Spare parts for Rudy Muck? Horror story!

[heritagear]

Greetings Fellow Trumpeters!
Can anyone suggest who or where may have any spares for a Rudy Muck 4M?
I bid and bought this horn from a UK country auction house called Liskeard Auctions BEWARE! Never use them.

The catalogue description was just a few words, "old trumpet in suitcase" so I asked for a condition report and they sent pictures that showed the bell engraving (just) so I could see "4m" and that it was a "Balanced model." The condition report said fair, but valves sticky.
I arranged shipping to me in London, UK. When I opened the package, inside was a (broken) clarinet...

When I called I was told, that I should not rely on the description as they do not know the difference between the two instruments (ie implying it's my fault). When I pointed out that they had sent me the pictures and details, I was told I had to send those back to them as they cannot keep check of all the emails.

They then said that not knowing the difference between the clarinet and trumpet and found the trumpet laying around after the sale, they sold it someone else; and then offered my money back and refund postage on the clarinet!

That was MY trumpet they sold! I threatened to sue for the VALUE of the Rudy Muck 4M. (Although I have no idea what it is actually worth - hopefully more than the £42, $58 I paid?) Lo and behold! Magically, they got the trumpet back from whomsoever they claimed to have sold it to. (With very rude note to me because of my threats).

When it eventually arrived - it was not in the condition seen on the initial photos they sent and upon which I relied to bid. The third valve is not just "sticky" but has been jammed into the cylinder - I think someone has forced the valve guide into the cylinder wall instead of carefully feeling it in; the third valve finger button is missing, all clearly shown in correct position on the photos. The water key springs are broken, and the third valve stop rod and locking nuts are missing.

I'm going to try suing them, but it will be tricky, as I have the instrument and there will be argument about the value of the missing parts.

SO Here's the thing - thanks for reading this far - does anyone have any idea where I might try to get the parts? Any likely repair shop who might have a damaged or broken horn that could be cannibalised?

Thanks in advance, your collective knowledge always astounds me....
Best wishes to all,
Stephen L.
_________________
Olds Super 1946; Besson 612, silver; Jupiter Pocket Trumpet; Jedson Bb/A, silver plate; YTR 6345S, YTR 6335; Besson "New Creation"; Roth Reynolds; Connstellation 28B. Learning again after 50 years break; soaking up knowledge...

[OldSchoolEuph]

First, I wouldn't throw good money after bad pursuing any further action with a crooked vendor. You wont get anything back as your "damages" are only what you put out before realizing its condition, not anything you spend after. Besides, you can be far more effective in print.

Muck horns are all different. Muck seems to have procured parts, and differing levels of assembly, from a multitude of sources. While some are complete Blessing Super-Artist stencils for instance (not this one), others can combine Blessing, York, Monke and even Bach parts all on the same horn.

So for the missing button for instance: you will need to post photos of a surviving one and see if anyone can recognize where it came from. For the stop rod, if the posts are Strad style, standard 5-40 rod will work. If they are the ball-end Blessing posts, then a Blessing stop rod (not sure what the thread is), if neither, then maybe have your tech make a 5-40 fit...

As for the piston: take that to someone who specializes in vintage horns or valves. There are many wrong ways to free it and only a few right ones (depending on the situation, often only one right one). The valve will probably then need work to address the cause and potentially consequences of how it got like it is.
_________________
Ron Berndt
www.trumpet-history.com

2017 Austin Winds Stage 466
1962 Mt. Vernon Bach 43
1954 Holton 49 Stratodyne
1927 Conn 22B
1957 Holton 27 cornet
1985 Yamaha YEP-621
1975 Yamaha YEP-321 Custom
1965 Besson Baritone
1975 Olds Recording R-20

[dr-pepp]

WOW! I know your post ends with the question of where to get parts, but since you included all the gory details of the transaction, you are inviting input on the whole deal. Sounds like you had multiple opportunities to walk away. I've had a few "great deals" that I pursued over the years and the MOST important thing to learn is WHEN TO WALK AWAY.

My good friend Fred Cirsena who used to own Quality Brass had a modest collection of Muck horns. I think he sold his inventory to Quinn the Eskimo but I'll see if I can get in touch with Fred and see if he has any old Muck parts horns that didn't get sent to Quinn.
_________________
Clay Collins
Owner, Centex Brass
www.centexbrass.com
also administrator of Olds Central
www.olds-central.com

[heritagear]

Thanks, Chaps, much appreciated.
I feel committed now as it all seemed OK when I actually bought it. I can't seem to see any other 4m Balanced models around to buy or compare, so I am kidding myself it must have a rarity interest. Not like the Selmer Balanced, but maybe as near as I'll get and I would like to give it blow.
Really interest to see if those old R. M. parts might still be around and I'll follow your other suggestions with a picture of the surviving buttons.
So kind.
Best,
Stephen L.
_________________
Olds Super 1946; Besson 612, silver; Jupiter Pocket Trumpet; Jedson Bb/A, silver plate; YTR 6345S, YTR 6335; Besson "New Creation"; Roth Reynolds; Connstellation 28B. Learning again after 50 years break; soaking up knowledge...

[TriumphantTrumpeter]

Not sure if you are still looking but it might be worth giving Brian Robson at Nightingale Trumpets in Yorkshire a call.

I recently bought a beautiful Rudy Muck 7M from him and I believe he has not only a couple of 4M's but also another 7M and a 5M that he may be willing to part with and he also may have spares for your own 4M and, if not, I am sure that he wouldn't be averse to taking on the job of repairing it for you.

[heritagear]

Thanks for this really interesting tip!
I have since had the horn repaired and re-lacqured by the brilliant Peter Lacey of West London Brass Repairs (he does all my trumpet works), but am still missing the main slide stop-rod and nuts.
I'll follow this up.
Very grateful
Stephen L.
PS How much did you have to fork-out for the 7M; if that is not an impertinant question?
_________________
Olds Super 1946; Besson 612, silver; Jupiter Pocket Trumpet; Jedson Bb/A, silver plate; YTR 6345S, YTR 6335; Besson "New Creation"; Roth Reynolds; Connstellation 28B. Learning again after 50 years break; soaking up knowledge...