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shal Regular Member
Joined: 07 Jan 2006 Posts: 32 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 2:40 am Post subject: How stock stainless steel valves trumpet ? |
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Hi,
These days, I prefer play with my Bach Bb.
So I want to stock my old and venerable Taylor London.
But this trumpet has equiped of Bauerfeind valves , so steel valves.
I have read here ( https://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=91763 ) that there is drawbacks with this kind of valves if you don't use it during long term,
Stock in dismantled state or inside the trumpet?
With oil , witout oil
Have you advise please ?
I will send a email to Mister Taylor in conjonction of yours advices _________________ Bb: Taylor London
Bach 37ml 1965
C: SchilBach (aka Bach 229L with Schilke modification)
Bugle: Kanstul 1525
Piccolo : Stomvi (first model as Maurice)
Mouthpiece : Prana B2S3 or artisan 1C or 1-1/2B or ... |
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Dennis78 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Feb 2015 Posts: 673 Location: Cincinnati
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:50 am Post subject: |
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Store the horn completely dry. No moisture and no oil _________________ a few different ones |
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Ed Kennedy Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Jan 2005 Posts: 3187
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 4:20 am Post subject: |
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As a repair tech I see many instruments, especially middle and high school instruments, that have been stored away over the summer break and all the valves and slides become frozen in place. that's very good for my income! I have a few band teachers who at the end of the school year, have a instrument cleaning party with students doing most of the work and the valves and slides are stored in ziplock bags with the instrument. They never have issues, just lube and reassemble when it is time. I would recommend the same for you if you plan to store it for a long time. |
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Ronnman Veteran Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2019 Posts: 404 Location: SE Louisiana
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 6:00 am Post subject: |
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Ed Kennedy is right on the mark.
Another reason to store separately is galvanic corrosion, although slight. The noble difference between the valve casing (Brass) and the valve piston (Stainless Steel) or (Nickel) sets up this corrosion. Any moisture in the mix will increase the corrosion rate. Basically, a very small voltage (milli-volt) is generated and causes the brass (least noble) to give up its molecules to the stainless steel or nickel. It would take a long time (years) for this to be visible, but it can occur.
See link to Corrosion Metal Chart below.
Depending on which stainless steel or nickel the manufacturer used, will determine the the corrosion factor. For instance, nickel and brass have greater difference than some stainless steels and brass in metal nobility, therefore will have greater corrosion rate.
Ron
https://imgur.com/gallery/BVJEqg0 - - > Just skip registration at the top right. _________________ Martin Committee #2 1954
Leblanc “Al Hirt” Model 1966
Olds Custom Crafted Ultra Sonic 1974
Edwards Gen II 2014
Last edited by Ronnman on Sat Mar 28, 2020 8:43 am; edited 1 time in total |
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shal Regular Member
Joined: 07 Jan 2006 Posts: 32 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 6:49 am Post subject: |
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Hi,
Thank for responses
For the link , remove the final dot : https://imgur.com/gallery/BVJEqg0
Ok, on theses confinement days , I have the time for clean the trumpet and disassemble it. For some weeks, months or years (How knows). _________________ Bb: Taylor London
Bach 37ml 1965
C: SchilBach (aka Bach 229L with Schilke modification)
Bugle: Kanstul 1525
Piccolo : Stomvi (first model as Maurice)
Mouthpiece : Prana B2S3 or artisan 1C or 1-1/2B or ... |
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Ronnman Veteran Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2019 Posts: 404 Location: SE Louisiana
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 8:44 am Post subject: |
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Shal - thanks, period deleted.
Ron _________________ Martin Committee #2 1954
Leblanc “Al Hirt” Model 1966
Olds Custom Crafted Ultra Sonic 1974
Edwards Gen II 2014 |
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Tony Scodwell Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2005 Posts: 1954
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:16 am Post subject: Stainless steel valves |
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I found that the Bauerfeind stainless steel valves on my early flugelhorns would indeed stick if not used for a couple of days. As I was playing regularly in those days it wasn't a huge problem but when my work dried up and the flugel sat unplayed for a few days, my remedy was to lightly coat the pistons with lanolin. I figured this was a good idea as Kanstul always sent new horns out to dealers like this and a simple wipe down and re-oiling the valves was enough to get going again. I hope this helps.
Tony Scodwell
www.scodwellusa.com |
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Beyond16 Veteran Member
Joined: 07 Jan 2020 Posts: 220 Location: Texas Gulf Coast
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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I have bought and repaired several vintage horns. Corrosion damage is often present, and from what I can tell the cause is putting the horn away with too much moisture left in. One had a corrosion circle on a valve and the cause looks like water had repeatedly pooled against the valve when stored.
Storing with no oil or grease sounds like a good idea, though I can't imagine either one doing serious damage to a horn without the help of moisture. Every time I finish playing I remove the mouthpiece before blowing out the water keys so that a can get a really good blow. I blow with both open and closed valves so all tubing gets a little air. Then I shake the horn. I know this helps because water droplets often come out the valve bottom caps. |
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B_Starry Heavyweight Member
Joined: 06 Jun 2002 Posts: 903 Location: Lake Norman
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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I have been disassembling horns and storing them for decades. The simplest solution is to empty the horn of condensation, swab it, and take out the valves and wrap them in paper towels, and store them in a plastic sandwich bag. Do the same with the slides.
Make sure the bottom caps are removed from the instrument and cleaned before storage.
No need for lanolin or slide grease on them, but I imagine it couldn't hurt. I just have never done it, and i have literally stored dozens of horns like this for many years.
When it is time to reassemble them, after cleaning with a microfiber cloth (clean/new!), simply oil and grease like you would normally do, and you will be good to go!
If you want to be overly cautious, then blow some valve oil through the instrument before disassembly, to "coat" the insides.
It is a good idea to disassemble any horn before storage, as I had a Schilke B6 whose second slide froze up on me before I started using this storage routine. _________________ do justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with God |
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LittleRusty Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 12647 Location: Gardena, Ca
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Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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I have found that, for me, Al Cass oil dries up and seizes the valves. This happens, for me, within days if the weather is hot and dry.
I bring this up as a reason to store the horn dry. |
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