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Martin Committee vs. Deluxe?


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Hugh Anderson
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:13 am    Post subject: Deluxe Reply with quote

James, does deluxe disqualify the horn from the committee sound? It still has the throaty bell.
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adagiotrumpet
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

intrepidpooch wrote:
The standard Committees had a heavier/thicker bell than the Deluxe models. I think that has a lot to do with the fact that the standard Committees tend to a have a warmer/darker sound than the Deluxe models. That said, being primarily a small group player I prefer that warmer, more vocal sound. The previous poster said he prefers the sound of the Deluxe and if I were a lead player trying to cut through a loud big band I probably would too (not saying that's what he does necessarily). However, I do play a good number of commercial and big band gigs and my standard Martin does just fine for those purposes (although not as good as my Schilke did).


Do any of the techs here on the forum want to confirm that the standard bells are "thicker/heavier" than the Deluxe bells?
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craigtrumpet
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always thought KD and Art sounded pretty darn good on their Deluxe's!





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Last edited by craigtrumpet on Tue Jun 30, 2020 5:56 am; edited 1 time in total
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craigtrumpet
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found this video of a guy "A-B'ing" the Deluxe and a Handcraft, these are obviously not quite the same but to my ear (and the majority of the YouTube comments) the Deluxe has the better and warmer/darker sound. So certainly the Deluxe model is not some bright horn more suited to lead playing. The Deluxe model has a warm dark sound that is perfect for small group jazz IMO.


Link

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"Run towards your problems, not from them"
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1947 Martin Committee
1956 Martin Committee Deluxe
1950's Couesnon Monopole Flugel
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shofarguy
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every time I've compared horns that have nickel parts to horns that are all brass, the same difference is evident to me. Nickel is "snappy" and brass is "lyrical." It's not so much a sound thing, but a tactile response.

I have a nickel tuning bit that fits in my flugelhorn and it changes the feel, making it... snappy. It's not a huge difference, but I can feel it. I let Harry Kim try it in his Kanstul Besson (which came with a brass tuning bit) and he liked it, because it gave him a more crisp response to his articulation and fingering of fast passages. I could hear the difference, if I paid close attention.

Years ago, Flip Oakes told me that he included nickel outer tubes on his Wild Thing trumpets because the bell made the horn dark enough and he wanted to brighten up the sound some. One the other hand, the very last horn Kanstul delivered to him was an ML version of the Inspiration concept done in all brass. It has a gorgeous sound and luscious response when paired with a deep-cup mouthpiece. I didn't realize the horn had no nickel until later when I studied the photos I took of it.

To me, nickel parts give a horn a different balance that might be beneficial, but they also introduce a certain tension, because of how they resonate.
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adc
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing about a Committee..and I am assuming the valve blocks may be the same in cornets and trumpets (I could be wrong) I have owned 3 committee cornets. Certainly the quality of the valves is on par or better than even good horns of today ....but...

I have played dozens and dozens of Cornets and when I play difficult and fast passages, Its more difficult on the committee. From the bottom position of a valve to even an 1/8"+ off the bottom the sound will not be clean..

Granted I am not a professional but I'm not bad. My Conn Concert Grand or my Strad has no such issues. Curious if others have noticed it. Again, bear in mind all Three of mine had had the same issue.

I can categorically say that a Committee Cornet is over-rated..if one expects it to be a Strad or Getzen (I owned a Capri) like.

Again..just my experiences.
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did the Deluxe come in Large and Medium Bore or just Large Bore?
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Goby
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The deluxe came in both bore sizes

most of the large bore committees are Deluxe models
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kehaulani
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Goby.
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improver
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To me the regular non deluxe is softer feeling and produces that dark amber. The deluxe is more brittle, tighter feeling, and more commercial. It sounds very different to me
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Goby
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I prefer the looks of the Deluxe committee (especially if you can find one in original lacquer!). The standard committee plays with a.darker sound to my ears, but can still light up like a Calicchio.
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mike ansberry
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a Deluxe medium bore. It was an okay horn, but I preferred my Super Recording so I sold it to another THer.
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craigtrumpet
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

craigtrumpet wrote:
I always thought KD and Art sounded pretty darn good on their Deluxe's!






I also found some black and white photos which make it a bit difficult to discern the color of the nickel tubes of a Deluxe from the brass tubes of a standard Committee. BUT you can make out the engravings on the bell which differentiate the two models.

Here is a pic of Chet Baker and the engravings on his bell are identical to the engravings on my Deluxe:



Here are some photos of Lee Morgan who's bell has similar engravings:





Also below is a video of my favorite living trumpet player, Scott Wendholt playing his Deluxe Committee and sounding amazing in a small group setting.


Link

Scott also uses his Deluxe Committee with the Village Vanguard big band, as well as on Broadway shows, which speaks to the versatility of the horn. Here he is holding his Deluxe when he played for the Tony's:



There may be some minute difference in sound between the standard Committee and the Deluxe, but to categorize the Deluxe as a kind of "bright zippy lead" horn is misleading. The Deluxe trim does not strip the horn of "the Committee sound." The fact that Chet Baker, Art Farmer, Kenny Dorham, Lee Morgan, etc. played Deluxe Committee's confirms that this horn is perfect for small group jazz and in fact embodies the Committee sound.
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Powell Custom Trumpet
1947 Martin Committee
1956 Martin Committee Deluxe
1950's Couesnon Monopole Flugel
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