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Your Favourite C


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Who makes your favourite stock production C trumpet?
Yamaha
37%
 37%  [ 23 ]
Bach
32%
 32%  [ 20 ]
Shires
6%
 6%  [ 4 ]
Schagerl
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
B&S
3%
 3%  [ 2 ]
Schilke
16%
 16%  [ 10 ]
Stomvi
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
Fides
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 62

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OldSchoolEuph
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Joined: 07 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

4 days in and Bach and Yamaha are tied - talk about mirroring the real world!

The sounds I have heard in symphonic settings that have impacted me the most have been played on Yamahas in recent years. In the chamber world, the players I respect the most, play Bach 229.

It is interesting that both companies use "Chicago", a reference to the famed Herseth and company Bachs, yet the "Chicago sound" historically is a French trumpet sound, the concept predating the orchestral migration to Cs, and harkening back to Besson (and Benge), not either of these two.
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Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1927 Conn 22B NYS
1957 Holton Model 27 Stratodyne
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson British Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20
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Dale Proctor
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Joined: 26 May 2005
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Location: Heart of Dixie

PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just temporarily broke the tie. Bach 239 ML, 25C leadpipe. Light sound, but a beautiful tone. Yeah, the D, Eb, and E in the upper part of the staff need alternate fingerings, but the horn plays so well I don’t mind.
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Olde Towne Brass
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Brass Band of Huntsville
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"Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham
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Trumpetingbynurture
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Joined: 18 Nov 2015
Posts: 706

PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OldSchoolEuph wrote:
4 days in and Bach and Yamaha are tied - talk about mirroring the real world!

The sounds I have heard in symphonic settings that have impacted me the most have been played on Yamahas in recent years. In the chamber world, the players I respect the most, play Bach 229.

It is interesting that both companies use "Chicago", a reference to the famed Herseth and company Bachs, yet the "Chicago sound" historically is a French trumpet sound, the concept predating the orchestral migration to Cs, and harkening back to Besson (and Benge), not either of these two.


It is quite interesting. I have noticed that many of the well-known C trumpet soloists are playing yamaha's... Hakan, Tine Thing Helseth etc.
And David Bilger, Tom Hooten etc are on yamaha's as well. So yamaha does seem increasingly to be edging Bach out of the market.

I heard LSO principal trumpet (David Elton) playing some Mahler on a yamaha C and his sound was possibly the most beautiful thing I've ever heard with my own two ears. Couldn't get that sound out of my head for days. How much that is just how Mr. Elton sounds and how much the Yammie was helping is anyone's guess, but it was quite something!
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Robert1
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Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have bled Bach for most of my adult life and professional career, to the point of being ridiculously biased. A couple of months ago, I had a Yamaha Chicago Generation III C Trumpet sent to me. I did not want to like it. I hoped and prayed that I would not like it. My hope and prayers were answered. I did not like it. I loved it. I am still biased toward Bach (My old 229 C is really in-tune, and amazing), but... the Yamaha Chicago Gen III C was just...better... better in everything. Better highs, better lows, soft, loud, and even the pitch is a little better. And the sound... forget about it. It's magnificent. It's glorious. So, when it was all said, and done... Yep... I kept my Bach. And also bought the Yamaha.
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Trombacan
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Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Posts: 94
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:17 pm    Post subject: fav c Reply with quote

Yamaha Chicago Gen 3
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wilder
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Joined: 27 Jun 2020
Posts: 85
Location: NYC

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

silverplated Bach largebore 229bell Hpipe. jw
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Steve A
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Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 1515
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that there's a facet of the eternal Bach vs. Yamaha debate that doesn't get remarked upon as regularly as it should (in view of how often this general discussion happens):

It's long been accepted that Yamahas are more even and easier to play, but that Bachs, despite their shortcomings in those areas, have the better sound. As an example, we give Herseth, or Phil Smith, or any of a long list of great players from the past who played Bachs. The thing is that Yamahas have kept getting better, both in playability and sound, whereas Bachs are still mostly what they always were (or less). The playability advantage of Yamahas remains uncontested, but many my favourite players of today that I use as sound models to emulate play Yamahas.

Yamahas were already better than Bachs in many areas, and they've made big progress where sound is concerned. They are maybe better on all notes, and their worst notes are certainly much better than the worst notes on most Bachs. I still play a Bach C, but I'm saving up for a Yamaha.
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ProAm
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Joined: 05 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a 1980 Bach 239 bell large bore with 25 leadpipe C that I tolerated. I put a Blackburn pipe & round tuning slide on it and loved it. Later I got a Blackburn C which was another level of good.

I did try a school-owned Chicago model Bach that a friend had. I was surprised at how well that horn played and how much I liked it. I wouldn’t mind having one of those.
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James Becker
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Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 2702
Location: Littleton, MA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not to steal anyone’s thunder, all instruments listed have wonderful attributes. I’d like to take the opportunity to remind folks about the transformational effects of our blueprinting service. I’ve lost track of the number of players that nearly gave up on their C trumpets, only to find many of their issues were mitigated by performing these services. It stands to reason if you could retain the sonic qualities of you C trumpet but make it easier to play why wouldn’t you? When pitch and response issues can be directly linked to perturbations in the bore, setting up your trumpet as close to it’s original design without these disruptions, it will play at it’s best.

And when pistons and mouthpiece receivers wear, reducing stability and efficiency, we can restore them to spec allowing your trumpet to play like new again.

I would like to add, all this can be done while maintaining it’s authenticity so it remains stock, only better executed.

Just some food for thought....
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James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com

Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US
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Voltrane
Veteran Member


Joined: 20 Jan 2006
Posts: 460
Location: Paris (France)

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I own a C Bach 239 ( also 238 but I do not use it a lot) and a Bb Xeno 8335RGS that I love a lot.
A little tired with the E and Eb of my 239 I tried a C Yamaha Chicago but I was disappointed : neither the feeling nor the sound of what I expect from a C Trumpet.
So I tried a Schilke C3 and that is a C horn!
As I am a Frenchman, it is possible I am biased toward light and bright sounding C trumpet!
I did not buy the Schilke because I am not sure the difference with my Bach worth 3500€!
That said if I were in the US I would certainly first try the Blue Printing before any investment.
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Crazy Finn
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Joined: 27 Dec 2001
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Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bach C trumpets are the reason I hate C trumpets.
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James Becker
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Joined: 02 Sep 2005
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Location: Littleton, MA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy Finn wrote:
Bach C trumpets are the reason I hate C trumpets.


The last Bach C trumpet I worked on was constricted by more than .020” at the bell ferrule. That along with valve alignment, de-burring and sizing slides went a long way to realizing it’s full potential. Just saying....
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James Becker
Brass Repair Specialist Since 1977
Osmun Music Inc.
77 Powdermill Road Rt.62
Acton, MA 01720
www.osmun.com

Our workshop is as close as your nearest UPS store https://www.ups.com/dropoff?loc=en_US
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