Osmun blue printing service

James Becker · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:42 am Post subject:

As an update to my previous post, the discounting of an add on chem clean to a PVA or blueprinting is a recent practice, so it's entirely possible LittleRusty's service predates this and was charged full price for the cleaning. Should you anyone else have issues with your bill, please direct your questions to our shop manager Tim Cote at sales@osmun.com or phone him at 978-823-0580. Tim is in the office Tuesdays thru Saturdays.

And not to single anyone out, but I can't imagine visiting my dentist without thoroughly flossing and brushing before my appointment.

So if you haven't kept up with your routine maintenance, don't be surprised if we're going to insist on cleaning your instrument first before performing any other services.

I hope this is helpful.
_________________
James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com

Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US

LittleRusty · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 10:53 am Post subject:

James,

I am kind of sorry I shared my story.

For the record, I do keep my horns clean and, just like I floss and brush before going to the dentist, I cleaned the horn before shipping it. Perhaps it was still dirty, I cannot say. Truthfully neither can you this long since the engagement.

The take away for both of us is to exchange a full, clear estimate in writing before the service is engaged. The fault lies on both our parts.

I cannot imagine that I am the only one who might hesitate if one had to pay over $200, shipping and cleaning, before the work began.

trumpet_cop · Veteran Member Joined: 18 Jun 2013 Posts: 242

Can everyone seriously stop hating on Osmun Music and Jim? Seriously. Absolutely unacceptable.

I am beyond astounded that people here are just freely piling on the shite instead of thinking. That's fine. Let's just run more people off the forum.

I've had Jim Becker do work before. Was it expensive? Yes, it was more than I was hoping. Was it worth it? Yes. If you have issues, you should have taken it up with customer service at the time, if you have issues with pricing or shipping take it to your local tech who probably only services a large volume of school instruments and wont have the time to devote to your professional instrument. If you want top notch quality by one of the best in the business stop bitching and let the man do his job. He is not trying to screw anyone over.
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Good Ol' Boy ID#3624360

LittleRusty · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:11 pm Post subject:

veery715 · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 2:17 pm Post subject:

trumpet_cop · Veteran Member Joined: 18 Jun 2013 Posts: 242

LittleRusty · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:00 pm Post subject:

James, Tim, Osmun,

I apologize for bringing this up. My dissatisfaction was due to not understanding the possibility of needing a chem clean prior to shipping so I could weigh the cost benefit in advance. (It is possible I was told and forgot.)

You did receive the horn, evaluate and make recommendations after evaluating the horn as we agreed on.

I did agree to the chem clean since I understood it was not optional. (Ignoring why I thought and you thought)

You performed the work quickly and to my satisfaction.

I cannot blame you for the train derailment of the train carrying my horn back to me. (True, but meant to add humor)

I would and still do recommend your services.

It is just that $149 service is a rather big surprise and if others ship a horn to you for service and they too need a chem clean, it would probably be received better if they knew about the possibility in the initial negotiations. A written initial estimate, like a car shop generates, could also help avoid memories like mine.

Enough said. I hope this apology/explanation can resolve this brouhaha and the sub-topic will die.

sjtrumpet · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:11 pm Post subject:

I did not read this entire thread. People seem heated, though, so I'll throw in my 2 cents, because that's what TH is for(?)

Jim and the people at Osmun have done outstanding work for me on several occasions. Jim rebuilt my Mt. Vernon 236 and converted it to an Eb trumpet, better than any Eb I've played. This included blueprinting, valve rebuild, cutting slides and the bell, new bracing, all of it. The horn is unbelievable (and is living a better life now rather than a smaller bore C trumpet). I spoke with Jim at length about this project and was updated constantly. This was a major job with a rare instrument. Fantastic work.

Even when I need minor repair work done, if Wayne is unavailable (I live in NYC), it's worth shipping it up to Osmun.

In addition, Osmun uses reamers for mouthpiece alterations. This, obviously, is the correct way to do this. Yet, I have been shocked at the number of "reputable" brass shops who are using drill bits and substandard practices of altering mouthpieces. No one likes a ruined mouthpiece. Make sure your technician is using reamers and a lathe.

Jim is one of about 3 people I trust with my instrument. So, thanks Jim and Osmun! Hey... any publicity is good publicity, right? Keep it up.

sj

jadickson · Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:59 pm Post subject:

Here’s hoping that the moderators delete every post on this thread that is not about Osmun’s Blueprinting service. ( including this one )

By the way, I have used the blueprinting service several times and they do incredible work. It’s worth every penny.

tmensch · Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:59 am Post subject:

I sent a Callet C out for blueprinting. I am very happy and I will not hesitate to send additional horns to Jim/Osmum in the future.

Tom
_________________
Should have practiced more

JayKosta · Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:42 am Post subject:

It seems the best lesson from this is:

1) Always thoroughly clean the entire instrument before sending/taking it for service.
2) Make sure you are told and understand ALL the details about what is 'expected of' and 'will be done & cost' about the servicing.

Jay
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'.

jadickson · Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 5:33 pm Post subject: Osmun blueprinting

Last month, I had the opportunity to tour the Bach factory in Elkhart, after which I was able to select a Bb to buy. I was not sure what to expect from the “buy one from the factory” experience. I thought maybe I will find one of the mythical “good ones” that will just sound and play unlike any Bach I have tried at my local store. Or not. But I knew that I could, at least, pick out the best of the lot and then send it to Jim Becker at Osmun Music for his blueprinting service. And that is, indeed, what happened.

The horn selection experience. I spent about three hours trying horns. I did not mean to, it just kind of happened. Anyway, I did not pick one up that blew the rest away. I tried 180 and 190 series 37s and 43s, not being certain which model I wanted. After trying everything available, I felt discouraged because all of them played slightly differently, and none of them particularly great. I am referring to the blow / feel / response / ease of play. They were all either tight and not as responsive as I wanted, or really tight and not as responsive as I wanted.

So, since I obviously could not pick one based on those parameters, I decided to just pick the one with the sound I liked the most, no matter what model it was and no matter what the blow was like. I figured, Jim can fix the blow, but there is not much you can do with a horn if you don’t like the tone. This turned out to be a good strategy.
Eventually I figured out which model had the tone I liked the most. Then I found one that had particularly nice tone. I settled on a plain 180-37S. The Honda Civic of trumpets. I’m not sorry. It had the sound.

Before blueprinting. It took about a week for the horn to be shipped to me from the factory. When I received it, I gave it a closer inspection. For example, I checked the gap with the simple toothpick method. The gap was obviously smaller than the standard 1/8", so that would have to be corrected. I looked down the tubes and could see that the 2nd valve was out of alignment on the upstroke (you can look down the 3rd valve slide tube to see this).

But it still sounded good. I figured, if I like it this much while it has all these problems, I bet it will be amazing after the problems are corrected.

What Jim did. In order to correct the gap, a new receiver had to be installed. Something about how you cannot increase the gap with the old receiver because of how the pieces fit together. Valves were aligned. Solder boogers were removed from the interior of the tubes. Edges of the tubes were smoothed / de-burred. The turns in the bell crook were rounded -- apparently they flatten a bit, even though they are filled with the frozen soap before bending. The leadpipe venturi was checked but did not need to be corrected. Water key cork was replaced with a better one. Here is the data from Jim, which you can request from him after he blueprints your horn:

Valve alignment: #1 up +.010" down +.009... #2 up +.025" down +.011"... #3 +.007" -.006"
Bell crook out of round correction at bottom turn .013", top turn .021"
Original mouthpiece receiver gap: .079"
New mouthpiece receiver gap: .125"
Mouthpipe venturi: .3466"

Dialing in the tuning slide and water key screw. I have found that there are two variables that need to be “dialed in” for the individual player / mouthpiece, and I wish I knew this sooner. The first is the main tuning slide position. It affects more than just getting your horn in tune with a tuner. If the main tuning slide is in the right place, the horn comes alive. It responds with vibration and overtones on each partial. If the tuning slide is not in the right place, even by 1/16”, this will not happen.

The other variable is how tight the water key screw is. No kidding, try it. Make the screw very tight or very loose, and notice how it feels (and sounds) like you are playing a completely different instrument. For me, I find the optimal position by loosening the screw a lot, and then tightening it as much as I can with my fingers. I could get a 1/4" ratchet and tighten it down more, but that makes it respond really weirdly. “Finger tight” is perfect.

By the way, I installed brass valve guides (eBay) and that improved the tone too.

So how does it play? It is everything I was hoping for. It sounds as good as it did before, only much more so. It plays like I expect it to, from low to high, from piano to forte. It did not do that before. The resistance is just right. I don’t really know what else to say. I am not interested in trying or buying trumpets anymore. I’m done. This is the sound I have always had in my head. And it simply plays the way it should.

Final thoughts. Find a horn with the tone / sound that you like, and don’t worry if the blow / response isn’t great. Send it to Jim. A few hundred bucks is nothing compared to the time and money wasted trying to find “the one” by buying and selling production horns that all have problems. Problems that Jim could correct.

We need this service. I watched them put the Bach Strads together at the factory. It was not precision work, everything was “eye balled”. I did not see anyone measure anything. The result is very good horns, none of them great, each one playing and sounding slightly differently. Jim can give them the final adjustments needed to make them truly special.

I am sure that similar services provided by Charlie Melk or Josh Landress are also great. I simply chose to send my horn to Osmun music, and I would do it again without hesitation.
_________________
Justin Dickson
Middle school band director. Still learning.
www.BandmateTuner.com

James Becker · Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 8:47 am Post subject:

Thank you Justin Dickson for your kind words and for sharing your positive experience with our blueprinting services. It's stories like yours that make my job so satisfying.

I would like to take the opportunity to point out that we perform our PVA (precision valve alignment) and blueprinting services on all brands of trumpets/cornets/flugelhorns.

Today's PVA was a Schilke E3-L Eb/D trumpet. Here are the measurements prior corrections:

#1 up +.001" down +.004, #2 up +.011" down +.014", #3 up .000" down +.016"

Venturi measurement .3418"

Receiver gap .125" with my B&S 1 1/2C mouthpiece

Thank you all for your continued support, it is greatly appreciated.
_________________
James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com

Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US

kehaulani · Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 8:52 am Post subject:

Jim, just for discussion's sake, how does this apply to vintage horns? Does "blueprinting" have different connotations over time (like 50 year old instruments) and do you have exact specifications on old horns?
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

James Becker · Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 9:23 am Post subject:

Thanks kehaulani for asking. For something like a 50 year old trumpet I'd first perform diagnostics like our valve seal pressure test and measure for mouthpiece receiver wear. Older instruments will always have some measurable wear which must be addressed in order to restore them back to peak play ability.

After that I'd inspect for perturbations in the bore, i.e. measure valve port alignment, inspect for burrs and excess solder in slides, inspect the bell crook for any cross section constrictions. In other words, make sure any flaws or oversights in execution are identified and corrected. Though helpful to know the specifications of critical components, it is not always necessary to make improvement.

I hope this is helpful.
_________________
James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com

Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US

kehaulani · Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:26 pm Post subject:

Thanks, Jim.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird

Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet
Adams F-1 Flghn

Big Dave88 · Veteran Member Joined: 31 Mar 2011 Posts: 479

TrumpetMD · Posted: Mon May 27, 2019 8:21 am Post subject:

Irving · Heavyweight Member Joined: 11 Feb 2003 Posts: 1886

Big difference between after market car tweaking and Osmun's blue printing. Jim is claiming that blue printing means restoring instruments to original specs. I don't believe that blueprinting entails modifying the design of an instrument, while after market car tweaking involves mods of the factory specs. Now, Bach can't offer to produce instruments that closely follow original specs, since that would be an embarrasment on Bach's part. Bach is basically saying that for the price of one of our horns, this is as close as we can get it to original specs. If you want a horn that is more carefully built then send it off to Jim, or whoever else with the knowledge to do the work. Yes, Bach should be able and willing to build their horns more carefully, but they save money by not doing so.