• FAQ  • Search  • Memberlist  • Usergroups   • Register   • Profile  • Log in to check your private messages  • Log in 

Best method book for range development?


Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> High Range Development
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
spencerkotulski
Regular Member


Joined: 02 Dec 2018
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:37 am    Post subject: Best method book for range development? Reply with quote

What are some opinions on what the best method book is for range development?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
LSOfanboy
Veteran Member


Joined: 08 Jul 2018
Posts: 347

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:57 am    Post subject: Re: Best method book for range development? Reply with quote

spencerkotulski wrote:
What are some opinions on what the best method book is for range development?


Not to be 'that guy' but the best option is a private teacher who can explain the concepts of range development to you.

Ultimately, method books are just a collection of notes in a particular order. Simply playing through them in the same manner you already play is unlikely to make much significant difference. You may start to feel a bit more comfortable on the exercises due to familiarity and low level adaption, but beyond maybe an unreliable tone or two increase you will not solve your range problems this way.

I wish someone had given me that advice when I was a teenager. I always had good teachers (and an expensive musical education) but still held this deep rooted belief that if 'I practice Maggio or Stamp or Irons or Schlossberg or Colins' I would suddenly unlock the secrets to high register playing. It never did. Only when I went to a teacher who was a bit of a range specialist (my teachers up to that point had been fantastic orchestral section players, but no one with interest in range that went anywhere much beyond a high D) did I sort out my issues and increase my daily range by about a fifth and my professionally usable range by more like an octave.

All the best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cheiden
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 8910
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I don't consider it a range extension method, the Vizzutti books helped me to get much more comfortable with the range I had.

My impression from my lessons would be that the book by James Stamp and likely the book by Earl Irons are the most useful for extending range.
_________________
"I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
trpt.hick
Rafael Méndez Forum Moderator


Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Posts: 2630

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My BEYOND THE C book contains over a dozen sets of exercises to increase the upper register.

David Hickman
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Pete
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Nov 2001
Posts: 1739
Location: Western Massachusetts

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-Am03K7QDI

Pete
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
timothyquinlan
Veteran Member


Joined: 07 Jun 2007
Posts: 267
Location: Victoria, BC

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are so many great ones. I say you read through bits and pieces of samples and choose one that speaks to you.

My favourites are:

Eby Scientific Method for Trumpet

Peters Total Range

Knevitt 21st Century Range and Endurance on Trumpet

Deutsch Extended Trumpet Range

That should get you going for a while!
_________________
Check out qPress for the largest selection of trumpet books on the internet.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
cbclead
Veteran Member


Joined: 25 Jun 2009
Posts: 144
Location: Louisiana

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Bobby Shew video posted above is great. Another video I always recommend is this one with Wayne Bergeron talking about air pressure. The audio is bad, but he has some good analogies/thoughts about how to approach the upper register.


Link


I also agree with what I've seen Wayne say in several videos - you have to "discover" range. There aren't any specific exercises that will build range. You have to experiment and try different things. Also, this Hip-BoneU video on Vimeo is good, but it's not free (although close).

https://vimeo.com/ondemand/playinghighnotes
_________________
Yamaha 8310Z
Stomvi Maurice Andre C
Kanstul 1025 Bb Flugel
Kanstul 920 Bb/A Piccolo Trumpet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
John Mohan
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 13 Nov 2001
Posts: 9828
Location: Chicago, Illinois

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Best method book for range development? Reply with quote

LSOfanboy wrote:
spencerkotulski wrote:
What are some opinions on what the best method book is for range development?


Not to be 'that guy' but the best option is a private teacher who can explain the concepts of range development to you.

Ultimately, method books are just a collection of notes in a particular order. Simply playing through them in the same manner you already play is unlikely to make much significant difference.


That is the case with many of the older method books to a certain extent (Arbans, St-Jacome, Gatti, etc.). A lot of them have great exercises, but virtually no instructions, or worse, instructions that are not really good. But that is not the case with some of the newer ones, and especially not the case when it comes to Claude Gordon's Systematic Approach to Daily Practice for Trumpet. Systematic Approach contains 52 specific Lessons with each Lesson assigning both material within the book, and material from six other trumpet books (Arbans, St-Jacome, Clarke's Technical Studies, Clarke's Characteristic Studies, Colin's Lip Flexibilities, and Smith's Lip Flexibilities).

There are also ten pages of explanation at the beginning of the book concerning how to practice properly, and specific instructions in each Lesson explaining how to practice the material in the book and the assigned outside material.

I bought and used Systematic Approach when I was 16 years old and added 2 steps to my range within a few weeks of starting to use it. About a year later I was blessed with the opportunity to travel to Los Angeles to take a "Crash Course" (2 lessons a day for a week) with Claude Gordon. On my eighteenth birthday I reached a Double High C# in the range portion of my practice routine. And then as soon as I could afford to, I moved to L.A. and studied with Claude full time - that studying led to a wonderful career.

I will not argue at all with LSOfanboy's suggestion to get a teacher - just be sure it is a teacher who knows how to really develop range, and everything else required to be a great trumpet player!

Best wishes,

John Mohan
Skype Lessons Available - Click on the e-mail button below if interested
_________________
Trumpet Player, Clinician & Teacher
1st Trpt for Cats, Phantom of the Opera, West Side Story, Evita, Hunchback of Notre Dame,
Grease, The Producers, Addams Family, In the Heights, etc.
Ex LA Studio Musician
16 Year Claude Gordon Student
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
HERMOKIWI
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Dec 2008
Posts: 2578

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Best method book for range development? Reply with quote

LSOfanboy wrote:
spencerkotulski wrote:
What are some opinions on what the best method book is for range development?


Not to be 'that guy' but the best option is a private teacher who can explain the concepts of range development to you.

Ultimately, method books are just a collection of notes in a particular order. Simply playing through them in the same manner you already play is unlikely to make much significant difference. You may start to feel a bit more comfortable on the exercises due to familiarity and low level adaption, but beyond maybe an unreliable tone or two increase you will not solve your range problems this way.

I wish someone had given me that advice when I was a teenager. I always had good teachers (and an expensive musical education) but still held this deep rooted belief that if 'I practice Maggio or Stamp or Irons or Schlossberg or Colins' I would suddenly unlock the secrets to high register playing. It never did. Only when I went to a teacher who was a bit of a range specialist (my teachers up to that point had been fantastic orchestral section players, but no one with interest in range that went anywhere much beyond a high D) did I sort out my issues and increase my daily range by about a fifth and my professionally usable range by more like an octave.

All the best


I'm in agreement with LSOfanboy. All the practicing and method books in the world aren't going to get you to where you want to be without the proper foundational technique for production of notes in the high register. If you can find a teacher who will teach you high range technique and help you refine that technique you will be most of the way toward your goal of increasing your real usable range. Trying to increase your range without the proper technique will give you only limited results.
_________________
HERMOKIWI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JVL
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Feb 2016
Posts: 892
Location: Nissa, France

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spencer,
all your posts turn around the same topic, and then all the replies give you the same answers.
If you really want to improve, and it seems you really want it, have lessons with a master. Are you living in NM like i seem to remember? if so, contact Bobby Shew, you'll thank yourself !
best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Trompetissimo
New Member


Joined: 20 Jul 2014
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For me, most of the listes books has supported the development of range.
Flexibility and Clarke Technical Studies has been the methodology I have used the most.

2 advices:

1. Practice soft (my/p dynamics) to develop a relaxed buzz also in the high register - do not force.
By practicing high register in a soft way, you will also develop a good/nice/full sound which will support you also when playing loud.

2. Balance your high range practice with excercises AND music.
Many trumpet players believe that if they only practice high range with excercises, the range will also be there when playing music, this is not correct. In many cases trumpet players can achieve great things when playing excercises, but they are not able to utilize this when it comes to playing the actual music....

Good luck!
_________________
Trompetissimo
Bb Bach Stradivarius/Malone converted
C Bach Stradivarius/Malone converted
Trp.mouthpiece, GR 67L
Bb Cornet Yamaha
Cornet mouthpiece, Dennis Wick 4B
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
spencerkotulski
Regular Member


Joined: 02 Dec 2018
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JVL wrote:
Spencer,
all your posts turn around the same topic, and then all the replies give you the same answers.
If you really want to improve, and it seems you really want it, have lessons with a master. Are you living in NM like i seem to remember? if so, contact Bobby Shew, you'll thank yourself !
best


I live in Minneapolis area in Minnesota. I do have a private lesson teacher but I feel I need a different one. The one I have is good but when it comes to the mechanics of playing they don’t really tend to teach that, but mechanics is how I tend to learn. John Mohan seems to really believe in the Claude Gordon books and I would love to try this approach, but I don’t really know who in my area teaches this’s method.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JVL
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 07 Feb 2016
Posts: 892
Location: Nissa, France

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ask John Mohan who teaches Gordon's approach in your area if you want to try this approach that is a good one for all aspects of playing, or have skype lessons with John.
Check also Bobby Shew's schedule, he does a lot of clinics in the USA, and also teaches online.
If we except the pedal practice and other concepts, i don't really see some contre-indication to try both approaches.
I practiced Claude Gordon's "Systematic approach to daily practice" during my first years of pro career, and met just after Bobby, then went to study with him in Los Angeles; so i can tell you that you can benefit of both in spite of the different, not to say divergent, conceptions.
best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JayKosta
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3274
Location: Endwell NY USA

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spencerkotulski wrote:

... I do have a private lesson teacher but I feel I need a different one. The one I have is good but when it comes to the mechanics of playing they don’t really tend to teach that, but mechanics is how I tend to learn. ...

-----------------------------------------------
It seems you need to specifically ASK your current teacher to evaluate your 'mechanics', and especially ask the teacher if there is anything about your mechanics that is currently slowing your progress, or might in the future. And if YOU think some of your mechanics need improvement, ask about that.

A good teacher should ALWAYS be watching and evaluating your mechanics, but if everything seems fine, then there is no need to discuss them or suggest changes. Also a good teacher should be watching for the things that need immediate attention, explain the problem to you, and offer suggestions. Of course there might be several things that need attention, and a good teacher knows how to prioritize the changes regarding what is most important, and what YOU can realistically be expected to do. A good 'foundation' needs to be built first, and then step-wise improvements.

It is also up to you to ask the teacher about these things, and to tell the teacher your goals and your dedication to WORKING to accomplish them. Try telling your teacher that you want to EXCEL in the performance of your lesson assignments, and have the teacher critique your performance of the lessons regarding that goal.

Jay
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Nlblkely
New Member


Joined: 10 Jan 2019
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rod Haney
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 22 Aug 2015
Posts: 937

PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I get a lot from Colin once I learned to do it right. Not a method but a good set of exercises if done with a correct aperture
Rod
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
GreatRambino
New Member


Joined: 23 Jan 2019
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These tips have been helpful. Thanks!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NickF
New Member


Joined: 27 Jul 2022
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:28 am    Post subject: Re: Best method book for range development? Reply with quote

LSOfanboy wrote:
spencerkotulski wrote:
What are some opinions on what the best method book is for range development?


Not to be 'that guy' but the best option is a private teacher who can explain the concepts of range development to you.

Ultimately, method books are just a collection of notes in a particular order. Simply playing through them in the same manner you already play is unlikely to make much significant difference. You may start to feel a bit more comfortable on the exercises due to familiarity and low level adaption, but beyond maybe an unreliable tone or two increase you will not solve your range problems this way.

I wish someone had given me that advice when I was a teenager. I always had good teachers (and an expensive musical education) but still held this deep rooted belief that if 'I practice Maggio or Stamp or Irons or Schlossberg or Colins' I would suddenly unlock the secrets to high register playing. It never did. Only when I went to a teacher who was a bit of a range specialist (my teachers up to that point had been fantastic orchestral section players, but no one with interest in range that went anywhere much beyond a high D) did I sort out my issues and increase my daily range by about a fifth and my professionally usable range by more like an octave.

All the best


Books and manuals are useful in learning. But they cannot replace classical education. Although they are certainly necessary. At school I had good teachers who gave an excellent classical education. Knowledge of iteration and music helped me to enter the theater college. Thanks to the great maze runner essay that I found using https://paperap.com/free-papers/the-maze-runner/ and good knowledge of music, I was able to make my video essay for college admission, where I combined music that I myself wrote and a video version of a literary work. Without books and study guides, I would not have the necessary knowledge, but I also used more modern learning resources and they are also useful.


Last edited by NickF on Fri Nov 25, 2022 7:59 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Shaft
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 19 Sep 2006
Posts: 974

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pops explains many mechanics at bbtrumpet.com and teaches lessons.
Roddy-O in UK had some books that helped me with this too.
Jim Manley is available for Zoom lessons and that filled in things I wish I knew 20 years ago.

There are countless professors, playing pros, and methods.

Its all out there man. Dig in!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
BRM2
Regular Member


Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 73
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2022 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a very good question. I can clearly remember when I had a few "aha" moments.

1998: "Double High C in 37 Weeks" Spaulding
This was 2 years after high school while in the Army Band. I never really worked on range before this. It introduced me to the idea of "Compression." At the time I was playing a bored out Bach 1 Megatone and I thrusted my jaw forward to create compression (lip to lip) for the higher notes. I thought about this as I practiced the exercises from the book. I think this method introduced me to "Anchor Tonguing." I can't remember. I went from a high "C" player to like a high "F#". I was able to struggle through struggle through some Salsa gigs. I do not thrust my jaw forward now for compression though.

2001 "Maggio Method" Carlton McBeth
This book introduced me to syllable to use when playing. I may have puckered a bit when I used the method. The exercises then re-enforced the use of the syllables in the different registers and improved my accuracy tremendously. The introduction of the "ICH" syllable (more of a hissing sound to me) was a game changer past high "C".

2001 Lead Book for Big Band
All of the real lead players had already left the band and all I could do was practice the lead book every day in order to figure it out. I was in Japan at the time and the language barrier prevented lessons at the time. Playing the parts up there got me more comfortable.

2002 "Air on the Move" Clint "Pops"McLaughlin
This book reiterated the use of syllables and introduced me to more of a "hissing"sound for higher notes. The key point I got from the book was the use of less air for higher notes. At some point in time in the book he mentioned to try to play a high "G" by taking in half of the breath you would normally take. He also talked about pulling abdomen in to create compression as well. When I eventually tried it, the high "G"came out way easier. I even talked a trombone player into trying it and she had the same results. I also worked on soft playing as well.

From 2001 to 2002, I felt more comfortable playing lead charts with lots of preparation. I felt way more confident in terms of using the range that I had. I only ever needed to play to a high "F#" but I had practice room noted up double high "C". I was playing on Medium shallow equipment at the time like a Curry 1M and GR 67M.

These particular books were the key things that influenced my improvement in improving my range. I had just about all of the traditional trumpet method books and range building books (Sold most of them on TrumpetHerald. These books gave me a game plan on what to think about and do when practicing exercises and playing music. I am currently playing on a Marcinkiweicz E.13 C.Findley for everything and can play things like Brian Setzer's "Let it Snow."

I still don't consider myself a Lead Player despite my range. I still struggle with endurance. I am not saying that I have no endurance. I just don't have the endurance of those Lead Players that can go all night. I have to carefully pace myself and "mf" the S#!T of the music to make it through gigs.

Improving my range definitely helped me become a more versatile player and opened many doors for me. I still have a lot to learn and continue to work on it. This time around, I will not be ordering a ton of books to figure it out. I am now in a position where I can get regular lessons and have some body monitor my playing. I wish I would have spent less money on books and more on lessons with good teachers.
_________________
BRM
Van Laar Chuck Findley(silver)
CarolBrass 5000L YST
Marcinkiewicz E13 C. FINDLEY
Lotus 2M (Bronze)
GR 67MS
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> High Range Development All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group