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Changing Leadpipe to Improve Intonation?



 
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John Ford
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Joined: 06 Aug 2017
Posts: 4
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:24 pm    Post subject: Changing Leadpipe to Improve Intonation? Reply with quote

Hi everyone,

I'm having a problem with my horn, and I was hoping you guys might have some advice for me. Sorry if this has come up before, but I haven't quite got the hang of this site's search function yet.

Basically, I do most of my playing on my Bach Strad (it's a standard model 72). I love this horn, but the one problem I'm having with it is that several notes are way out of tune and/or refuse to slot. This mostly happens on G, G#, and A above the staff, as well as most notes above High F. I don't seem to have this problem on most other horns I've tried, and I have been asking my trumpet professor for advice and practicing everything he gives me.

What I was wondering is this: I have heard several people swear that certain Bach bells have better intonation with certain leadpipes, so would it be possible that swapping out the leadpipe for a different one might help matters?

Thanks, and sorry about the long winded question!
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LittleRusty
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Joined: 11 Aug 2004
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Location: Santa Clara, Ca

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mouthpiece gap can also cause issues. I could not hit a D above the staff while the notes directly above and below were there. Mike Thompson assisted me with a sleeved mouthpiece and helped me dial in the gap.
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John Ford
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Joined: 06 Aug 2017
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Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LittleRusty wrote:
Mouthpiece gap can also cause issues.


Thanks for the advice!
A few years ago I actually played a Reeves mouthpeice that was cut for sleeves, and I didn't notice that changing the gap made those issues much better or worse. Of course, I have also improved a lot since then since then, so it might be worth trying the sleeve thing again. It's possible that I just wasn't good enough to notice the difference
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LittleRusty
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Joined: 11 Aug 2004
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Location: Santa Clara, Ca

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

John Ford wrote:
LittleRusty wrote:
Mouthpiece gap can also cause issues.


Thanks for the advice!
A few years ago I actually played a Reeves mouthpeice that was cut for sleeves, and I didn't notice that changing the gap made those issues much better or worse. Of course, I have also improved a lot since then since then, so it might be worth trying the sleeve thing again. It's possible that I just wasn't good enough to notice the difference

Mike could hear the difference which he said was the partials being sharp or flat as we adjusted. I personally couldn’t hear it.
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zaferis
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Joined: 03 Nov 2011
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Location: Beavercreek, OH

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that the gap can affect this, but IMO the mouthpiece choice is the first place I'd look. Rim shape, cup shape, throat size and flair have more of an impact on some of these issues.

As a demonstration for my students I'll compare my Yamaha 14B4 with my Curry 3C.. not only for tone, articulation and the like, but where notes "slot". Top of the staff is a very noticeable area where the F, F#, & G slot a touch higher with the Yamaha vs. the Curry. (Gap is equal-I have checked.)

Finding the best "fit" for my C vs. my Bb trumpet, the choice is the same rim, cup but a more open throat on the C -> partically for tone, but more noticeably for slotting of the typically troublesome notes (upper register).

Recently, I've been experimenting with a couple Curry mouthpieces that I've had cut for sleeves. In tweeking the gap, I don't find a huge difference in slotting, definitley a change in "blow" or "feel".. And I'm still not 100% sure it's an improvement over Curry's stock mouthpiece - my ear is telling me there is a loss of something... but still testing.

And as far as changing the leadpipe, yes, this can improve intonation and playability but will also change the sound.. Blackburn, Malone, Osmun.... etc all have wonderful repacement pipes, but know that sound will change a tick too... maybe a good thing maybe not. You'll have to experirment if you choose this route.
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J-Walk
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Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 210
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have also found that gap changes not just feel and slotting, but pitch also. For me, I find that mouthpieces with more drop off in the upper cup (lower alpha angle) require more gap on all of my horns than mouthpieces with more upper cup support (higher alpha angle). The addage that everything effects everything is very true. Though leadpipe changes are an option, I believe gap adjustment is the logical first step. Much cheaper and more effective than most changes one can make to their setup IMO. It would also be worthwhile having the horn cleaned and checked over for interior solder obstruction, valve alignment, and leaks by a good technician.
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dfcoleman
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Joined: 26 Apr 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 6:59 am    Post subject: Melk for Bach Reply with quote

For modifications to Bach trumpets, Charlie Melk is terrific. He’s great with other brands, too.
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iiipopes
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Joined: 29 Jun 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with the above: if you must play a Bach 72, send it to Charlie Melk to have it sorted out. You will pay a substantial amount, and it is worth it and more.
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