3rd Slide slow down and recovery?

cbtj51 · Posted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:15 pm Post subject: 3rd Slide slow down and recovery?

I am in the habit of oiling valves and slides at the beginning of every session. About 20 minutes into my practice, the 3rd slide on my Benge seemed to snag and remained sluggish thru the rest of use. I switched horns, finished my practice session then inspected the problematic slide. Nothing visible. I cleaned the slide and receiver top and bottom, male and female legs using a Brass Saver snake and warm water, applied Spacefiller TS reinserted and placed a few drops of Spacefiller Ultimate II, my usual mix. The slide functioned somewhat better, but not near as well as usual.

After many more inspections, cleaning and reapplication of lubrication and trial, the slide remained sluggish to the point that I finally took it to a local repair tech. The tech inspected, buffed, and tested several times finding nothing that could cause a problem, but slight improvement. Not wanting to remove more metal, the horn was returned to me. Not happy with the results, I repeated all of my earlier steps over the next several weeks with no improvement.

Then, I tried a different combination of lube, Spacefiller TS and Denis Wick with PTFE on a whim. Instant gratification! The slide performs extremely well, maybe better than ever! I will probably never know what the problem was, but it is fixed. Thank you Dennis Wick Valve Oil, my new slide lube, at least on that horn.

Anyone ever experience anything like this?

Mike
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'71 LA Benge 5X Bb
'72 LA Benge D/Eb
'76 Bach CL 229/25A C
‘92 Bach 37 Bb
'98 Getzen 895S Flugelhorn
'00 Bach 184 Cornet
'02 Yamaha 8335RGS
'16 Bach NY 7
'16 XO 1700RS Piccolo
Reeves 41 Rimmed Mouthpieces

deleted_user_687c31b · New Member Joined: 03 Apr 1996 Posts: 0

Not as extreme as you descrive it here, but the trigger valve on my Olds tended to 'get stuck' when extending too far, thus disallowing the spring to automatically retract it. After a good clean and some slide grease, it was simply sluggish and hard to move. And then I applied a drop of valve oil...it's as smooth as the valves themselves now. Grease + oil seemed to do the trick.

falado · Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:04 am Post subject:

Hi, Maybe one of the legs of the slide got bumped out of alignment?
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FA LA DO (Ab: V/ii) MUCS, USN (Ret.)
Stomvi VR (Reeves) with VR II Bell
Bach 239 25A C, Blueprinted
Bach 37, Early Elkhart, Blueprinted
Kanstul Flugel
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Besson Cornet

Ed Kennedy · Heavyweight Member Joined: 15 Jan 2005 Posts: 3187

cbtj51 · Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 7:24 pm Post subject:

dstpt · Heavyweight Member Joined: 14 Dec 2005 Posts: 1283

I have experienced things like this, but it's usually due to tiny bits of debris, sometimes almost naked to my eye, slipping into the area in question over time. Often, I know it's there, because there's no other logical explanation.

One thing I'm learning about using lapping compound (Ferree's): It likes to hide and then dislodge when you least expect it. I now use gentle nylon bottle brushes (from Amazon), Dawn dishwashing liquid, and with vigorous pumping action and lots of very warm running water. Then I use 99.9% isopropyl alcohol (just bought four big bottles from Amazon for ~$35) on lint-free cloths (or paper towels) and swab out inner legs (using basic cleaning rod) and repeat all of this process until no sign of lapping compound is on the cloth. I spent lots of time doing this today on a couple of horns. Then I heard from a brass tech about another product, Cold Cleaner, from Ferree's that I'll be checking out. (Strong warning label, btw.)

https://www.ferreestoolsinc.com/products/z10-cold-cleaner?_pos=1&_sid=ff69b214f&_ss=r

Question:
Is the Denis Wick valve oil with PTFE odor free? Just curious.

cbtj51 · Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 6:08 am Post subject:

delano · Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:28 am Post subject:

Funny, I never saw the lubing of a third slide as a fundamental.

Ronnman · Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 12:21 pm Post subject:

I had a similar 3rd slide sluggish operation. Cleaning (at home) several times did not resolve this issue. I was successful using pure lanolin and a drop of Hetman #3 valve oil. After application and use for a day or two, the slide started operating better than when I first received the horn. Now I can go for days, maybe a week, without needing any additional lubrication.

As mentioned in an earlier response, I attribute the difference to loosening some debris or breaking down a film causing the sluggish slide. This was on my LeBlanc with nickel plated slides.
Ron
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Martin Committee #2 1954
Leblanc “Al Hirt” Model 1966
Olds Custom Crafted Ultra Sonic 1974
Edwards Gen II 2014