in essence, but I fail at the very first point. For example, when playing something as basic as Cicowitcz' Long Tone Studies, when I change pitches, there is an involuntary break in the sound. Also, I do have the Franquin Method, so maybe I'll take a look at those exercises. Offhand, do you know what they might be?

@JVL and Alan.I don't notice an effect by trssitura. It happens when I'm slurring but most noticeable if I tongue. If tongueing eight notes (i.e.) complete notes may not sound. If slurring there might be a break between tones but not so noticeable.

@Alan, that's a great offer, thanks. I'm no longer in Austin, but now in Georgetown. Might move back to Austin or even Hawai'i, so am in flux. I'll let you know if things settle down. Thanks, again.


Thanks, Brian, I'll check on that sensivity. BTW, an experienced forum member hs sent me a mouthpiece that may help. He's basing his choice of mpc on my needs and his experience. To date, the mouthpiece is more comfortable than most I've played and feels larger, although I'm wondering (he won't say yet, LOL) if that's because of, not the cup diameter but how it's constructed.

@Nick. I alreadyuse those Schlossberg drill.

Thanks to everyone.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

[Andy Del]

[kehaulani]

Just to clarify, I am not concentrating on the buzz. I mention it, though, because it is the initial source of the sound source. No buzz, no sound.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

[onlyson]

Have had the same issue from time to time. Here are the things that have helped me the most. Practice everyday and do the fundamentals. My routine lately: Stamp long tones, flexibility and articulation exercises. Takes less than 10 minutes.

Remember the "poo" attack as described by Chris Martin. You don't want to cut off the blood flow to your chops and this definitely helps to keep your chops focused. And your sound will likely improve as a side benefit.

Try a bigger mouthpiece. Smaller diameters seem to require lots of practice and maintenance drills to stay on top of (for me). More room for error.. I mean vibrations!

Good luck!
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[dstdenis]

[kehaulani]

Thanks, dstdenis!
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

[pepperdean]

You say, "no buzz, no sound". That prompts me to ask if you've tried a gentle airflow through the mouthpiece and walking it into just the leadpipe to start the air column vibrating? If not, I'd work on leadpipe long tones and glisses with this tyoe of start.

Alan

[Al Innella]

Sorry to hear about your stroke. I am having the same trouble playing, not from a stroke, but because of dental problems. What helped me was change of rim contour,not size or alpha angle. It took a lot of experimentation, I tried rounder ,flatter,thinner,thicker, until i found a rim that worked for me.

I hate to blame equipment,so I tried long tones,slurs etc....nothing really worked foe me until I tried rim shapes.As our bodies change, there is no reason why our mouthpieces shouldn't.

Hope things get better,

Al

[Craig Swartz]

[kehaulani]

Thanks, Craig.

p.s. in a wheelchair so the bucket of water thing is unmanageable. Thanks for the thought, though.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn