• FAQ  • Search  • Memberlist  • Usergroups   • Register   • Profile  • Log in to check your private messages  • Log in 

Neck pain after car accident


Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Fundamentals
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
jadickson
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Jun 2006
Posts: 1294
Location: Raleigh, NC

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:11 pm    Post subject: Neck pain after car accident Reply with quote

Neck pain after a car accident... help please

About 13 years ago I was in a pretty rough car accident. Fortunately, my father was a chiropractor, so I received immediate care. But still, my neck was injured pretty badly.

Since getting involved in a new church, I have done a lot more trumpet playing lately. Really pushing it as far as range and technique, playing harder stuff than I have ever played before. It’s been a great challenge, but it’s aggravating the injury. Like my neck still hurts from doing the two Christmas Eve services 20 days ago.

I’m wondering if anyone has dealt with this. At this point I’m open to any advice. Technique, equipment changes, I don’t know. I’m playing on a Bach Strad, 3C type mouthpieces.

When I play low brass instruments, I don’t feel a thing in my neck. I guess due to the lower resistance. That makes me think I could possibly make an equipment change and alleviate at least some of the pain? As a school band director I have access to any instrument I want to try, and I can play euphonium and not feel a thing. Someone might say, why not switch to euphonium? Well I thought about it, but I’ve given over 25 years of my life to the trumpet and I’d rather not give it up unless absolutely have to.

All I know is I can’t keep aggravating this injury, it’s getting worse and I can’t keep doing that or I’m going to cause really serious permanent damage.

Unfortunately, my father passed a few years ago (cancer sucks) so I cannot go to him. I’m hoping someone out there is been through this and can guide me. Thank you.
_________________
Justin Dickson
Middle school band director. Still learning.
www.BandmateTuner.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Richard III
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 22 May 2007
Posts: 2611
Location: Anacortes, WA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you doing general conditioning and strength building as part of a regular routine? If not, you need to start.
_________________
Richard

Conn 22B Trumpet
York Eminence Model 4028 Cornet
1903 Conn The Wonder Cornet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
jadickson
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Jun 2006
Posts: 1294
Location: Raleigh, NC

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richard III wrote:
Are you doing general conditioning and strength building as part of a regular routine? If not, you need to start.


Specifically what do you mean? Lifting free weights?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
JayKosta
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3275
Location: Endwell NY USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Neck pain after car accident Reply with quote

jadickson wrote:

...but it’s aggravating the injury. Like my neck still hurts from doing the two Christmas Eve services 20 days ago. ...

-------------------------------------------------
That seems like a long time for a simple 'over use' injury - unless actual muscle strain happened, but I think that is unlikely.

I suggest seeing a neck/spine specialist. Perhaps a full set of 'imaging' is needed to diagnose the cause of the problem. And you might need to demonstrate the head and neck position you use when playing, and also how much neck muscle force
(edit: also shoulder, arm, back bend, etc.)
is needed to maintain the position.

Jay
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.


Last edited by JayKosta on Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dstdenis
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 25 May 2013
Posts: 2123
Location: Atlanta GA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would it be possible to dial back the intensity and difficulty of the trumpet arrangements used at the church? Even if re-aggravating an old neck injury weren't an issue, such a sudden jump in exertion could cause other problems, like blown chops, for example. Better to ramp up the intensity more gradually if possible.
_________________
Bb Yamaha Xeno 8335IIS
Cornet Getzen Custom 3850S
Flugelhorn Courtois 155R
Piccolo Stomvi
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Richard III
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 22 May 2007
Posts: 2611
Location: Anacortes, WA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jadickson wrote:
Richard III wrote:
Are you doing general conditioning and strength building as part of a regular routine? If not, you need to start.


Specifically what do you mean? Lifting free weights?


Balanced strength building to increase your body's ability to do all desired tasks. Without that, we all slowly get weaker and weaker. After injury a rehab regime should be followed, otherwise adaption to the injury occurs. I'm a retired chiropractor. Once that injury adaption occurs the body's responses are altered and the injury becomes chronic and long lasting.
_________________
Richard

Conn 22B Trumpet
York Eminence Model 4028 Cornet
1903 Conn The Wonder Cornet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
jadickson
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Jun 2006
Posts: 1294
Location: Raleigh, NC

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Richard. I will get started this week. The football coach at my middle school is a friend and he said he will guide me with some weight lifting.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Harry Hilgers
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 16 Jun 2015
Posts: 637

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:16 am    Post subject: Re: Neck pain after car accident Reply with quote

jadickson wrote:
Like my neck still hurts from doing the two Christmas Eve services 20 days ago............... I’m wondering if anyone has dealt with this.

Justin, I am dealing with neck issues that may not be the same as yours.

But then again, maybe they are, or at least related.

Disclaimer: I have ZERO medical knowledge. I am simply stating what I went, and still am, going though. In other words, I am just describing a set of events.

Now enough of the attorney stuff.

About 6 month ago I started developing left arm pains while holding up the trumpet.
I went to see a specialist who took neck X-rays.

Conclusion: Pinched nerves in the neck vertebrae, most likely caused by working "a thousand years" behind a desk and in general leading my life with bad posture.

Playing trumpet exaggerated the problem due to my always hunched forward neck position. Ditto when I ride my Harley; always hunched behind the windshield.

The fix:
1. I had to start walking/sitting with a straight shoulders/head posture. (This is somewhat hard to describe. So you will need to get professional help to find out what this means).
2. About (10) 30-minute visits with a Physical Therapist
3. After that was finished, the therapist assigned a set of daily do-it-yourself physical therapy exercises, that I do now (almost) everyday.

Conclusion: It is working, little by little, but it is working and I am progressively getting better.

Meanwhile I use a waist belt around my neck and left wrist to help hold-up the horn. Awkward, but no more arm pain.

I was told that if I keep up the straight posture/head and keep up the exercises, it will all eventually get corrected.

I have lived just over 3/4 of a century and today is the first day of the next 1/4.

I fully intend to make it to at least a full century. Why?
Someday I wanna be able to play the Carnival of Venice at speed.
Well, I guy can dream can't he

In addition, I do have a weights room to work out. Maybe your coach friend or some other physical fitness professional can help you with that.

As I said, my neck issues may not be the same. But then again the above may help.

Good luck with your challenge.

Cheers,
Harry
PS My issues where the same for trumpet, cornet and flugelhorn.


Last edited by Harry Hilgers on Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:25 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
cheiden
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 8910
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If other instruments don't aggravate then I'd focus on what's unique to the trumpet. I've met quite a few trumpet players who feel the need to hold the trumpet perpendicular to the floor or higher, often with elbows held high. I find this to be particularly unkind to my neck. If this is the case with you it might be a benefit to lower your horn angle and lower your elbows. I seriously doubt the trouble relates to blowing resistance.
_________________
"I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Richard III
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 22 May 2007
Posts: 2611
Location: Anacortes, WA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leverage is a factor for many with regards to strength. The further away from the body the more leverage the weight affects you. Short cornets are much less work. Just another reason cornet is king. At least in my house. But then I'm a cornetaholic.
_________________
Richard

Conn 22B Trumpet
York Eminence Model 4028 Cornet
1903 Conn The Wonder Cornet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Dr. Manhattan
Veteran Member


Joined: 23 Jul 2016
Posts: 102
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:18 am    Post subject: Neck pain after car accident Reply with quote

Hi Justin,
I had injuries to my lower and upper middle backs as well as my neck.
And they all hampered my trumpet playing. I am sure our injuries are different but what they do have in common is they affect trumpet playing and vice versa.

I ended up going to a physical therapist (Doctor referral after MRI).
The Therapist helped me with specific stretches and exercises done in perfect form as well as some core strengthening exercises. Within a few weeks I started feeling much better and practicing trumpet became less painful (for my back/neck) as well as less frustrating. My trumpet teacher also played a vital role in that he had me work on playing without stress or tensing up and to think of a beautiful sound.

Before starting any weight workout, I would consult your doctor and a Physical Therapist.

Hope this helps!
_________________
Several Trumpets and Flugelhorns!
Trying to thin the small herd!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Harry Hilgers
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 16 Jun 2015
Posts: 637

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:38 am    Post subject: Re: Neck pain after car accident Reply with quote

Quote:
Before starting any weight workout, I would consult your doctor and a Physical Therapist.
+1

I ended up going to a physical therapist after doctor referral based on findings from the neck X-rays.

To add, my problems were the same for any instrument including cornet, fluglehorn, Baritone and Tenor horn.

Hope this helps.

Good luck with it all, Justin.

Cheers,
Harry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dershem
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Jun 2007
Posts: 1884
Location: San Diego, CA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The great Gary Pack had to sop playing after a couple of car wrecks. Please get it looked at by an expert - perhaps a sports medicine doctor. If it gives pain days after, there is still damage and aggravating it can make it permanent.
_________________
BKA! Mic Gillette was my mentor and friend.
Marcinkiewicz Mic G. trumpet, Custom Marcinkiewicz mpc. (Among others)
Marcinkiewicz Rembrandt flugel, Benge 8Z cornet, King 2B, Bach 36, Benge 190, Getzen 3062... many more. All Marc. mouthpieces.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Andy Del
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Posts: 2660
Location: sunny Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pain from playing over 20 days ago? And you ask a bunch of trumpet players how to treat this? Really?

I would go talk to someone who knows about the thing which is hurting, namely you body. A doctor would be good. I suggest you do it now, not tomorrow.

cheers

Andy
_________________
so many horns, so few good notes...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
chuck in ny
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 23 Sep 2006
Posts: 3597
Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

having a neck injury is a large subject because there's a lot of stuff packed into a small area and it's all critically important.
since you have to abuse yourself with trumpet playing to get a flare up whatever you have wrong is probably not that bad. when you have bad business anywhere along the spine the issue dominates your existence.
the little bit of experience i've had with physical therapists has been extremely helpful and positive. these people are unlike the others in the health system. they usually have strong healing energy and an exact idea of procedure.
diagnosis first and referral. go to the hospital in your area where the rich people go for their work as they don't tolerate incompetents. insofar as the death factories you have avoided pretend they don't exist.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Vin DiBona
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 24 Dec 2003
Posts: 1473
Location: OHare area

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, Andy for speaking logic. A qualifed doctor is who needs to be involved, not trumpet players.
R. Tomasek
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Jabroni
Veteran Member


Joined: 25 May 2015
Posts: 145

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 3:54 pm    Post subject: WHY? Reply with quote

You should be consulting a medical professional. Anyone who gives you advise here is not qualified to be giving any medical information. If you dont have health insurance then try going to a free clinic.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Crazy Finn
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 27 Dec 2001
Posts: 8331
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andy Del wrote:
Pain from playing over 20 days ago? And you ask a bunch of trumpet players how to treat this? Really?

I would go talk to someone who knows about the thing which is hurting, namely you body. A doctor would be good. I suggest you do it now, not tomorrow.

cheers

Andy

This.

I'm not evening going to comment with my opinions on Chiropractic treatment in general, but seeing an actual medical doctor with these issues should have been the initial answer initially 13 years ago (hopefully it was, then) and it definitely is the answer now.
_________________
LA Benge 3X Bb Trumpet
Selmer Radial Bb Trumpet
Yamaha 6335S Bb Trumpet
Besson 709 Bb Trumpet
Bach 184L Bb Cornet
Yamaha 731 Bb Flugelhorn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rothman
Veteran Member


Joined: 23 Jan 2014
Posts: 326

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 4:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Neck pain after car accident Reply with quote

jadickson wrote:
... It’s been a great challenge, but it’s aggravating the injury. Like my neck still hurts from doing the two Christmas Eve services 20 days ago.

I’m wondering if anyone has dealt with this. At this point I’m open to any advice.


Personally speaking, I've come to view avoiding neck pain as something of an art. Chiropractics were not a long term solution, nor orthopedics, nor excessive isometrics. Otoh, an orthopedic physician once illustrated on paper as you reach your forties, a joint in the neck that is inflamed, can allow slight fluid out, causing several days of much worse pain than normal. Without x-rays, that was his 'guesstimate' which I found informative.

Well versed with stiff necks in the morning, another thing was dealing with a sudden 'wrench' or crimped area after waking. A lot of them subsided when a move was made toward a thin 'homemade' pillow. Had way too many issues with the garden variety stuff.

Horn practice, is a problem. You might try an office chair, where the back extends up behind the neck, so you can keep the problem area unstressed, while playing...so inflamation can go down. How long that takes, is not a set thing. You have to come up with flexibility exercises without isometric, where you rotate the neck area in repetitions, gradually working stiffness out - from where it's concentrated.

Once things improve, you need to keep to a program implemented each week. Otherwise, it will return.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Matthew Anklan
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 1085
Location: Cincinnati

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin,

Is your posture, especially neck position, different when playing trumpet vs. euphonium? Many of us tend to lower our heads to the trumpet rather than keep our head aligned over our bodies and bring the trumpet up to it. I look forward to hearing back!

Best,
M
_________________
Matthew Anklan
www.matthewanklan.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    trumpetherald.com Forum Index -> Fundamentals All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group