Holton Cornet Sound

[jhatpro]

Can anyone describe the sound of the various Holton cornet models? I'd like to find out which ones are the darkest and which tend to be brighter.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

[Dennis78]

I have a few still and have had a few more. To me they’ve all sounded darker than compared to an old Blessing artist or a Bach cr310 and even my Chinese made BBB geared cornet.
The darkest? Probably my short model New Proportions
The brightest was the Stratodyne
All opinion though.
I play with either a Wick 4 or a Bach 5b
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a few different ones

[McH]

I have a Holton Charisma C555 cornet.

I use a Wick 4 and would say it definitely plays on the dark side when compared to my Getzen 300 or even my Getzen Custom 3850.

Again, just my opinion!

[jhatpro]

Thanks, guys! I asked because I got a little lockdown crazy and bought a couple of old Holtons on eBay. a 1938 Model 26 and a more recent vintage 29. Haven't received them yet but curious.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

[Brassman19]

Hi jhatpro-- I have a 1941 Deluxe version Model 29 Holton cornet (instead of it being all brass, it has nickel balusters, plus nickel tubing and accents at spots on the horn, in addition to the regular brass parts). My horn plays with a dark, sultry, smooth, sweet sound, and I feel it is possibly the finest-sounding cornet for playing jazz I have found to date. It's bore is perhaps a bit smaller than that of more modern cornets, but once you get used to its blow, and feel, it is pretty easy, and fun to play.

I don't know what size of mp you play on, but my regular size is a 1C, and with it I can get a large, and very full, but still controlled sound. Likely this model may be mp sensitive, so its sound and tone can probably also be made to vary some, depending on the size, depth, brand, etc., of the mp you use playing it.

I think you will like your Model 29. Have fun with it!
_________________
1954 Holton Super Collegiate Trumpet (Yellow brass w/nickel silver bell flare, like the Olds Studio model)
1961 pro Holton Galaxy Trumpet
Bach 1C mp (Trumpet,

[jhatpro]

Good to know, Brassman. Thanks!

I have a 1946 Blessing Super Artist (Muggsy Spanier bright), a 1955 Conn 80A (trumpet-like with a Curry DC short shank), and a Yamaha 6330 (Mellow with a short shank Yamaha 14E.)

When the Holtons arrive I’ll try those pieces plus some others including a Curry VC, Warburton 4XD, and Stork 3VC.

Someday, I’ll find the perfect combination. In the meantime I’ll just savor the quest!
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

[adc]

Probably just me. But I have never been impressed with any of the old holtons I have played.
_________________
Too many Old Cornets to Count

[jhatpro]

Hmm. I'll check in when min arrive.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

[jhatpro]

I think I hit the jackpot. The 1946;Model 49 is okay but the 1938 Model 26 Bb/A is dynamite! It had some cosmetic issues which I improved dramatically with a long soak in white vinegar and some Flitz and elbow grease.

I stretched the springs a little and changed out the corks and it plays great with excellent intonation and response. The lacquer is 98 percent gone which is fine by me - I prefer the raw brass look. Looks like my other horns are going to be sharing some playing time.

As for the 29, I think I’ll loan it to a neighbor kid who’s looking for a horn to try.
_________________
Jim Hatfield

"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus

2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle

[Dennis78]

So you have the Clarke model Holton cornet? Pretty much the same as the previous long model but without the shepherds crook. I’ve thought about getting one of those.
I have a very old version. The Couturier model New Proportions long cornet. Almost identical but with a shepherds crook and the last bend in the pipe before entering the valve comes more straight out
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a few different ones

[lewis]

I had, at one time, 5 antique Holton cornets, a 1914 "New Proportion Couturier Model," in Bb HP/LP, a Bb "Revelation" from about the same period HP/LP, a C/Bb/A Holton-Clarke HP/LP short model (the shepherd's crook version), and 2 long model Holton-Clarke Bb LP cornets, one of which is in pretty rough shape, and was intended to be a donor horn for repairs on the other. All except the donor horn play/played extremely well, and, in fact played better in tune than many modern trumpets. The Couturier and the short model Holton-Clarke each had a very mellow tone and the long model Holton-Clarke (1923) has a more modern, trumpet-like tone. I have used both the Couturier model and the long model Holton-Clarke on faculty and guest artist recitals (at ITG several times), and they are outstanding instruments. A few years ago I let the Couturier and the C/Bb/A Holton-Clarke go, because I simply was not using them any more, but the 1923 long model I am still using. If you want to use one of these Holton cornets, be aware that for the Holton company in the period up to about 1930, low pitch was not A=440 as some would have us believe, but more like A=435. This can be a significant problem on a cold day or in a cold hall, as it may be hard to shove the slides in far enough to get the horn up to A440. Nonetheless, I think the Holton cornets are among the finest playing of the antique cornets. And, after all, Rex Schilke learned his trade in the Holton factory!

HM Lewis

[Dennis78]

With or without a shepherds crook both the Couturier and Clarke were long model cornets. When a straight bell tail was added to the Clarke it didn’t make the other two short cornets it just changed model numbers. Holton did have at the time a New Proportions short model. I own one and it is a delight. As for tuning mine play a perfect A440. I also use period MP’s on both. I’ve also had good luck using a Wick 4 in the short cornet.
Holton made some bad ass brass! From the student model to pro-all exceptional quality
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a few different ones

[Uberopa]

I have a few vintage cornets, 1947, Conn 80a, L.A. Olds Ambassador, 1980 Benge 8Z. I have played a friend's Holton Clarke long model numerous times. Comparatively, theClarke has a very harsh sound to my ear. My personal experience.
Cheers

[OldSchoolEuph]

[Torbjörn]

I have a Holton Stratodyne Cornet 1954. I consider it hard to define. It’s a good player, and - as on any other cornet the mpc makes a big difference - it can be as bright as a trumpet, or dark and mellow. Still we haven’t become friends. I don’t really understand what it wants to say, so I cannot just follow it. And it is not too interested in what I want it to say either. We are probably just not meant for eachother...

Instead I spend my time with my Olds Recording whitch is so much easier to understand. It helps me, not corrects me, and sings so beautifully. I love it, and I believe it’s mutual.

The Recording has a rather odd construction, though. Doesn’t look like anything else I’ve seen: Opposite direction of airflow. Trigger on main tuning slide. Offset valve positions. And a massiv bell, thick as a churchbell.

It doesn’t have a crook, but still looks more like a short cornet than a long american cornet. Is there anybody out there who can tell whether it is a short, long, or niether of that cornet - just a Recording?

[OldSchoolEuph]

The Olds Recording cornet may be physically compact, but it is an American long cornet. The ergonomic (or so they say) valve arrangement, the convenient trigger, etc. are just unique features. They don't impact the long/short distinction. A long cornet has a faster taper to the leadpipe vs a short, and slower taper in the bell stem region vs a short model. The criticality of the arrangement, percentage, and taper of conicity to determining the character of the horn drives a visible clue in the placement of the typically large hire valves closer to the receiver than one finds on a short (where the leadpipe wraps around for length as it expands more slowly). Quite simply, the tapers of a long cornet, regardless of wrap, are closer to a trumpet - just with a bell structure and overall conicity that produces a darker, broader, warmer sound.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20

[Torbjörn]